Zionist piracy

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looked like innocent people trying to protect them selves from attack to me.

Stabbing a guy in the back is self protection? They were running through a *legal* blockade their actions were wrong no matter. They rejected turning back or going to a different port, Israel had the right to divert their course by force.

though this has been explained to you in detail to you by bells which you have rejected out of hand probably because everything must be not Israels fault to you.

What a pathetic ad homiem, I have state Israel has been in the wrong since the beginning!

Secondly it doesn't show what was done prior to the assault though as you have just shown having such an incomplete picture doesn't stop you from passing judgment in favor of those you blindly support

I'm merely stating the obvious that these people were not innocent, that they were intentionally provacting violence and if they had simply wanted to provide aid peacefully they would have gone along with a full inspection of the cargo. Israel on the other hand is wrong for the whole blockade to begin with, its unproductive and morally obscene.
 
Does the word "another" or its meaning escape you? As in one was shot from above and another journalist was shot from behind.

My point is that they were claiming it was in self defense. Now, these journalists were filming and reporting on the events as they occured. How did they pose a threat to the IDF? Do you consider reporting to be an attack?


Don't you find it strange that the images shown by the IDF only start when they actually board the ship? That independent reporters on the other ships have all stated quite clearly that the IDF fired tear gas, stun grenades and other items onto the decks of the lead ship before they attempted to board it. And that when they were unsuccessful in trying to board the ship by boat, that was when the helicopters flew in? I guess you missed that?

But apparently, defending yourself in international waters when being attacked by armed men is now a bad thing.


The only images and information we had up to that point was what was provided by the IDF. But as information from the journalists and independent observers starts to get out, it is casting a shadow on a lot of what the IDF had been claiming. So tell me, where are the images of people with paint stains on them? If the IDF came in firing paintball guns, there would be plenty of subsequent images of people running around with paint stains on them. And yet, there isn't a single one.

What we do have is Israel stating that they came in firing paintball guns and released images of soldiers holding what look like paintball guns in very fuzzy images that are not distinct or defined... and yet, there is not a single image of people on that boat with paint stains on them. Don't you find that strange? What we do have is at least 9 people dead (there are reports that some bodies were dumped overboard by the IDF) and countless injured with real bullet wounds. So again, where are the images of people running around with paintball stains on that main ship? The other ships reported being boarded by people carrying what appeared to be paintball guns and tasers and others also reported that people had real firearms aimed at their heads and threatened with death if they did not provide their passports (I'm guessing the IDF need new passports to commit more murders, but that's another subject). Yet on that mainship, the IDF reports that they fired paintball guns first.. And there is not a single image of people with paint stains on them. We have people shot dead and people injured with real live bullets... But no paint stains.. Why is that?

if you freeze a paint ball it won't break on contact and do a hell of a lot more damage to a person
 
Stabbing a guy in the back is self protection? They were running through a *legal* blockade their actions were wrong no matter. They rejected turning back or going to a different port, Israel had the right to divert their course by force.
defense of the group yes.



What a pathetic ad homiem, I have state Israel has been in the wrong since the beginning!
really its hard to tell with how much you have BLAMED THE VICTIMS? it sounds almost like your lying.



I'm merely stating the obvious that these people were not innocent, that they were intentionally provacting violence and if they had simply wanted to provide aid peacefully they would have gone along with a full inspection of the cargo. Israel on the other hand is wrong for the whole blockade to begin with, its unproductive and morally obscene.

Bullshit they weren't innocent. they didn't want violence. its why they had to resort to improvised weapons..
 
because given Israel history they didn't. they made the right choice. tell me if you see armed people coming toward you who have a history of attacking and killing unarmed people are you going to A. just sit their and hope they for once don't use violence or B. take proactive measures to come out of it alive.

Police have a history of brutality and corruption, so that means when a police officer comes up to your going to "take proactive measures to come out of it alive" I'll tell you what those measures are: getting on the ground arms in what ever position dictated, following every order with a "yes sir!" that how you come out of it alive. No many of those that attacked toe soldiers wanted to die:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3898109,00.html
 
Police have a history of brutality and corruption, so that means when a police officer comes up to your going to "take proactive measures to come out of it alive" I'll tell you what those measures are: getting on the ground arms in what ever position dictated, following every order with a "yes sir!" that how you come out of it alive. No many of those that attacked toe soldiers wanted to die:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3898109,00.html

But even police officers have jurisdiction. Can an American police officer come into an Indian reservation and beat up or chase or kill a suspect? Whats so hard to figure out about international waters?
 
Does the word "another" or its meaning escape you? As in one was shot from above and another journalist was shot from behind.

My point is that they were claiming it was in self defense. Now, these journalists were filming and reporting on the events as they occured. How did they pose a threat to the IDF? Do you consider reporting to be an attack?

Anyone who is in the midst of a violent altercation can be hit or shot Bells, journalists know that and if they are not prepared for it then they shouldn't be in that situation. What you haven't done is provide any evidence that they were purposely targeted and you being a lawyer SHOULD know that you cannot speculate in terms of evidence and motives. Now, you can shoot someone from the air Bells and hit them in the back as well as in the back of the head. Is it that you don't know how little bullets fly through the air? I'm sure Black Jack can explain it to you.
 
defense of the group yes.

no that just a group in a murderous rage, the videos don't lie.

really its hard to tell with how much you have BLAMED THE VICTIMS? it sounds almost like your lying.

