New, Improved Obamacare Program Released On 35 Floppy Disks

Michael said:
March 14, 2012 Congressional Budget Office: Updated Estimates for the Insurance Coverage Provisions of the Affordable Care Act
May 13, 2013: CBO’s Estimate of the Net Budgetary Impact.
2014.... The Gods ONLY KNOW....

ACA was projected to cost nearly $800 billion. Then the Government added $1 TRILLION MORE ($940 billion) on to what was originally estimated. Now everyone seems to agree it's well over a trillion. Maybe as high as $2.6 TRILLION.

WTF?!? A little over a year goes by and we add on a few hundred billion more!? Another year and .... who the hell knows.


Can't wait to see what the Public Hospital Public Unions go on strike for. Fair Pay! We want a 4 month vacation like Public Teachers! Fully Paid! And a 13th Month Bonus too!! And fair work rights for the Functionally Illiterate! Fair Fair Fair!!!

GAAAAAAASP
No? Say it's not true? Whaat? The Babyboomer run State sticking their children and grandchildren and great grandchildren GenX/Y and Millennials with another $2 trillion in medical bills. Noooozeeeses.... I can't believe that? Oh, and then there's the $20 TRILLION needed to bail out the rich. Oh, and then there's the $80 TRILLION in unfunded liabilities. Plus the never ending War on "Terror" we're waging (and losing) by terrorizing most of the middle east - that's only another $10 Trillion or so. Then there's the running cost for millions and millions and millions of boondoggles like the $50 billion per year wasted on the Department of "Education". Not to mention all the money needed to keep us safe by spying on us. Like the $20 billion dollar-a-pop NSA facilities cropping up all across the Land of the Free: USSA.

Yeah, if it weren't for those greedy f*cking Koch brothers and there lifetime wealth of around $50 billion, we'd all be living like Kings and Queens. Why can't they see the Government is here to help! Help us with Patriot Acts and Wars on Drugs and Private-Public Prisons. You know, for the Good of Society. Jesus... f*cking Koch-Suckers! Screwing it all up for the little people. THEY use the roads!!!

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"The Estimated Budgetary Impact of the ACA’s Coverage Provisions Has Changed Little on a Year-by-Year Basis Since March 2010

When estimates are compared on a year-by-year basis, CBO and JCT’s estimate of the net budgetary impact of the ACA’s insurance coverage provisions has changed little since February 2013 and, indeed, has changed little since the legislation was being considered in March 2010. In March 2010, CBO and JCT projected that the provisions of the ACA related to health insurance coverage would cost the federal government $759 billion during fiscal years 2014 through 2019 (which was the last year in the 10-year budget window being used at that time). The newest projections indicate that those provisions will cost $710 billion over that same period. As shown in the figure below, the intervening projections of the cost of the ACA’s coverage provisions for those years have all been close to those figures on a year-by-year basis; of course, the 10-year totals have changed as the time frame for the estimates has shifted."http://www.cbo.gov/publication/44176

It helps to have the correct information and understand it. :)
 
Grumpy said:
Ah, the smell of idiocy in the morning!

Micheal



It is the 1% who are the Fascists here, Fascism is the incestuous relationship between government and money. When money becomes speech you are living under Fascism. The Germans used prisoners for slave labor just like our prison/industrialist prisons for profit. That's not the middle class doing anything, that's the greedy bastards you support with your idiocy.
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Public-Private Prisons are rent-seeking institutions that can only exist due to middle class America's appetite for big government 'fixing' everything - like the 'drug' problem that never existed, until the AMA used the State to force Rx from the 'private'/voluntary markets into 'regulated' Fascist markets. Now prescription drug use kills more Americans then illegal drug use. No healthcare is the #3 likely reason you are going to leave this earth. And that's exactly how American Tax Cattle like it. Land of the "Free" - what a f*cking joke.

