what defines marriage?

[phlogistician]

i don't believe in god because i'm religious.

Believing in God makes you religious.

do you even know what a ritual is?

Weak attempt at diversion Lori. Marriage ceremonies are well documented. Proving you wrong.

it's not contradictory, and i've addressed this in many previous posts. in fact i've pointed out that my past behavior, and the effect it had on me, was what led me to seek god in the first place.

Yes it is contradictory. By your own standards you are still married to one of the guys you've previously had sex with! Do you not understand that saying your standards only apply now is rather weak and self serving?

no i'm not. the whole purpose of christ is to restore humanity's communion with god, and once that happens, all of these rituals and ceremonies and religions will be traded in for the real thing.

Yes you are just making shit up.

that's easy for you to say, but too difficult for you to live.

Lori, try making sentences that make sense.

there are other spirits besides the holy spirit.

ROFL! So you are saying God didn't talk to him? If you can dismiss his testimony so easily, can you understand why yours isn't convincing either?

 

[Lori_7]

Believing in God makes you religious.



Weak attempt at diversion Lori. Marriage ceremonies are well documented. Proving you wrong.

i am the living word of god. it is my life. my life is not a ritual, or a ceremony, or a religion.

marriage ceremonies are documented because they are long standing traditions of mankind. and a ceremony, by it's own definition, has no meaning, in and of itself. it is a ritual that is supposed to represent something that is meaningful.

the relationship between christ and his church is described as a marriage. do you think we'll all stand on an altar together, recite vows, and have cake? it is actually represented symbolically by the communion ritual that catholics practice where we become "one in the flesh" with christ.

drinking wine and eating crackers in church isn't going to do that.

Yes it is contradictory. By your own standards you are still married to one of the guys you've previously had sex with! Do you not understand that saying your standards only apply now is rather weak and self serving?

no i don't, and i've explained why already. you just don't like my answer.

Yes you are just making shit up.

it's the entire point of the bible.

Lori, try making sentences that make sense.

it did make sense. you want to equate god with religion, because as long as you can find something wrong with religion, you can deny god. it's a paradigm. i'm telling you that god is not religion.

ROFL! So you are saying God didn't talk to him? If you can dismiss his testimony so easily, can you understand why yours isn't convincing either?

no. it's a matter of the fruit of the spirit, which the bible goes into in depth.

 

[christa]

how about we all say screw it, go bi, and just live together! hahaha

 

[(Q)]

This is a Tu quoque argument, an not valid justification.

Then, don't use that argument with me.

this is an unfair attack, as being religious may or may not correlate to having morals or empathy. Some religious peoples are amoral assholes, but all of them are not. I dislike Abrahamic religions in part because they *teach* followers to desire god and heaven more than family and the life they have; to abandon family in the name of evangelism. But this doesn't mean that most followers actually do that.

Hence, we are left with the hypocrisy of their belief system, which they themselves don't even follow but threaten us with all the time. No morals. None.

IMO, you are attacking the followers for the faults that exist in what they follow. Faults which have been hidden from them because of it's negative nature - most christians like their religion because of its statements of love and forgiveness; values I also appreciate. They have no clue about the bad stuff, because priests don't write sermons on the bad stuff.

And of course, when anyone produces the "bad stuff" it gets ignored or is blatantly refused as even existing. Again, no morals.

Lori has not said that people are horrible and that evil things should be done to them...

Sure she has, most emphatically.

 

[(Q)]

i am the living word of god.

Sure, when it suits your purposes, the rest of the time you pretty much do whatever you want despite your god. You made that evident in the OP.

 

[river-wind]

Believing in God makes you religious.

I don't know about this one. Belief in $diety makes you spiritual (i.e., belief in 1 or more non-tangible spirits), but religion requires a dogma. If you believe in $diety, but follow no dogma, I think you can fairly be said to be non-religious.


edit: I would say also, however, that if you don't follow a standard religion but create your own dogma (Truth) from which you cannot divert, you may be alone in your religion of one, but you are still in one - and are therefor religious.

 

[phlogistician]

i am the living word of god.

WOAH! Check out YOUR EGO!

it is my life. my life is not a ritual, or a ceremony, or a religion.

Believing in God makes you religious, period. Stop twisting words for your convenience.

marriage ceremonies are documented because they are long standing traditions of mankind. and a ceremony, by it's own definition, has no meaning, in and of itself. it is a ritual that is supposed to represent something that is meaningful.

