THE REAL [GOD] = ALLAH ...... join here you all need to know
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DiamondHearts
Registered Senior Member
Athelwulf said:
Completely correct. In Islam, as long as you follow and believe that there is one God Allah swt and accept prophet Muhammad (s) as his final prophet along with other prophets like Hazrat Isa (a), then you are Muslim. It's not humans who should judge someone's relationship with Allah swt, Allah swt will judge them. We believe it is wrong to condemn people to Hell, because that is Allah swts will and up to Him.
Athelwulf said:
Yes, there is no middle man, when we pray to Allah swt we stand in front of Allah swt with our eyes on the ground. When we ask Allah swt, He hears everything directly.
Athelwulf said:
Islam and Christianity are different in that we reject that any human has the right to be killed for our sins. For a believer, his own blood and sweat is enough to get him to Paradise.
You are quite knowledgeable on Islam and have done some good reading. I recommend you also read these websites:
Brief Guide on Islam
Islaam.com
Modern Religion
True Religion
Peace
We're all still waiting......
YES or NO:
Was it OK when Tariq ibn Ziyad led the Muslims to kill the Catholic Visigoths and conquer Spain?
YES or NO:
Where those Muslims evil colonizers?
YES or NO:
Are ALL forms of Slavery wrong?
YES or NO:
Would you would be happy to live as a Slave in servitude to your Indian Hindu Master under the conditions described for the treatment of Slaves in the Qur'an?
YES or NO:
Should a Muslim that proclaimed to have converted to Christianity be put to DEATH for his conversion out of Islam and into Christianity?
YES or NO:
Should a Muslim that proclaimed to have converted to Judaism be put to DEATH for his conversion out of Islam and into Judaism?
Presently, ALL ME Islamic countries made ALL FORMS of Slavery illegal.
YES or NO:
Is banning ALL FORMS of Slavery against the teachings in the Qur’an?
Also, another question you neglected:
Had Islam truly been a vehicle for the liberation of Hindu society from the evils of Brahminism (as is repeatedly proclaimed – and you claimed), then how was it that three centuries after the unqualified triumph of "Islam" in Sindh, Hindu society continued to survive just next door in Punjab, and the Islamic faith was able to win few converts amongst the majority of the Hindus, and not even amongst the discriminated caste communities?
And had Sindh become this great center of learning and culture after its conquest by Bin Qasim, how was it that Al-Beruni (an avowed Muslim) was studying Hindu scientific texts in Punjab, but not "Islamic" scientific texts in Sindh?
YES or NO:
Was it OK when Tariq ibn Ziyad led the Muslims to kill the Catholic Visigoths and conquer Spain?
YES or NO:
Where those Muslims evil colonizers?
YES or NO:
Are ALL forms of Slavery wrong?
YES or NO:
Would you would be happy to live as a Slave in servitude to your Indian Hindu Master under the conditions described for the treatment of Slaves in the Qur'an?
YES or NO:
Should a Muslim that proclaimed to have converted to Christianity be put to DEATH for his conversion out of Islam and into Christianity?
YES or NO:
Should a Muslim that proclaimed to have converted to Judaism be put to DEATH for his conversion out of Islam and into Judaism?
Presently, ALL ME Islamic countries made ALL FORMS of Slavery illegal.
YES or NO:
Is banning ALL FORMS of Slavery against the teachings in the Qur’an?
Also, another question you neglected:
Had Islam truly been a vehicle for the liberation of Hindu society from the evils of Brahminism (as is repeatedly proclaimed – and you claimed), then how was it that three centuries after the unqualified triumph of "Islam" in Sindh, Hindu society continued to survive just next door in Punjab, and the Islamic faith was able to win few converts amongst the majority of the Hindus, and not even amongst the discriminated caste communities?
And had Sindh become this great center of learning and culture after its conquest by Bin Qasim, how was it that Al-Beruni (an avowed Muslim) was studying Hindu scientific texts in Punjab, but not "Islamic" scientific texts in Sindh?
I also wonder:
YES or NO:
Should Christians be allowed to proselyte in Saudi Arabia?
YES or NO:
Should Muslims be allowed to proselyte in America?
YES or NO:
Should Hindus be allowed to proselyte in Saudi Arabia?
YES or NO:
Should Christians be allowed to build Churches in Saudi Arabia?
YES or NO:
Should Muslims be allowed to build Mosques in America?
YES or NO:
Should Hindus be allowed to build Temples in Saudi Arabia?
