Psycokinesis

My, my. Respect is such a fleeting commodity in your circle.

Oh, well. Such is life. :)

In my circle, people who make claims also offer evidence.

Another way we two differ.

Banshee,

You, and others, make the claim, here and elsewhere, that psychokinesis is real --that it exists in some way unbeknownst to Science, unbeknownst to the brightest, sharpest minds the planet has ever hosted.

Don't you think that it is incumbent upon those, such as yourself, who claim that psychokinesis exists to prove to us skeptics that it actually does.

If psychokinesis really does exist, everyone should be able to see people like you actually demonstrating psychokinetic, wordly effects.

That is, unless you are selfishly motivated to horde the secrets of psychokinetics, keeping them to yourself, for the special status you can derive from people easily convinced that you are one of the only persons around to possess the really neat stuff that lots of us other people might also wish to have.

To deny us the true operational secrets of psychokinesis might lead us to suspect that claiming psychokinetic abilities is merely a fabrication of personal vanity.

If you are really as unselfishly altruistic as you would like us to believe, you should share the confirmable secrets of psychokinesis with all of us.

Allow us to be special, too.
 
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Telepathy is in all of us:we just need to enhance it.

hi,

i saw this one on discovery,loooooong time back.

an experiment was conducted with a group of students in New Jersey(i think so,although i am not sure).several photgraphs were arranged in a presentation,some of them were disturbing(one of them was of a raped girl:mad: )all students had to do was click and photo will apear,click and another.

while clicking their brain activity was studied.(there were about 170 students i think).it was found that just about a microsecond before a disturbing photo was about to be displayed on the screen,the brain activity increased multiple folds(in 95% cases) and was showing signs of anxiety.??doesnt that mean that brain already has telpathic powers,we just need to enhance them.
 
Banshee correct me if i am wrong:

Mr.G,
I really don't think Banshee cares wheather or not you believe her. So if you care to find out what this evidence is, find it yourself.

My, my. Respect is such a fleeting commodity in your circle.
Click to expand...

No.... My,My Mr. G... Respect seems to be a fleeting commodity in your circle.

You provoke all of it Mr. G. You need to respect us.
 
Tristan,

<<...care to find out what this evidence is, find it yourself...>>

One of the best sources for information is Experts. Now that that avenue has been demonstrated not to exist, indeed I must resort to finding it myself.

If there is anything to be found I'll let you know so that you can be an Expert, too. That's usually the way it works: those with information share it with those that don't. ;)
 
STOP ACTING LIKE CHILDREN

All of you (except zion), banshee, tristan, mr. g, stop it NOW. We're talking about psychokinesis, not how nice we are to one another. Respecting other members isn't a required field of sciforums (at least to my knowledge).

That was some good info zion. I saw something with Leonard Nimoy testing a bunch of kids with those psychic cards, a few of them did well but most of them were fairly bad.

Right now (for me) it's kind of an on-off thing, sometimes I'll be able to predict what people are about to say (my hopefully future girlfriend said that sugar ray was a good band the same time I was thinking it), sometimes I won't. I think today's one of the better days, I just played a sp game of starcraft and clicked on every building the second before it was finished. With some of those no matter how many times you play the game you can't subconsciously time when they'll be finished.
 
Okay, I've mentioned to Banshee before my thoughts on Telekinesis.

My thoughts are that for it to exist takes equipment of a technological enhancement of something that we wouldn't actually have. Of course this assumption would mean anyone displaying a "Natural" gift of telekinesis is actually someones labrat. This is most notibly so when the individual outputs information that corresponds to its existance but is sketchy on the reasoning why it occurs.

As for what Zion mentioned of Images showed to assistant "guinea pigs", the study I would guess would be refering to E.S.P. (Extra Sensory Perception). Of course there is another angle I'm going to add that wont have been mentioned "How to build an efficent Neural network!"

Okay so people are going to be wonder how can I leap from E.S.P. studies to that or a Neural Network, in the lines of Artificial intelligence. Well Neural networking doesn't necessarily just span A.I. creation as there are other types of Knowledge engineering.

For those of you that don't know what Neural Networking is heres a brief description:

A number of computers (and processors) are linked through networks, and an information process is sent to more than one machine. If for instance a simple question was answered with a Yes, A No, or a Can't answer, the system will check all of the alternative answers at the same time, and which ever incorrect answers occurs are removed. (A bit like how weaknesses die out through the evolution of life, taking it's many paths to work out which one is strongest).

Of course when the information is shifted around such a system it can create a Fractalised Algoryth, which can be used in reprocessing the information again after small changes have been made.

