More young men in jail than college
- Thread starter S.A.M.
- Start date
Yes. In fact, the exact opposite is true for all races. Blacks, for instance, have improved more than anybody.
Last edited:
I think the way they calculate the data has changed from 1992 so we cannot compare before and after that year.
If you don't fund the schools, or if the schools are funded by property taxes, and crime decreases property value, and the area is just low income in general, then there won't be enough money for good schools.
To make up for this, you need libraries. I've never been rich, but I educated myself by going to the library on a daily basis, and accessing the internet. The library and internet access are the key when the school system is underfunded.
That is an excellent point. I recall meeting an American woman who told me of how her community had banded together to increase the funds available to their local school, which resulted in the state cutting off its funding, saying they no longer needed it. Funding of schools and hence teachers may be a significant factor.
Was the change in the calculation enough to account for a 300% percent increase? I doubt it. And what are you basing your idea that fewer people are going to college on? I've just showed you evidence that directly contradicts your claim. Where's your evidence?
Anecdotally, I'd say there's been a huge increase in the percent of the population that goes to college. When I graduated from high school (1985) going to college was an option, not everyone did it.
Nowadays it is pretty much assumed that all kids will go to college. Damn near everytime I do an exam on a high school senior and ask about their plans for next year they say "college".
There are several independent studies:
Thats just one I found on google, besides the increase in high school dropouts is a concern of many teachers, and that does not auger well for future college admissions, does it?
Besides, do they include the dropouts in the calculations of high schoolers going on to college?
Aspirations are a different deal.
http://www.boston.com/news/educatio...urvey_more_aspire_to_attend_college_fewer_go/
It's culture more than anything else that makes a person stay in school or drop out. If you have parents who have degrees, there is a lot more pressure on you to get one. So getting a degree is a family tradition.
At the same time, there are some environmental factors. You cannot expect someone to do well in school, or to be knowledgeable, if you don't give access to knowledge. This means, a rich kid who may not really be all that smart, but who has a large collection of books, will be more knowledgeable than a poor kid with lots of smarts and no access to knowledge.
The internet is the equalizer. Because we now have the internet, a determined person will have access to unlimited knowledge. So in the future, these things will regulate themselves out. All that is needed is information and cultural exchange. The internet is the tool which can provide both these things to anyone who is looking for self improvement.
The majority will never go to college, thats utopia, but we will have a world eventually, where people who are culturally inclined and determined to go, can go. This way, people will have a choice between two paths.
Last edited:
This is all true, but honestly, it's always been like this.
Only the top 25% of Americans go to college to begin with, and thats a vast improvement from how it used to be. In the world, it's an even lower percentage.
College attendance rates could be improved if there were more colleges, but in general, to go to college takes a lot of sacrifice and determination, and if you are poor then it takes a lifetime of sacrifice and determination. Not everyone is willing to sacrifice their youth to studying, not everyone is determined enough to keep going to school.
It's a fight to get into college, it's a fight to stay in college, and it's a fight to graduate from college. It's an even bigger fight to get into grad school, an even bigger fight to stay in grad school, and it's the biggest fight to graduate from grad school.
How many people actually have a masters degree? A whole lot less than have a bachelors. The key to success, culturally, is not to focus on the "degrees" or even the "status", but to always focus on being in the top 5% of the population. If you can get into the top 5%, you'll be alright, you'll be just fine. If you can't, then you'll be locked into a bad environment, bad jobs, etc.
It's your quality of life at stake, you fight to be in the top 5% of any field, and you stay there, and if you don't have top 5% talent, then you need a top 5% education.
If we want to measure statistics. Get data on the global population, a number. Get data on the amount of people globally who have a masters degree, then a bachelors. You'll see that the people who do have masters degrees are literally the worlds smartest most successful people. Literally in the top 2%, with people with PHDs being in the top 1%. Do you need a PHD to be considered smart? or successful?
No, you don't, but if you aren't an artist, an actor, an athelete, a cop, fireman, or talented at doing your own thing and running your own business, then you'll need the status of a degree.
The way around that, is to bring broadband and internet access, along with libraries to the poorest community. I have to give Bill Gates some credit, he pioneered it by bringing computers and windows to every library in the country. He did this mainly for economic reasons, but it helped communities at the same time.
So, the point is, access to information is the key to education. Even if theres no access to good schools, just allowing a kid the chance to go to the library and read, or go on the internet, is enough to educate someone who is curious.
There you go again on this phantom increase in high school dropouts. The only data I've come across was that same table you posted that showed a steady decrease in high school dropouts.