Horse SHIT. You are making stuff up again.

the relationship between christ and his church is described as a marriage. do you think we'll all stand on an altar together, recite vows, and have cake? it is actually represented symbolically by the communion ritual that catholics practice where we become "one in the flesh" with christ.

Nope. The ritual is a necessary part.

no i don't, and i've explained why already. you just don't like my answer.

I don't like your answer because it's hypocritical.

it's the entire point of the bible.

Nope. Just your twisted, interpreted for your own convenience view of it.

it did make sense. you want to equate god with religion, because as long as you can find something wrong with religion, you can deny god. it's a paradigm. i'm telling you that god is not religion.

Belief in God makes you religious. YOU ARE RELIGIOUS. I don't quite understand why you try and escape that label, and what it means to you exactly, but you are religious.

And of course I can deny God, because I have yet to have anybody present a logical argument for God. You are irrational. You are a hypocrite. You do not present good arguments for God. Your God is clearly a mental condition. I have presented evidence that God can be recreated in the lab, but you won;t accept that. Why do you need God to be real?

no. it's a matter of the fruit of the spirit, which the bible goes into in depth.

The only 'fruit' here is fruitcake. You. Peter Sutcliffe said God told him to murder prostitutes. God tells you stuff too. You are no more sane than he. What don't you understand about that?

 

[NMSquirrel]

Believing in God makes you religious, period. Stop twisting words for your convenience.

you don't have to be religious to believe in god.
religiousness is for mans benefit,not gods.
do you really think god cares about how we are dressed ?
do you think ppl are favored more by god just cause they can act holy?
do you think a ritual will appease god? (if so do you know the ritual that makes him send me some money? pm me..)

Nope. The ritual is a necessary part.

but then again there is the element of focus..being with a group of likeminded believers, helps to keep your focus on god.
with most organized religions today, their focus tends to be whatever brings more ppl in. if it is the ritual ppl want they will give it to them..when the focus is on the ritual,it is not on god.

Belief in God makes you religious. YOU ARE RELIGIOUS. I don't quite understand why you try and escape that label, and what it means to you exactly, but you are religious.

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

And of course I can deny God, because I have yet to have anybody present a logical argument for God.

how are you looking?

You are irrational. You are a hypocrite. You do not present good arguments for God. Your God is clearly a mental condition.

there it is...
you cite lori with three opinions, then equate that to god..
its like your saying she is not supposed to be messed up...she's christian..
so if she is messed up that makes god messed up...?!?

The only 'fruit' here is fruitcake. You. Peter Sutcliffe said God told him to murder prostitutes. God tells you stuff too. You are no more sane than he. What don't you understand about that?

i searched for 'god's voice'..3 verses came up.. two comparing his voice to loud thunder..one in revelations..

lori..this one is for you..i looked up 'god told me'
(click at your own peril phlo..)

 

[Lori_7]

squirrel,

i know it makes some people feel uncomfortable when i say "god told me". but i believe that god has a spirit that can communicate with us, and it does with me. sometimes it's a voice in my mind, that is very real and conversational. sometimes it is an impression. sometimes god uses different media. but it's the meaning found that makes it god given, or communicated.

 

[Lori_7]

WOAH! Check out YOUR EGO!

when god speaks, stuff happens. to attribute the manifestation that is your life to god...you think there's a consideration made for your ego? it can actually be quite a bloody battle.

Believing in God makes you religious, period. Stop twisting words for your convenience.

twisting words?

my life is NOT a ritual, or a ceremony, or a religion. it is a gift from god.

Horse SHIT. You are making stuff up again.

no, the abolition of sin through a messiah is actually what the bible's about.

Nope. The ritual is a necessary part.

you realize that saying that makes you seem unintelligent right?

I don't like your answer because it's hypocritical.

me testifying to learning valuable lessons the hard way is hypocritical?

Nope. Just your twisted, interpreted for your own convenience view of it.

no. no way. restored communion with god through christ is the entire point of the bible from start to finish. nothing about it is convenient.

Belief in God makes you religious. YOU ARE RELIGIOUS. I don't quite understand why you try and escape that label, and what it means to you exactly, but you are religious.