The fact you can say prisons for 'profit' without batting a eyelash shows you have no idea what the difference is between money made by rent-seeking (which requires a State and an apetite for it regulating the markets) and money made through voluntary trade within the law and using sound-money. Thus, the only idiot in your conversation is yourself and you are, again, an example of why we live in the hyper-regulated unfree markets where laborer's have to pay the State when they work - because Americans no longer want to live free. They prefer the State regulating everything from their toilet paper to who they can marry.

Now, let's all get behind Hitlary for 8 years and sink this mother.
Land of the Free - what a joke.
 
Michael said:
Public-Private Prisons are rent-seeking institutions that can only exist due to middle class America's appetite for big government 'fixing' everything - like the 'drug' problem that never existed, until the AMA used the State to force Rx from the 'private'/voluntary markets into 'regulated' Fascist markets. Now prescription drug use kills more Americans then illegal drug use. No healthcare is the #3 likely reason you are going to leave this earth. And that's exactly how American Tax Cattle like it. Land of the "Free" - what a f*cking joke.
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for profit prisons are not inherently rent seeking behaviors. do you honestly ever know what your talking about.

The fact you can say prisons for 'profit' without batting a eyelash shows you have no idea what the difference is between money made by rent-seeking (which requires a State and an apetite for it regulating the markets) and money made through voluntary trade within the law and using sound-money. Thus, the only idiot in your conversation is yourself and you are, again, an example of why we live in the hyper-regulated unfree markets where laborer's have to pay the State when they work - because Americans no longer want to live free. They prefer the State regulating everything from their toilet paper to who they can marry.
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same libertarian bs. again rent seeking can happen without a state. you can't throw terms around just because you like the way they sound and for the impact. and by the way the biggest and best example, the du beers cartel, involves no government help. purely private enterprise.

Now, let's all get behind Hitlary for 8 years and sink this mother.
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now lets try and like adult and not act in a manner that was suspect when we were 12
Land of the Free - what a joke.
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will be free right until people like you make us unfree.
 
pjdude1219 said:
Were not a fascist state please quit misusuing words.
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We live in a society where the State determines how many hospitals can be built and opened per city, where the State decides who can participate in the healthcare markets, where the State limits the number of fMRI per city, where the State limits the number of medical practitioners through licencing and regulations, where the State has passed more regulations regarding healthcare than any other market - making up nearly half of the total regulations. The AMA used the State to take Rx out of the free-market and is working very hard to keep it out. We live in a society where the State also forces us to us it's "Fiat" currency. Maybe you don't get it - the AMA is a PRIVATE organization. The merger of Public and Private IS the very definition of Fascism. The reason why medicine is so expensive in America is simple: Fascism.

As I said, Americans don't want to live free. Americans actually hate freedom. Your entire post is littered with hatred of freedom. You WANT to be ruled. Well, good for you - you're lucky, because you're going to be ruled over. I am one of the people who will decide if you can enter the healthcare markets as an MD. Isn't that nice for you? Don't you like living in a world where I'll decide if you participate in a market or not? Does that make you feel better?

See, I have no problem with me certifying competency. Which I actually do. That's fine. Now, here's where I have a problem. It should be up to free people, living in a free society, to then decide what value they place on my 'expert' opinion of competency. In this way, if I don't do a good job and just let anyone get certified, then my opinion is ignored (not valued). If I do a good job and reach a professional balance - then there's value in my assessment and valued in a total certification. Then it should be up to the market (you know 'free' people). Now - do YOU know anything about medicine? Probably a little. Maybe not that much. So, you buy insurance. Guess what - they'll probably buy services from certified doctors. But, maybe someone is uncertified an *gasp* and yet does a good job. It should be up to FREE people to then decide if they want to engage in trade with that person.

But you don't want that to happen?! You want to shove your nose in between these two people - people you don't know, who may live on thousands of miles away. Why? What do you care? Oh, I forgot, they just so happen to Stamped with the Citizenship Ownership branding as you. AND???