I mention this because it's based upon how the human brain can associate or disassociate algorythms. An E.S.P. study is pretty much looking for a natural occurance of such fractalised algorthyms within the human mind, which can spawn some preminition of what image was to be shown. (A colour, a smell, a memory, a feeling or a clue to the image itself before it's shown)

The same system could be encompassed with the use of RF (Radio Frequency) arrays to produce Telekinesis with the use of electromagnetic fluctuations. (This is what I originally mentioned to Banshee) With such an algorythm running it would be possible to cater for weight, direction of momentum, shape to name a few things. (Personally though I would prefer not to bother attempting it as to control something like that could lead to accidents if I wasn't careful.)

[Edit]
I noticed something that I missed that Zion mentioned his theory of Alpha/Beta brainwave patterns, one that is noted also is the Theta wave, this is one that was most commonly the cause of Psychosis (hallucinations, paranoia etc)

I have the suspicion that some of the Wavelengths are used in conjunction of running functions throughout the body like breathing, beating the heart etc. So some are hazardous to mess with. I shall find more info on the subject for you Zion.
 
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Zion and Stryder, thank you for your replies.
You both explain it very well, espacially what Zion said.

So Mr. G. you have your evidence without doing a thing for it. Are you happy now?

As far as the gift of Psychokinesis concerns, it is a dangerous gift you don't use like that for it has a will of its own.
You have to have very good control over it and never ever may use this ability against other humans.

Why do you want to see it so bad?

You have the same abilities within yourself, but because you are so skeptical about all these Psychic abilities I doubt it that you ever will explore them.

Never ever shall I on command give a 'show', only for the disbelieve of another human. Really never.

I am not a freak from a freakshow who has to show her abilities on purpose.

Psychokinesis is really a strong power, it has a will of its own. Sometimes when I am very angry it goes by itself.
You think that is funny??
Well it is not. Nor was my younger life in which my own father told me at the age of 4 years old that I was posessed by the devil (very christian my parents) because I didn't even know what was going with me then. It has been a long and hard way to get good control over this particular power.

Never ever shall I use this power only because of the disbelieve by some other human(s).
 
Edited for formating issues

Part A:

In search of provable, reproducible scientific evidence of Psychokinetic effects:

Excerpted, some highlights added, from:

Correlations of Random Binary Sequences with
Pre-Stated Operator intensions: A Review of a 12-Year Program

R. G. Jahn, B. J. Dunne, R. D. Nelson, Y. H. Dobyns, and G. J. Bradish
Princeton Engineering Anomalies Research (PEAR) School of Engineering and Applied
Science, Princeton University

Abstract - Strong correlations between output distribution means of a variety of random binary processes and pre-stated intentions of some 100 individual human operators have been established over a 12-year experimental program. More than 1000 experimental series, employing four different categories of random devices and several distinctive protocols, show comparable magnitudes of anomalous mean shifts from chance expectation, with similar distribution structures. Although the absolute effect sizes are quite small, of the order of 10 -4 bits deviation per bit processed, over the huge databases accumulated the
composite effect exceeds 7s (p » 3.5 ´ 10 -13 ). These data display significant disparities between female and male operator performances, and consistent serial position effects in individual and collective results. Data generated by operators far removed from the machines and exerting their efforts at times other than
those of machine operation show similar effect sizes and structural details to those of the local, on-time experiments. Most other secondary parameters tested are found to have little effect on the scale and character of the results, with one important exception: studies performed using fully deterministic pseudorandom sources, either hard-wired or algorithmic, yield null overall mean shifts, and display no other anomalous features.
 
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Part B:

....The purpose of this article is to present a major body of new data that bears on this issue, acquired over twelve years of experimental study of anomalous human/machine interactions, conducted in an engineering laboratory context. Specifically, these studies have searched for possible correlations between the output data distributions of various random binary processes and the pre-stated intentions of attendant human operators. The history of this laboratory program, details of its instrumentation, protocols, data reduction and interpretation techniques, its attempts to model the observed effects, and the possible implications of the results for various regimes of basic science and technical applications have been described elsewhere 34-38]. Here we shall focus only on the empirical results and their individual and collective statistical merit.