And of course I can deny God, because I have yet to have anybody present a logical argument for God. You are irrational. You are a hypocrite. You do not present good arguments for God. Your God is clearly a mental condition. I have presented evidence that God can be recreated in the lab, but you won;t accept that. Why do you need God to be real?




The only 'fruit' here is fruitcake. You. Peter Sutcliffe said God told him to murder prostitutes. God tells you stuff too. You are no more sane than he. What don't you understand about that?

i didn't need god to be real, and you can't recreate what god has done to me in a lab. it's the meaning of my life, that you think you're controlling or creating with your instruments in a lab? delusions of grandeur.

 

[phlogistician]

you don't have to be religious to believe in god.

You have it backwards. Believing in God is religion.

religiousness is for mans benefit,not gods.

Then what are the ten commandments all about?

do you really think god cares about how we are dressed ?

According to the Old Testament he exactly does.

do you think ppl are favored more by god just cause they can act holy?

Well, as the bible states 'the chosen people' will be saved, if you truly believe in God, you should think exactly that.

do you think a ritual will appease god? (if so do you know the ritual that makes him send me some money? pm me..)

Well, as God has demanded modes of behaviour from humans, allegedly, if you believe in God, you should exactly believe that.

how are you looking?

Why would I be looking for God in the first place? I have a good background in the sciences, I don't need to invoke God as a solution.

The descriptions of God I have had from those that proselytise has been sadly lacking however. None are consistent, or logical, and I've yet to meet an honest Christian.

 

[phlogistician]

when god speaks, stuff happens. to attribute the manifestation that is your life to god...you think there's a consideration made for your ego? it can actually be quite a bloody battle.

Stream of consciousness drivel. Please try to formulate a concise and meaningful answer before replying, rather than letting your brains hit the keyboard.

twisting words?

Yes. Believing in God is religion. Did you bother to read the link and consider it?

my life is NOT a ritual, or a ceremony, or a religion. it is a gift from god.

And belief in God is religion. I don't know why you feel it's necessary to duck the label, but as usual, it's you twisting things to suit yourself.

no, the abolition of sin through a messiah is actually what the bible's about.

Really? I thought Jesus spoke about love and forgiveness, and that was a method of being forgiven in turn. The important point, which Christians overlook, isn't about sin, committing sin, or not. It's about forgiving it when it does happen.

you realize that saying that makes you seem unintelligent right?

Low shot, Lori. As has already been pointed out to you, your own Messiah was happy to endorse the ritual of marriage. Your own Messiah read from holy books as part of religious ceremonies. You gloss over these biblical passages because they don't suit your personal interpretation. But they are in your bible, if you care to actually go read it.

me testifying to learning valuable lessons the hard way is hypocritical?

Who said it was hard? Just you. Hard would be standing up for yourself, without God as a crutch.

no. no way. restored communion with god through christ is the entire point of the bible from start to finish. nothing about it is convenient.

Sure it is. Easy answers, forgiveness, rewards, not having to think for yourself. It's very convenient.

and you can't recreate what god has done to me in a lab.

Yes it exactly can. Clearly you didn't bother reading the research I linked to.

it's the meaning of my life, that you think you're controlling or creating with your instruments in a lab? delusions of grandeur.

Not mine. Clearly you didn't bother reading the research I linked to. But it proves that the feelings people experience, like your religious episodes, can be stimulated to occur.

Lori, your life is a sham.

 

[(Q)]

you don't have to be religious to believe in god.
religiousness is for mans benefit,not gods.
do you really think god cares about how we are dressed ?
do you think ppl are favored more by god just cause they can act holy?
do you think a ritual will appease god? (if so do you know the ritual that makes him send me some money? pm me..)

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

Classic. The contradictions you have just presented, that is. Trying to tell us how you don't have to be religious to believe in god and then quoting passages from scriptures to make your point. Hilarious. LOL!

 

[(Q)]

when god speaks, stuff happens.

There's no one here but YOU, Lori. Just YOU speaking, no one else. LOL!

my life is NOT a ritual, or a ceremony, or a religion. it is a gift from god.

Did it come with a warranty? If so, you better return it for one that doesn't have a faulty CPU. LOL!

no, the abolition of sin through a messiah is actually what the bible's about.

This equates to Christians telling us how to live while they do the exact opposite.

you realize that saying that makes you seem unintelligent right?

Only from one who is clearly insane.

i didn't need god to be real

Of course, the insane never need real things to support their insanity.