In MI it's possible to be a nurse and practice.
In CA this is illegal.
Explain that to me. Oh, the magic of the vote? No. Actually, the AMA has ensured it's never come up for a vote in CA. See how wonderful 'Democracy' is? AND this is thing, it should never come up for a vote. In a FREE society the role of the State is to ensure the LAW is upheld - mainly contractual. That's pretty much it. The rest is up to us to peacefully work out amongst ourselves. Include, even, money.

But you people don't want that. You simply do not want to live free. You want to live in a 'Mixed'/Fascistic economy where the State will decide for you. Well, that, by definition, is loss of prosperity because it's a loss of Civil Liberty. AND this is exactly what your average American Tax Cattle wants. Less Freedom. They hate freedom.


Oh, and one last time: Catastrophic insurance is CHEAP (or is in a free-market). You people keep thinking that people get sick and suddenly have to go to the hospital having no say, no choice and just have rush in as fast as possible. Um, that does NOT make up the majority of hospital visits. Some? Sure. And catastrophic insurance would cover *gasp* catastrophes. Most people go to hospital because of life-style choices, aka, they're fat, they drink beer and watch a lot of TV (and hence are non-thinking idiots).
 
If you think medicine is expensive now, wait until it's free.

Coming up with “A Bitter Pill”

As those who have read the article or heard about it now know, I found that all my initial suspicions were wrong. By following the money, I discovered that our healthcare prices are out of whack for a reason that was hiding in plain sight — a reason that should be obvious to anyone who has ever been a healthcare consumer, which means all of us: There is no such thing as a free market in healthcare, if one defines a free market as a place where there is some balance of power between the buyer and the seller.
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Peeling Away Health Care’s Sticker Shock

BY Andy Grove, co-founder of Intel.

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If there is ever an industry in need of a Senator Monroney today, it is health care, in which 1950s-era thinking still rules the day, and irrational and inexplicable pricing is routine. The health care industry plays a gigantic game of Blind Man’s Bluff, keeping patients in the dark while asking them to make life-and-death decisions. The odds that they will make the best choice are negligible and largely depend on chance. Patients need to have data, including costs and their own medical histories, liberated and made freely available for thorough analysis. What health care needs is a window sticker—a transparent, good-faith effort at making prices clear and setting market forces to work.

How bad is it? Uwe Reinhardt, a leading health care economist, described the pricing of hospital services as “chaos behind a veil of secrecy.” Chaos due to lack of predictability; veil of secrecy because many organizations take a proprietary attitude toward data. Consider a recent study of the costs of routine appendectomies performed throughout California. Though the procedures were largely identical, the charges varied more than 100-fold—from $1,529 at the cheapest to $182,955 at the most expensive.
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You know what you do NOT find in free societies? One group of people able to charge nearly $200,000 for a $1000 service. Good thing we live in the 'Freest Society on Earth' in the History of History.... and stuff. Good thing enough people pulled the magic level towards O-blah-ma, yup, he'll save us with his magical words he uses and his good intentions (assuming he even give's a f*ck - which I highly doubt). The LAST thing we want to do is allow the hundreds of thousands and thousands and thousands of young eager students any attempt at offering any services not approved for by 'experts'. You know, because Central Planning works so well. Just ask our Central Bankers, look at the great job they're doing with our economy. Yup, third likely reason to die: State Sanctioned Healthcare.
 
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RE: Canada, Germany, Japan, Australia...

I notice people like to look at a rank of the USA relative to some other nation's healthcare - as if it's as easy as just having a 'Public' healthcare in the USSA and suddenly *poof* we're all Scandinavian now. Well, we have Public housing, Japan has Public housing - ours are violent shit holes full of gang-bangers. We have Public Education, Norway has Public education - we have schools where 1/3 of the students (quite smartly) dropout as it's a total waste of their time and of the 2/3 that "graduate"; 50% of these "High" school "graduates" couldn't read the previous couple of sentences and comprehend what they had just read. They'd be struggling to sound out 'Education'.