....IV. Secondary Correlations

A. Gender-Related Effects
Segregation of the total REG database described above into male and female operator components reveals several striking disparities. As evident in Figure 4, although three of the female operators have produced the largest individual z-scores, the overall correlations of mean shifts with intention are much weaker for the females than for the males. In fact, while a majority of the males succeed in both directions of effort, most of the females’ low intention results are opposite to intention. Specifically, some 66% of the male operators succeed in separating their overall HI and LO scores in the intended direction, compared to only 34% of the females. In other words, there is some indication that the total operator performance distribution has three components: a) three outstanding female datasets; b) 38 female datasets indistinguish-able from a chance distribution; and c) 50 well-distributed male datasets compounding to significant positive performance. Many other aspects of the gender-related disparities are detailed in Ref. [41].
.
...E. Operator Strategy and Psychological Correlates
Although no systematic assessment of any of the multitude of potentially relevant psychological parameters characterizing the operators has been attempted, on the basis of informal discussions, casual observations of their styles, occasional remarks they record in the experimental logbooks, and our own experiences as operators, it is clear that individual strategies vary widely. Most operators simply attend to the task in a quiet, straightforward manner. A few use meditation or visualization techniques or attempt to identify with the device or process in some transpersonal manner; others employ more assertive or competitive strategies. Some concentrate intently on the process; others are more passive, maintaining only diffuse attention to the machine and diverting their immediate focus to some other activity, such as glancing through a magazine, or listening to music. We find little pattern of correlation of such strategies with achievement. Rather, the effectiveness of any particular operational style seems to be operator-specific and transitory; what seems to help one operator does not appeal to another, and what seems to help on one occasion may fail on the next. If there is any commonality to be found in this diversity of strategy, it would be that the most effective operators tend to speak of the devices in frankly anthropomorphic terms, and to associate successful performance with the establishment of some form of bond or resonance with the device, akin to that one might feel for one’s car, tools, musical instruments, or sports equipment.
 
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Part C:

....VI. Replicability Requirements

From time to time, the experiments reported here have been assessed, both formally and informally, by a number of critical observers, who have generally agreed that the equipment, protocols, and data processing are sound [49]. Frequently, however, the caveat is added that such results must be “replicated” before they can be fully accepted, with the replication criteria variously defined to require strict preservation of all technical and procedural details, or to allow more flexible similarities in equipment and protocols. It is our opinion that for experiments of this sort, involving as they clearly do substantial psychological factors and therefore both individual and collective statistical behaviors, to require that any given operator, on any given day, should produce identical results, or that any given operator group should quantitatively replicate the results of any other, is clearly unreasonable.

....IX. Summary

"The extensive databases described above, comprising more than 1500 complete experimental series generated over a period of 12 years in rigid tripolar protocols by over 100 unselected human operators using several random digital processors, display the following salient features:

1. Strong statistical correlations between the means of the output distributions and the pre-recorded intentions of the operators appear in virtually all of the experiments using random sources.

2. Such correlations are not found in those experiments using deterministic pseudo-random sources.

3. The overall scale of the anomalous mean shifts are of the order of 10 -4 bits per bit processed which, over the full composite database, compounds to a statistical deviation of more than 7s (p » 3.5 ´ 10 -13 ).

4. While characteristic distinctions among individual operator performances are difficult to confirm analytically, a number of significant differences between female and male operator performance are demonstrable.

5. The series score distributions and the count population distributions in both the collective and individual operator data are consistent with chance distributions based on slightly altered binary probabilities.

6. Oscillatory series position patterns in collective and individual operator performance appear in much of the data, complicating the replication criteria.
==================================================
 
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Part D:

Principle authors' biographical information: Robert G. Jahn and, less so, Brenda J. Dunne:

Biographical information
Biographical information
Biographical info posted on weather modification-related site
Paper abstract -- Subjectivity in Science
Paper abstract -- Echos and Oum
Patent: http://164.195.100.11/netacgi/nph-P...s1='5830064'.WKU.&OS=PN/5830064&RS=PN/5830064
Book
Business owned by principal authors and others.
("software for $55.95 that allows you to influence which of two images will be displayed on your computer screen. ...a device for $425 that lets you do your own testing of mental influence of randomized outputs.")
Links to other papers authored by principal authors and others
==================================================
After actually having read the research results as published, and also the various linked items, are there any recognizable trends across those linked resources that might influence our interpretation(s) of the stated conclusions of the research itself?

Should the reader, taking into consideration the expenditure of money and man-hours necessary to obtain the still scientifically debatable results of the above referenced research, contrast the degrees of difficulty and relative success of that reseach with the economical, less rigorous claims of psychokinetic powers being made here, in these fora, by others?
 
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kinda wordy isn't it mr. g?


Could you condense it into a few sentences? I read the first paragraph and had no idea what they were talking about.
 
Banshee,

One of the things about rigor is that after a while everyone's smells the same.

:D

So, okay, the Ciffnotes version for you:

Some really smart people, working for Princeton University, spent 12 years and a bunch of money conducting psychokinesis- (btw, now days it's called Anomolous Perturbation) related research.