 

[NMSquirrel]

You have it backwards. Believing in God is religion.

why do you say that?

Then what are the ten commandments all about?

old testament law..

According to the Old Testament he exactly does.

um..^

Well, as the bible states 'the chosen people' will be saved, if you truly believe in God, you should think exactly that.

chosen people

read some..find your point..

Well, as God has demanded modes of behaviour from humans, allegedly, if you believe in God, you should exactly believe that.

lol..we as humans were unable to keep gods law..so he sent jesus to explain it..

Why would I be looking for God in the first place? I have a good background in the sciences,

good science considers ALL possibilities..
which sciences?

I don't need to invoke God as a solution.

neither should christians..

The descriptions of God I have had from those that proselytise has been sadly lacking however. None are consistent, or logical,

think,feel,know,believe.

consistancy and logic are in the mind (think)
god speaks to the heart.(feel)
RTFM..(know)..*
make up your own mind..(believe)

and I've yet to meet an honest Christian.

hmm..you dont think im honest?


* Read The F**king Manual...sorry..its appropriate..thats how we get knowledge..by reading the instructions..

 

[Lori_7]

Stream of consciousness drivel. Please try to formulate a concise and meaningful answer before replying, rather than letting your brains hit the keyboard.

god is the reason that everything exists, including me. and the bible is examples of how god has and will humble and transform some people. i am one of those people.

Yes. Believing in God is religion. Did you bother to read the link and consider it?



And belief in God is religion. I don't know why you feel it's necessary to duck the label, but as usual, it's you twisting things to suit yourself.

you want to say i'm religious because i believe in god, fine. but my life, and my commitments are not determined by ceremonies, rituals, or denominations. my life is determined by god himself.

Really? I thought Jesus spoke about love and forgiveness, and that was a method of being forgiven in turn. The important point, which Christians overlook, isn't about sin, committing sin, or not. It's about forgiving it when it does happen.

experiencing the effect that forgiveness had on me was one of the first things to enable me to relate to the bible.

but it goes beyond that in the text. jesus is actually the atonement. the ultimate sacrifice. he was the spotless lamb. spotless, as in sinless. and through him we can get to that place too. a place where forgiveness isn't even relevant anymore.

Low shot, Lori. As has already been pointed out to you, your own Messiah was happy to endorse the ritual of marriage. Your own Messiah read from holy books as part of religious ceremonies. You gloss over these biblical passages because they don't suit your personal interpretation. But they are in your bible, if you care to actually go read it.

he turned water into wine at a wedding reception. do you think that means that he was advocating alcoholism?

i don't recall a biblical description of the wedding ceremony between jesus and mary magdelene. do you think that means jesus didn't really give a flying fuck what the pharisees or anybody else thought or had to say about his decision? it was none of their business.

Who said it was hard? Just you. Hard would be standing up for yourself, without God as a crutch.

don't preach to me.

Sure it is. Easy answers, forgiveness, rewards, not having to think for yourself. It's very convenient.

the answers are not easy, forgiveness is not easy, your rewards "are in heaven", and all you do is think. and none of it is convenient.

Yes it exactly can. Clearly you didn't bother reading the research I linked to.



Not mine. Clearly you didn't bother reading the research I linked to. But it proves that the feelings people experience, like your religious episodes, can be stimulated to occur.

Lori, your life is a sham.

you introduce me to the scientist that introduced me to god, and i'll believe you.

 

[NMSquirrel]

not having to think for yourself. It's very convenient.

that sounds endemic to humanity in general..not just the religious..

the religious tend to listen to their religion..not to god..

 

[heart]

Squirrel regarding the old testament law-Quit pretending you’ve never heard of:

Matthew 5:17-20
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven."

 

[phlogistician]

Squirrel regarding the old testament law-Quit pretending you’ve never heard of:

Matthew 5:17-20
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven."

Ba da BING! Again Heart, you nail them with their own scripture!

Thankyou.

 

[phlogistician]

why do you say that?

Because that is one of the definitions of the word. Go look it up.

old testament law..

Yes, and Heart nailed you on this one with your own scripture. It would help in discourse if you knew the subject matter you allegedly believe in.

um..^

Um, exactly. Stop umming and go read your own bible.

hmm..you dont think im honest?

How can you be when you don't even know your own subject?