America's "Public" Healthcare is not going to be German efficient and it is not going to be safe, like in Japan. Nope. USSA inner city Public Healthcare is going to be as safe as our inner city Public Housing and useful as our inner city Public Education.

Oh, but you want to know what is pretty good in the inner city? iPhone5, Samsung TV, Sony PS4, Toyoda Camry, Honda Civil and all the other goods and services the private sector delivers to the lower middle class and poor in an affordable manner that is of the same quality as the same products sold to someone in the suburbs.
 
Good afternoon,
I am a staunch Republican, a self-proclaimed Fox News addict, and I didn't vote for the President. And I'm here to tell you that Obamacare works. I'm living proof.
I'm a chemotherapy patient, and was previously paying $428 a month for my health coverage. I was not thrilled when it was cancelled.
Then I submitted an application at HealthCare.gov. I looked at my options. And I signed up for a plan for $62 a month.
It's the best health care I have ever had.
So right now, here's what I want to tell anyone who still needs health insurance, or knows someone who does:
Sign up. Follow the instructions on the website. Apply, and look at your options. You still have time, and take it from me: This is something you want to do.
I wrote a letter to President Obama this past February to tell him about my experience with the Health Insurance Marketplace. I hoped he'd read it, and he did.
I may not be a supporter of the President. But now, I get mad when I see Obamacare dragged through the mud on television.
And even though I regularly tune in to conservative pundits, I'd like to tell them they're getting it wrong. Obamacare works.
So one more time: If you still need health insurance, you have just three days to get it. Do what I did. Go to HealthCare.gov, submit an application, and pick a plan that works for you.
It just might change your life.
Mark D. Bearden
 
The death toll of preventable deaths in those states playing politics with the lives of their citizens...

gop_obamacare_body_count.png


Grumpy:cool:
 
joepistole said:
Good afternoon,
I am a staunch Republican, a self-proclaimed Fox News addict, and I didn't vote for the President. And I'm here to tell you that Obamacare works. I'm living proof.
I'm a chemotherapy patient, and was previously paying $428 a month for my health coverage. I was not thrilled when it was cancelled.
Then I submitted an application at HealthCare.gov. I looked at my options. And I signed up for a plan for $62 a month.
It's the best health care I have ever had.
So right now, here's what I want to tell anyone who still needs health insurance, or knows someone who does:
Sign up. Follow the instructions on the website. Apply, and look at your options. You still have time, and take it from me: This is something you want to do.
I wrote a letter to President Obama this past February to tell him about my experience with the Health Insurance Marketplace. I hoped he'd read it, and he did.
I may not be a supporter of the President. But now, I get mad when I see Obamacare dragged through the mud on television.
And even though I regularly tune in to conservative pundits, I'd like to tell them they're getting it wrong. Obamacare works.
So one more time: If you still need health insurance, you have just three days to get it. Do what I did. Go to HealthCare.gov, submit an application, and pick a plan that works for you.
It just might change your life.
Mark D. Bearden
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Well done Mark!
IMO we need a lot more of these kinds of stories rather than the endless vaporous predictions of Obama care failures, before we even have any statistics, so we may refine and hone the system until we DO have a workable system, just like those smart people in Europe. I am sick and tired of these self proclaimed experts, who PREDICT doom and gloom, based on the glib talking points by a bunch of sleazy salesmen (and women), who seem to hate the US.
 