YES or NO:
Should Christians be allowed to proselyte in Saudi Arabia?
YES or NO:
Should Muslims be allowed to proselyte in America?
YES or NO:
Should Hindus be allowed to proselyte in Saudi Arabia?
YES or NO:
Should Christians be allowed to build Churches in Saudi Arabia?
YES or NO:
Should Muslims be allowed to build Mosques in America?
YES or NO:
Should Hindus be allowed to build Temples in Saudi Arabia?
YES or NO:
Do you think there is ANY connection with the moon symbol that sits at the very top of Mosques and the fact that Allah was worshipped as a moon God in a pantheon of Arabic Gods?
YES or NO:
Do you think there is ANY connection with the fact that the Kaaba is STILL considered a religious icon in Islam and the fact that the Kaaba was worshipped along with Allah the Moon God pre-Islam?*
*note: actually square rocks were worshipped as sacred Allah the moon God symbols all over the Arabian peninsula pre-Islam.
Do you think there is ANY connection with the moon symbol that sits at the very top of Mosques and the fact that Allah was worshipped as a moon God in a pantheon of Arabic Gods?
YES or NO:
Do you think there is ANY connection with the fact that the Kaaba is STILL considered a religious icon in Islam and the fact that the Kaaba was worshipped along with Allah the Moon God pre-Islam?*
*note: actually square rocks were worshipped as sacred Allah the moon God symbols all over the Arabian peninsula pre-Islam.
'islam came after bible
bible was edited by humans and its has lots of human mistakes
the real bible was there yes before MUHAMMAD the last prophet of ALLAH
the bible was true when JESUS ( the prophet of ALLAH ) was there'
But the bible we now use is not a version written after Muhammad. The texts are those that existed many years before him. There are countless examples of both old and new testament documents in existence across the world that pre-date Muhammad and that agree with the books we now have and use. There is a an almost complete book of Isaiah that dates to over 1500 years before the prophet and it is the same book as used by Jews and Christians today. This is historical fact and you can check it for yourself.
So when the prophet told people to believe these books and what was in the Quaran, he was actually contradicting himself or he was not correctly aware of what was actually in them. They have not been changed.
This is a very standard Islamic explanation for this problem but I am sorry it is just not factually accurate. Please do check it out for yourself.
sent in the spirit of love but also of truth.
bible was edited by humans and its has lots of human mistakes
the real bible was there yes before MUHAMMAD the last prophet of ALLAH
the bible was true when JESUS ( the prophet of ALLAH ) was there'
But the bible we now use is not a version written after Muhammad. The texts are those that existed many years before him. There are countless examples of both old and new testament documents in existence across the world that pre-date Muhammad and that agree with the books we now have and use. There is a an almost complete book of Isaiah that dates to over 1500 years before the prophet and it is the same book as used by Jews and Christians today. This is historical fact and you can check it for yourself.
So when the prophet told people to believe these books and what was in the Quaran, he was actually contradicting himself or he was not correctly aware of what was actually in them. They have not been changed.
This is a very standard Islamic explanation for this problem but I am sorry it is just not factually accurate. Please do check it out for yourself.
sent in the spirit of love but also of truth.
DiamondHearts
Registered Senior Member
Gordon said:
Thanks for the message, I'm always happy to talk about my religion.
You seem like you believe in the Bible very strongly, and I respect that as a Muslim.
Our belief is based on what is written in the Quran which we believe is absolute truth. We believe that the Bible (Injeel) was changed by some fo the Christian scholars and tampered by individuals.Ofcourse, this is a duty of Muslims to believe in this because it is in the Quran.
As far as I know, there is not only one version of the Bible there are many, so I believe the Bible is capable of change. And the fact that it doesn't agree with the Quran is another reason why I believe it has been changed.
Thanks for not being insulting like other people in this thread.
I respect all people who are kind and devoted to their religion. I believe that Prophet Isa (Jesus) (peace be to him) is a prophet of Allah swt and the Messiah, and he will return to bring justice in the world against the Anti Christ and rule the world with justice.
Peace.
DiamondHearts,DiamondHearts said:
I laid out those questions in a simple YES and NO format because I don't want to START with an explanation. I want to know if YES or NO you agree or disagree. From there is a starting point. Afterwards the questions can be debated number by number. You can simply say the Qur'an says it OK an there is no other rational - end of discussion. BUT some of the questions I posed are not covered in the Qur'an and so you will have to think about what You think is Right and make a choice YES you agree or NO you disagree.
