What do Christians think about Islam

[Michael]

There where no muslims africans on the slave ships bound for america. That’s why there where no muslim african americans for most of the history of africans in the usa. Your "brothers" in african where not slaves they where the slave traders. And they are still doing it till this day.

Well this is a second interesting thing I hadn't though about.

This thread has been more than worth its while.

You are right, there is a mirror here. I don't not delineate Islam from Christianity in the respect. But, you are a good example of where Christianity differs from Islam, in being non violent at it's base, but also you carry the same intolerance that will lead more Christians than not, to kill Muslims. You see, this is a fundamental flaw with all monotheisms. The very notion itself.

 

[DiamondHearts]

Adstar, you are nothing but a tool of a godless and material civilization which aims to vanquish religion from the planet. The pseudo-Christian Western civilization is inherently Atheist and opposes God.

Had you more concern with truth you would actually read from legitimate translations of the Quran, rather than from propaganda websites which further demonizations and lies. The truth cannot be perpetuated by manipulations, God is on the side of those who are truthful.

In the verse you quoted, the word used is wali, which the translator wrongly identified as friends and protectors. Wali in Arabic means sovereign or an ally which has the advantage over you, the one who has affairs of the family or tribe, for example the father is the wali of his wife and his children. This verse can be applied to families and also to the realm of political treaties between nations. An alliance entered between Muslims and other nations should be that of equality, and not that of a weak party to a stronger party.

Quran
[5:82] ... And you will find that the closest people in friendship to the believers are those who say, "We are Christian." This is because they have priests and monks among them, and they are not arrogant.

[5:83] When they hear what was revealed to the messenger, you see their eyes flooding with tears as they recognize the truth therein, and they say, "Our Lord, we have believed, so count us among the witnesses.

It is important to read all the statements of the Quran, before we judge in a manner which is contrary to the truth. You should use wisdom in seeking knowledge, and hatred should not be a guiding principal in seeking knowledge.

Furthermore, Islam's ideological problem with the Christians of today, as opposed to the Christians of the past (whom worshiped only God) is that the Christians of today have made Jesus (peace be to him) a God, the son of God, or an aspect of God. God protect him from those whom make this charge. God is indeed one, this was revealed to Prophet Abraham (peace be to him). The nature of God does not change, it is constant Oneness. He is independent of creation. It might serve well to look into the fact that there were Christians (Arianism) who rejected the divinity of Jesus (peace be to him) in the early history of Christianity, eventually they were named heretics in the council of Nicea 325 AD and hunted by the Romans, who had recently embraced Christianity. A few surviving monotheistic Christians survived in the Holy Land and the Middle East up until the coming of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be to him) in the persons of the priest Basara, Salman Al Farisi (the Persian), and numerous others (the mercy of God be upon them).

“Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Not everyone that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? And in thy name have cast out devils? And in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.” (Matt 7:15-23)

 

[Michael]

Most Christians prefer to forget that the Divinity of Christ was decided sometime during the Nicean councils. Which was waaay before Mohammed. The verse on not considering the Jews and Christians as your wali is very significant in a religious context. And also very appropriate in that Muslims should not seek to understand their religion by adopting Biblical narratives about religion as the base for theirs. What the Jews say in the Tanakh about the justification of the genocide of undesirable people or what the Christians imply about Jesus for instance, would be detrimental to understanding Islam for a Muslim.

As an example, the Arabs adopted the veil from the Byzantines. And it has had a detrimental effect on their society.

They adopted homophobia from the Christian narrative of Lot, ignoring the Jewish one. And that has been detrimental to their society.

Most/All Muslims tend to forget that Christianity used mathematical symbolism sent to them from the God Head so as to distinguish real Prophets from people who pretended to be Prophets. Something lacking in the Qur'an.

