Actually, it's estimated that as many as 25% of Muslims in Britain have abandoned Islam within a single generation. This, and the persecution of apostates, does not suggest much surity to me. No offence.
As for the scientific miracles of Islam: bunk. Nonsense. I've examined - as have many here - a number of them, and it always works out to sheer, accidental happenstance.
??? Where, exactly, have I insinuated
any comment about any of the above? Why would I possibly believe that you not do any of the above? You should try to keep your comments topical, and related to the actual content of the thread. I'm not sure why you would think these things about my argument.
If you'd read the posts, you would see the questions. You don't seem to be doing this.
Most of Sura 9, a fair part of Sura 2, among others.
That's fine - and what about when a Muslim and non-Muslim meet? Actually, I'm sure they say "salaam", but this issue speaks to the kind of religious differences that underlie the entire problem: you think first to post an example of two Muslims interacting with the word "peace", but not of an example of a Muslim just offering peace to everyone. Perhaps I'm being too picky, but it just strikes a chord that suggests my argument again.
But this, too, is what you've been told. It's a story. Is it true? How do you know? If the non-Muslims had won, you'd exult at the crushing of an upstart cult led by a bandit named Mohammed. How do you know that your version is so? I ask because you seem to be proposing it as evidence of the inherent humanitarianism of Islam.
Shadow, again you're getting off topic: first, there were indeed wars to establish Islam in North Africa, which I would expect you to have heard of. But never mind that: the initial establishment of Cairo by the Islamic invaders had little to do with outreach to the rest of the world. I think you've been content to accept a fairy story of history, rather than owning up - so much as an inheritor of history rather than an actor in it can be expected to do - to some of its faults. I don't deny that my civilization has had and has now many faults. It makes no sense for you to not do likewise.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6080MV20100109
http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/1/2/nation/20100102180457&sec=nation
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100110/ap_on_re_as/as_malaysia_allah_ban
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/3210493/Allah-decision-suspended
Actually, it mostly seems to be applied to the respect and protection of Islam, specifically. It would be easier to believe your argument if one religion were not so dominant, and if Q 9:29 did not exist - or most of Sura 9, to be fair - and if there were any examples of a Muslim being arrested and charged for cruelty or insult to someone of any other religion. Yet I suppose such examples would exist, if your argument is true. Do they?
does the jews really existed? maybe it's a fairy story, and, ibrahim, noa, i think you know those people, they are already mentioned in quran, the christ is also mentioned more than mohamed, maybe those are imaginary stories? i don't think so,
and yes, i'm not going to say that we didnt have any wars you know, as you said every nation had wars, eveyr nations, had it's negatives, ok let's say that all those stories are facke, it's ok, that want affect on this discussion, after all, every nation ,and every human on earth did, it's mistackes, israeil, kill palastenians every day, in the past, americans killed all the red indians, attacked india, africa and all the world, not olny americans, all europeans,
also, some things are mentioned in the quran, and the quran is the same sence 1000 years ago, and 1400 years ago, you can find soem quran books from that time, and you'll see that they are the same sence the begenning,
i asked you about arguments that islam encourage vilence, i told you arguments from the book, arguments from the quran, not from the malysians,
and the thing that malysian did, for churches, you also did it for muslims, don't tell me that there's no one of you, ever did bad things to muslim girl a boy, don't tell me that no oen of you, had ever burned a quran book, and did a pee on it and all the things that you can imagine and not, i already saw two videos of it, what about the insulting pictures to "mohamed"
so, don't tell me that you didnt do the same
actually, we are the same, we are all humans, we all make mistakes, but if some of you did those things, that doesnt mean that all of you do those things, am i right? it's the same here,
and obviously, i'm not defending on people, i'm defending on the relegion, so can you show me lines from quran that encourage vilence,
i'll give you another example, there's a line in the jews book, says that a jew shouldnt steel from another jew, but he can steel from non-jews,
i know that those people who attacked some churches, are sicologcily ill, and racists, and i don't think that they even go to the mosque, to be honest , i dont' too, just some times, in the holy days, like eid,
about the relation between muslims, and non-muslims, for example, my uncle is married to another arabic woman, and she's christian, also another uncle of myne, his wife is christian,
we just live together normally, and i supose thatmalysians too,
i don't know anything about malysia actually, and i didnt even know that they ae muslims before, and here, i'm concntrating on the arabic world, and muslims too, effcorse,
another guy in a previous comment, said , that they should remove the passages that encourage violence, and i'm asking, what are thos passages in the quran, can you show them to me?
and now about the converting muslims, supose, a christian family, lived in an islamic contry, all muslims, what do you think that the next generation, most time, will be, propably they will be muslims, the same, a muslim parents, living in a christian contry, their children, we'll have their social life in that community, so they learn that community's habits life style, and all the other things, so he's used to be christian, to be a muslim there, for a teen, is for some people his hard, you know, the offences sometimes, not doing sex, in his early age, not drinking alcohoolik drinks, and other stuff, so he cannot not do those things, cause he lived in those envirements, and when he's a child and a teen, he always tryes, to be like all the others, try to do what all the others did,... anyway, you get it, so it's normal, that he chooses chiristanity as his relgion, esspecially that it makes him free to have sex, drink, alcoholics, .. wich almost all christians don't applytheir relgion rules,
but we don't have it in real life, .going to party for us, is to dance, have fun, no to go in a room upstares and start :shake: Hahahah, no, and that doesnt include dirty dance, 