joepistole said:
Good afternoon,
I am a staunch Republican, a self-proclaimed Fox News addict, and I didn't vote for the President. And I'm here to tell you that Obamacare works. I'm living proof.
I'm a chemotherapy patient, and was previously paying $428 a month for my health coverage. I was not thrilled when it was cancelled.
Then I submitted an application at HealthCare.gov. I looked at my options. And I signed up for a plan for $62 a month.
It's the best health care I have ever had.
So right now, here's what I want to tell anyone who still needs health insurance, or knows someone who does:
Sign up. Follow the instructions on the website. Apply, and look at your options. You still have time, and take it from me: This is something you want to do.
I wrote a letter to President Obama this past February to tell him about my experience with the Health Insurance Marketplace. I hoped he'd read it, and he did.
I may not be a supporter of the President. But now, I get mad when I see Obamacare dragged through the mud on television.
And even though I regularly tune in to conservative pundits, I'd like to tell them they're getting it wrong. Obamacare works.
So one more time: If you still need health insurance, you have just three days to get it. Do what I did. Go to HealthCare.gov, submit an application, and pick a plan that works for you.
It just might change your life.
Mark D. Bearden
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And who's picking up Mark's bill? Oh, that's right, It'd be his kids and grandkids and their kids. They'll be paying much more, so Mark can pay much less. But hey, let's live in la la land where "Mark" is 'living proof' that Obamacare "works" because somehow, unknown to "Mark", Mark's medical bills just got covered by Obama's magic words.

Welcome to Democracy "middle class" style. Where, through the magic of Obama's 'words', limited resources are conjured out of their ether and given to "Mark". Well Joe, errr... I mean "Mark", the reason why medicine costs so much in the USSA - is because of people like you. It's the most highly regulated industry in the USSA. But hey, do enjoy the "free" healthcare that your kids, their kids and their kids will be paying for you. So, instead of ever buying a home and starting a family of their own, they'll get to remain living with their parents, forgo ever starting a family, and get to pay for Mark's healthcare for the "Good of Society". How nice of Mark.


Note: Your #3 reason to die in the USSA is State certified healthcare itself.
 
Michael said:
And who's picking up Mark's bill? Oh, that's right, It'd be his kids and grandkids and their kids. They'll be paying much more, so Mark can pay much less. But hey, let's live in la la land where "Mark" is 'living proof' that Obamacare "works" because somehow, unknown to "Mark", Mark's medical bills just got covered by Obama's magic words.

Welcome to Democracy "middle class" style. Where, through the magic of Obama's 'words', limited resources are conjured out of their ether and given to "Mark". Well Joe, errr... I mean "Mark", the reason why medicine costs so much in the USSA - is because of people like you. It's the most highly regulated industry in the USSA. But hey, do enjoy the "free" healthcare that your kids, their kids and their kids will be paying for you. So, instead of ever buying a home and starting a family of their own, they'll get to remain living with their parents, forgo ever starting a family, and get to pay for Mark's healthcare for the "Good of Society". How nice of Mark.


Note: Your #3 reason to die in the USSA is State certified healthcare itself.
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Is the truth causing you some distress Michael?
 
Write4U said:
Well done Mark!
IMO we need a lot more of these kinds of stories rather than the endless vaporous predictions of Obama care failures, before we even have any statistics, so we may refine and hone the system until we DO have a workable system, just like those smart people in Europe. I am sick and tired of these self proclaimed experts, who PREDICT doom and gloom, based on the glib talking points by a bunch of sleazy salesmen (and women), who seem to hate the US.
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Yes! We need more magic thinking that makes us feel good. Good enough to go down and vote for the demagogue that made us feel good. Even while the rest of society is flushed down the toilet. AND hey, isn't it nice to listen to politicians tell us stories that make us feel good about our selves.... that's important too.


Toys-R-Us recently released a statement that they're having trouble moving toys because younger Americans, for the first time in the nation's history, are not having their own children. But, hey, who the f*ck needs Americans to start a families!?!? No no no..... who needs kids when you can work at McDonald's and live at home playing PS4. We can just import Chinese people right along with their cheap toys. Like in Australia. The land of 'free' medicine. Where medical contracts are beloved by medical doctors who just can't wait to sign them and reduce their income for 'the good of society'. Yes, Australia, where replacing indebted "Citizens" with immigrants is a small price to pay for free free free.
 