In this case the flotilla was wrong, intended to provocation. This has nothing to do with the whole blockade being wrong to begin with. You don't spit in police officer's face, that wrong, its also wrong for police to abuse their authority by kicking your ass, but these two wrongs are disconnected, each deserves its own blame and each is punishable separately.

Bullshit they weren't innocent. they didn't want violence. its why they had to resort to improvised weapons..

If they did not want violence then they would not have started it, those soldiers did not even touch the ship with there feet before being beaten!
 
But even police officers have jurisdiction. Can an American police officer come into an Indian reservation and beat up or chase or kill a suspect? Whats so hard to figure out about international waters?

Certainly this issued is muddy legally but this is what happens when you run a blockade! A blockade that was (somehow) legal. They could have simply gone to an alternate port.
 
I must say, it's tragically hilarious to watch the Israelis stretch their ability to lie, deceive and double-speak to their limits. At least with their excesses against the Palestinians, they can hide behind the excuse that they are simply responding to evil brown terrorists. It's much harder to do the same with humanitarian aid workers, although that doesn't stop them. Apparently anyone with the conviction to stand against Israeli brutality is a 'terrorist' in their book.

Irrespective of the legality of the Israelis actions (something which is highly uncertain), one need merely look at the morality. A ship containing humanitarian aid workers attempts to deliver supplies to an occupied people who are under embargo, some of whom don't have access to running water, electricity, or adequate housing. The Israelis ambush the ship in the dead of night (using commandos from a helicopter, for fucks sake), and in the process kill aid workers and individuals with the media. Furthermore, they jammed communications and continue to hold individuals prisoner, so that we can't determine both sides of the story.

Gee, when you look at it that way, the Israelis seem like real fucking bastards, don't they? Why, they are actually Nazi-like in their treatment of an occupied people. Which is sort of ironic, given that the Jewish apartheid state uses past Nazi treatment to milk sympathy from its supporters.
 
You know... I'm starting to think that pjdude1219 is just trolling... I mean... it's the only thing I can think of to explain why he would disregard the obvious and stick to such obvious logical fallacies.

Same kind of goes for S.A.M... but at least he makes some effort to make his trolling less obvious. At least he doesn't just go "NUH-UH!" and wait for a heated response. You're much like that Indian friend of mine that I mentioned... in fact so much like him that I wouldn't be surprised if you WERE him. :eek:
 
Certainly this issued is muddy legally but this is what happens when you run a blockade! A blockade that was (somehow) legal. They could have simply gone to an alternate port.

How is the blockade legal? Is Gaza a State? Is Israel acknowledging that it is in a state of war with Gaza?
 
You know... I'm starting to think that pjdude1219 is just trolling... I mean... it's the only thing I can think of to explain why he would disregard the obvious and stick to such obvious logical fallacies.

Same kind of goes for S.A.M... but at least he makes some effort to make his trolling less obvious. At least he doesn't just go "NUH-UH!" and wait for a heated response. You're much like that Indian friend of mine that I mentioned... in fact so much like him that I wouldn't be surprised if you WERE him. :eek:

No. Trolling is when you institute a blockade to deny an occupied people the essentials of life, and then kill anyone who tries to bring them relief. The Israelis have forgotten more about trolling that S.A.M will ever learn.
 
How is the blockade legal? Is Gaza a State? Is Israel acknowledging that it is in a state of war with Gaza?

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/25/world/middleeast/25mideast.html?_r=1

This is why there is a blockade on Gaza.


No. Trolling is when you institute a blockade to deny an occupied people the essentials of life, and then kill anyone who tries to bring them relief. The Israelis have forgotten more about trolling that S.A.M will ever learn.
Again, see above link... there is a reason why they control the flow of goods that go into Gaza. They do not DENY the essentials, they merely inspect it before it reaches them to make sure there isn't any weapons, or contraband mixed in. It takes a little longer to get to them, but it gets to them. I'm sure even S.A.M will agree that that is a bold statement to make... he may even be offended that you underestimate him ;)
 
How is the blockade legal? Is Gaza a State? Is Israel acknowledging that it is in a state of war with Gaza?

Honestly I have the same questions. I don't know how but Israel and Egypt are allow to blockade gaza.
 
BTW, the Economist gave a summary of what items are allowed and prevented by the Gaza blockade.

201023NAC266B.jpg


Isn't it interesting that the blockade prevents essentials which would allow the people of Gaza to be self-sufficient (eg. Fabric for clothing, wood for construction), but allows through items which keeps these oppressed people held hostage to the imports (and therefore the blockade).

The Israeli Govt. is manipulative, oppressive scum.
 
@mordea

Are you blind? It prohibits fabric but not clothes. There isn't anything on the list of prohibited items that isn't made up for in the permitted list. Your suggestion that the list is oppressive isn't holding up very well.
 
Can anybody explain to me why anybody would want to have a paintball gun on ship boarding mission?
 
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