What they found was what they themselves think is an ever so slightly-better-than-chance probability of psychokinetic anomolous perturbation having been observered, but even they can't be sure.

What they are more confident of is that, if psychokinesis is real, males are statistically better at in than females.

So I was wondering aloud why you think those very smart, educated people, working for 12 years in search of inarguable evidence of psychokinesis in action (something they really, really would like to find) still haven't found it, yet you have?

Perhaps you will send your name and address to them so that they may test you.
 
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Mr. G has a point. The point for lay persons looks like this:

Any technology, process, methodology, idea, theory, speculation not produced by a bunch of so called educated people toiling in an University Laboratory for many years, does not exist.
 
If Kmguru is right about Mr. G, then many scientific studies that have been conducted outside of a university Campass that have been noted within the academic community none the less for the studies being apart of someones Nobel prize, would make those discoveries null and void.

Just to prove my point:

Mr. G, "does you car have square wheels?"
If you don't have a car, just remember that if you have a car or a bike, or get on a bus, your putting yourself behind the marvel of something invented by a "Lay person" before universities existed, and perhaps it just started with the accidental discovery of watching something roll.

(Of course Mr. G I'm not intending for this to offend you as that's not the purpose.)
 
Just for the record, I studied for years at the University also.
Does that make me well educated and scientifical thinking?
No it doesn't, for I (well educated) don' t need proof for the existance of certain matters I know sure of they exist.:p :p

Scientists and their inventions.;)

Oh, lets keep good control over everything, because otherwise they get lost and don't know how to live their lifes in balance with other humans, Earth, Nature and its inhabitants.
Explore everything well you scientists, so you have a good explanation how 'things' work.

And if they can't find an explanation, it just doesn't exist??

Pretty arrogant. What about for instance the disappearrances in the Bermuda Triangle???
Never had a scientific explanation for that. But it happened (happens) and nobody knows how and what. They tried to come up with explanations, those scientists, but they have nothing to relie on, totally nothing.

Well Mr. G. because of you being so well educated, give me your explanation and lets get back to the original thread then, we are wandering of in a whole different direction....:)
 
kmguru......check out my threads more and talk in them....Plz!
Mr. G has a point. The point for lay persons looks like this:

Any technology, process, methodology, idea, theory, speculation not produced by a bunch of so called educated people toiling in an University Laboratory for many years, does not exist.
Click to expand...


Tee heheehehehehhehehe. Nice one! ehhehe
 
<<...Hahaha. Didn't even read it...>>

<<...kinda wordy isn't it mr. g? Could you condense it into a few sentences? I read the first paragraph and had no idea what they were talking about...>>

<<...speculation not produced by a bunch of so called educated people toiling in an University Laboratory for many years, does not exist...>>

<<...I (well educated) don' t need proof...>>

<<...Pretty arrogant....Bermuda Triangle...it happened (happens) and nobody knows how and what...nothing to relie on, totally nothing...>>

<<...Tee heheehehehehhehehe. Nice one! ehhehe..>>

:rolleyes:

No wonder intellectualism scares you. Everything does.

<<...The most important weapon in the war for economic supremacy in the 21st century will be the organization of knowledge - Alvin Toffler...>>

Tee hehehehehehehehehehehehehe. ;)

What is Science if not Knowledge?
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahaha!!!!!

And you can't use it!

Hehehehehe.

Now, just leave me alone. I'm listening to the Universe now, using my heart, and it's what I'm feeling. That makes it real. You can trust me on this.

:D
 
Hi guys,

I must say the evidence appears to be on Mr. G's side in this thread. Surely if anybody actually has psychokinetic powers they would be easy to demonstrate? Why not collect the $1 million? Donate it to charity if you don't want to profit.

Oh, and just in case you think it is uncollectable, be aware that the conditions of a fair test are agreed between the testers and test subjects for each potential claimant of the money, prior to the test. If the potential claimant does not agree in advance that the test is fair, it will be negotiated until fairness is achieved for all parties. Yet, strangely, nobody has claimed the money so far.

What about for instance the disappearrances in the Bermuda Triangle??? Never had a scientific explanation for that. But it happened (happens) and nobody knows how and what. They tried to come up with explanations, those scientists, but they have nothing to relie on, totally nothing.
Click to expand...

This is off-topic again, but I feel compelled to comment.

The Bermuda Triangle is one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world. Statistically, there are no more disappearances in the triangle than anywhere else, once you take the volume of shipping into account. By the way, I seem to remember reading about the recent recovery of the planes from the triangle that started the whole "mysterious" Bermuda triangle thing. It seems they ran out of fuel and crashed into the sea.
 
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