Michael said:
The truth? That "Mark" is living proof that sticking the Millennial's with his medical bills 'works'. Yes, stealing works Joe. But only for so long.
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Well, no Michael. Mark isn't stealing anything and he is
isn't sticking anyone with his bills.
 
joepistole said:
Well, no Michael. Mark isn't stealing anything and he is isn't sticking anyone with his bills.
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Yes he is Joe. We know this because the State/violence is involved.

This means that the program isn't actually "valued" or wanted by society. IF it were valued and wanted by society, there'd be no need to use the State/violence to 'coerce' people into buying it - they'd buy it because it was good value (which it isn't). The administration has previously stated if enrollment somehow does magically reach 7 million - that the Millennials would need to make up nearly half (40 percent) just to keep insurance prices from rising.

Forbes: How Much Does Obamacare Rip Off Young Adults? We Ran The Numbers. Here Are The Result

Overall, the Federal government reports that 32% of on-exchange enrollees as of March 1st are under the age of 34. And many of these are teenagers who are part of family policies, not the young yuppies that Obamacare is fervently targeting. Earlier estimates showed only 20% of enrollees were between the ages 18 and 34. The final number of young enrollees is well below the required cohort. Premiums will rise next year as a result of the adverse selection of older, and probably less healthy consumers. Why are young adults staying away? In one word, economics. Obamacare is asking young adults to effectively subsidize the healthcare costs of older Americans. So far, Millennials are resisting this age-based transfer of wealth. Many are clearly opting instead to remain uninsured, or else they are buying cheaper health plans that don’t conform to Obamacare’s regulatory dictates.
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Healthcare is the most highly regulated /gamed un-free-market in the USSA. AND just like anything else that is centrally planned, it's total crap. And we haven't even gotten to the rotted State mandates and Public Unions. Just wait for those to infiltrate the system. Then you'll really see some Public 'Healthcare'. Someone's got to hire those State educated functional illiterates - may as well be State Hospitals. (Other examples of crap central planning include our central bank and our war on various adjectives we continually lose due to centralized dumb-arsery).


ObamaCare will be the Cherry that sits atop of the Progressive Cake that is Centralized Incompetence.
 
Michael said:
Yes he is Joe. We know this because the State/violence is involved.

This means that the program isn't actually "valued" or wanted by society. IF it were valued and wanted by society, there'd be no need to use the State/violence to 'coerce' people into buying it - they'd buy it because it was good value (which it isn't). The administration has previously stated if enrollment somehow does magically reach 7 million - that the Millennials would need to make up nearly half (40 percent) just to keep insurance prices from rising.

Forbes: How Much Does Obamacare Rip Off Young Adults? We Ran The Numbers. Here Are The Result

Healthcare is the most highly regulated /gamed un-free-market in the USSA. AND just like anything else that is centrally planned, it's total crap. And we haven't even gotten to the rotted State mandates and Public Unions. Just wait for those to infiltrate the system. Then you'll really see some Public 'Healthcare'. Someone's got to hire those State educated functional illiterates - may as well be State Hospitals. (Other examples of crap central planning include our central bank and our war on various adjectives we continually lose due to centralized dumb-arsery).


ObamaCare will be the Cherry that sits atop of the Progressive Cake that is Centralized Incompetence.
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Well that progressive cake has delivered better health care and cheaper healthcare than any thing conservatives/libertarians have brought to the table.
 
joepistole said:
Well that progressive cake has delivered better health care and cheaper healthcare than any thing conservatives/libertarians have brought to the table.
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Iatrogenesis is preventable harm resulting from medical treatment or advice to patients. In the United States (excluding recognizable error)an estimated 230,000 to 284,000 iatrogenic deaths occur annually. It's the #3 reason you will die in the USSA.

That's what Centralized gaming/rigging/regulation brings; overpriced and crap quality.
 
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