If you would like to pose a similar series of questions to me I will answer you as best I can. I am even willing to change my answer if you can persuade me that I may be in error.
Also, to me, it is not insulting but debating and if during a debate I call you a hypocrite its because you are being hypocritical.
For example, I disagree with the notion that ANY form of Slavery (owning another human being) is OK. To me it is never OK. And I know that you would agree with me if you didn't read a book that says it’s OK to own humans. I asked a question regarding whether YOU would be happy to be a slave and to live under the conditions laid out for the owning of Human beings in the Qur’an. As you didn’t say you would like to be owned as a Slave then I say that is hypocritical. To say Slavery is OK, so long as you are not the slave is being hypocritical.
If that is insulting then it’s you that are insulting yourself. I’m merely pointing out that that sort of reasoning is called hypocritical and person that engages in it is a hypocrite.
Michael
DiamondHearts said:
But as Gordon's post indicated, the text of the Bible has changed indeed very little from ancient times, whereas it's hard to say what the Quran looked like prior to the Third Caliphate. Some scholars indicate that the Quran may have looked quite different before Umar; how then does one know if it's absolute truth or not, especially as compared to the Christian text?
Geoff
DiamondHearts said:
"All religions, with their gods, demigods, prophets, messiahs and saints, are the product of the fancy and credulity of men who have not yet reached the full development and complete possession of their intellectual powers."
~~ Mikhail Bakunin
Michael said:
please .. pease .. please !! stop !!
dont say things you dont know and things you not sure of it !!
QURAAN was never ever edited by any human and its not a human words
there are thousands of proofs everywhere and Quraan today the same words came to prophet muhammad . dont come to me and say proof it to us because if you want the proofs you can find it so easy everywhere from trusted islamic resources all over the world .
please stop lies
the bible was edited and specialtisits can see this truth clearly .. just do some efforts and search for the truth and you will find the truth if you realy want it
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In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
[12] Allah did aforetime take a Covenant, from the children of Israel, and We appointed twelve captains among them. And Allah said: "I am with you: if ye (but) establish regular Prayers, practise regular Charity, believe in My Messengers, honour and assist them, and loan to Allah a beautiful loan, verily I will wipe out from you your evils, and admit you to Gardens with rivers flowing beneath; but if any of you, after this, resisteth faith, he hath truly wandered from the path of rectitude.
[13] But because of their breach of their Covenant, We cursed them, and made their hearts grow hard: they change the words from their (right) places and forget a good part of the Message that was sent them, nor wilt thou cease to find them - barring a few - ever bent on (new) deceits: but forgive them, and overlook (their misdeeds): for Allah loveth those who are kind
[14] From those, too, who call themselves Christians, We did take a Covenant, but they forgot a good part of the Message that was sent them: so We estranged them, with enmity and hatred between the one and the other, to the Day of Judgment. And soon will Allah show them what it is they have done.
[15] O People of the Book! there hath come to you Our Messenger, revealing to you much that ye used to hide in the Book, and passing over much (that is now unnecessary): There hath come to you from Allah a (new) light and a perspicuous Book.
[16] Wherewith Allah guideth all who seek His good pleasure to ways of peace and safety, and leadeth them out of darkness, by His Will, unto the light, guideth them to a Path that is Straight.
[17] In blasphemy indeed are those that say that Allah is Al-Masih the son of Maryam. Say: "Who then hath the least power against Allah, if His Will were to destroy Al-Masih the son of Maryam, his mother, and all, everyone that is on the earth? For to Allah belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that is between. He createth what He pleaseth. For Allah hath power over all things."
[18] (Both) the Jews and the Christians say: "We are sons of Allah, and His beloved." Say: "Why then doth He punish you for your sins? Nay, ye are but men, of the men He hath created: He forgiveth whom He pleaseth, and He punisheth whom He pleaseth: and to Allah belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that is between: and unto Him is the final goal (of all)."
[19] O People of the Book! now hath come unto you, making (things) clear unto you, Our Messenger, after the break in (the series of) Our Messengers, lest ye should say: "There came unto us no bringer of glad tidings and no warner (from evil)"; but now hath come unto you a bringer of glad tidings and a warner (from evil). And Allah hath power over all things
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muhammad said:
Have you heard of the Yemeni horde quran? It was very old and was in fact different than todays quran.
Do you know what the Mutazili school of islamic thought is? It was the dominant school of thought in the caliphate during the 10th and part of the 11th century. They do not believe the quran was uncreated.
Found an article on it for you Muhammed.
What is the Quran
What is the Quran
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