As far as your study from California, that state is an aberation. It is the only majority minority state in the union. Hispanics (especially immigrants) have the lowest rate of college attendance of any group. It's hard to go to college when you can barely speak English. Indeed, if there is any actual decline in college attendance rates (you've shown me no nationwide data to back your claim), I'd wager it's due to the large influx of hispanics.
First generation immigrants aren't generally too concerned about going to college. Although I did hear a story about this neurosurgeon who entered this country as an illegal migrant worker (pretty damned impressive).
Police officers, firemen, medics, etc. There are many ways to serve your community or your country without being college educated. And honestly, we always need more cops, more firemen, more medics, more soldiers, more mechanics, technicians, etc etc.
Some people make a living doing home repair and improvement. Some people make a living cutting trees down, some people make a living removing trash, delivering mail, or any of a number of absolutely essential functions of a society which all require special skills/talents/trades, but which don't require a degree.
The degree is just the path to the middle class, it's not the only way to survive. This might change in the future as we have more and more illegal immigrants, we will have to either start paying everyone a minimum wage regardless of if they are legal or not, or we will have to find some way to compromise. Because the main issue today is not just outsourcing.
The big question today is, do we want to bring the jobs to illegal immigrants, or bring illegal immigrants to the jobs? It's outsourcing vs immigration. And if you are not college educated, you'll have to take the stance that illegal immigration is bad/wrong/unethical because it's just lowering your value to the market.
That's the main problem. Competition. So if you want less competition, you should get a degree so you don't have to compete with people coming from Mexico, instead you'll be one of the people who hires guys(and girls) from Mexico to work for you, etc. It's about strategic positioning. You want to be in a position to profit from immigration.
Lead paint in inner city slum housing, some (New York's "broken window" campaign a few years ago had the side effect of eliminating the primary source of lead contamination after the leaded gas ban - old window trim paint - and that has been followed, years later, by a dip in the crime rate among teenage blacks) but leaded gasoline mostly. Blacks in the US live, on average, closer to major roads.read said:
We are dealing with a time lag, that is confusing things. Leaded gas was phased out in the US in the 70s, but any crime benefits would only start to kick in about twenty years later when the first generation of unpoisoned children (barring the paint issue, etc) hit their peak crime years. The prisons are full of people who have committed crimes some years ago and received long sentences, people who committed crimes years ago and are now repeat offenders for their new crimes, recidivists, etc.
So in this view, we are seeing in the US prisons a rat-through-the-python phenomenon: a demographic bulge of people who were poisoned by lead during the car boom in the leaded gas era, 25 - 50 years ago. In this view, we have only to wait - there will be an "echo" crime bump from recidivism, and other complications, but the big wave of the lead-poisoned has crested.
A common sense take might be that there have been sociological effects of having so many young men from the community a bit deranged in this fashion - a culture established, that will not just go away.
And also that lead cannot be the only factor here. The drug war is another, and the increasing income gap, the minimum sentencing fad, and so forth.
http://www.ewg.org/node/22088
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/07/AR2007070701073_pf.html These links are politically bent, but the sources and numbers and so forth are there.
Last edited:
If you think you're a victim, you're going to behave like one. Right?
Why? In what way?
S.A.M:
If your black peers (and whitey, in some cases) keeps telling you that you are discriminated against, and that you're going to end up a destitute loser, you're probably going to act the role. Why bother struggling against a system you think is eventually going to inevitably destroy you anyway?
For example, look at Malaysia. Laws are skewed in favour of the Malay natives (who are the dominant majority in the country), yet the immigrant Chinese pretty much dominate despite this. This demonstrates that with the correct mindset, an ethnic group can overcome mild to moderate discrimination.
The best way to help blackey is to withdraw all special privileges, and reinforce that they are responsible for their own destiny, that they aren't shackled and whipped by whitey any more. They have just as much potential as a white man, and if they apply themselves, they will certainly achieve.
This victim mentality merely does blacks harm, not good.
If your black peers (and whitey, in some cases) keeps telling you that you are discriminated against, and that you're going to end up a destitute loser, you're probably going to act the role. Why bother struggling against a system you think is eventually going to inevitably destroy you anyway?
For example, look at Malaysia. Laws are skewed in favour of the Malay natives (who are the dominant majority in the country), yet the immigrant Chinese pretty much dominate despite this. This demonstrates that with the correct mindset, an ethnic group can overcome mild to moderate discrimination.
The best way to help blackey is to withdraw all special privileges, and reinforce that they are responsible for their own destiny, that they aren't shackled and whipped by whitey any more. They have just as much potential as a white man, and if they apply themselves, they will certainly achieve.
This victim mentality merely does blacks harm, not good.