Considering Christianity predates Islam, just as you suggest, then if one were to truly take an open minded approach to it, by necessary they'd have to come to the conclusion Mohammad was not a Prophet. But, we don't do that now do we? No no no... Arabs murdered their girls, yes, this is much more simple minded and easy to grasp. Even the ones that were very wealthy, like the one Mohammad married. She was probably murdered as a child too

 

[Michael]

I'm still wondering if DH or SAM consider the Ahmadiyya belief system to be equally as valid as their own? How about the Baha'i? Considering both religions teach that the Qur'an is either a corrupted and/or superseded peace of work ... geee JUST LIKE Muslims think about the Bible,

Funny that? The more things change, the more they stay exactly the same.

 

[DiamondHearts]

Mindless, unsupported prejudiced views as always. As if I'd expect anything different from a racist. [i.e. someone who calls all arabs fat, polygamist, liars, etc]

 

[guthrie]

Most/All Muslims tend to forget that Christianity used mathematical symbolism sent to them from the God Head so as to distinguish real Prophets from people who pretended to be Prophets. Something lacking in the Qur'an.

Ummm, really? Like what?

 

[(Q)]

Mindless, unsupported prejudiced views as always. As if I'd expect anything different from a racist. [i.e. someone who calls all arabs fat, polygamist, liars, etc]

So, does the fact that you lie have anything to do with you being a Muslim?

I really have no idea if you're fat or a polygamist.

 

[DiamondHearts]

Q, you have yet to provide from anywhere when I have lied about my beliefs.

Just because you repeat a lie every thread does not make it any more correct.

 

[(Q)]

Q, you have yet to provide from anywhere when I have lied about my beliefs.

That is a lie. You lie constantly and I point it out when I can. Unfortunately, pointing out your lies would be a full time job here.

And, you NEVER back up those lies with evidence to support your claims.

I just pointed out another lie in which you claimed Daniel Pipes invented this and that, which he never did. You're a liar, and I want to know if it has anything to do with being Muslim, because I find little more than lies from Muslims from you and other Muslims here.

 

[Michael]

Ummm, really? Like what?

The Ichthus is a classic example.

 

[Michael]

We're waiting for DH to say that the Ahmadiyya and the Baha'i belief systems are equally as valid as Islam. But we both know how intolerant Islam is and so that isn't going to happen is it.

It's funny isn't it? DH pisses his pants mad that Christians view Mohammad and the Qur'an as works of Satan but then thinks it's fine and dandy that he think's the Bible has been corrupted by man (under the influence of Satan) and that the Ahmadiyya and the Baha'i are corrupted and inventions of Satan.

I just wonder how such a hypocrite comes to terms with such intolerance?


How's the Shinto Polytheism DH?

M

Note: Arab culture minus the Islam is pretty decent. Good food, nice people. If it were not for Mohammad the place could possible have turned out quite nicely.

 

[Michael]

Come on DH, tell us all about how you think the Japanese ancient and indigenous belief system of multiple Gods is equally as valid as your own.

You know, like I can do. See here once again for an example of tolerance that is completely lacking in you.

Polytheism, Atheism and Islam are all equally as valid as one another.

See how simple that is DH. You know that little feeling of guilt you have, not being able to be as tolerant as me, me an atheist. That's called your conscious. See, a part of you agree's with me, and knows full well that Islam is an intolerant belief system. That little peace of Good - that was implanted into you by Western multiculturalism. Funny isn't it? I mean, me, I personally LOVE IT. How we in the West are already changing you in ways you don't even realize - - and more importantly can do absolutly nothing about - except sit there and feel guilt. Western guilt at being such an intolerant hypocrite.

Think of this next time you pray to the magical Allah in hopes for your 72 carrots. You should pray for a reasonable argument. You know, for inspiration from Allah. But, Allah's such a dip-shit It can't! That's the funny part. We Atheists have already bested your God. AAAHHHHaahahahahaaaa!!!! HAhahahahaha.... By the Gods it's soooo funny to me.

 

[DiamondHearts]

So Q, you are denying that Daniel Pipes wrote a book entitled the "New Anti-Semitism" comparing Muslim opposition to Israel as Anti-Semitism.

Q, if you are going to claim that I lie, you should get started, I will be satisfied with only five examples, if you can even provide one that is.

 

[(Q)]

So Q, you are denying that Daniel Pipes wrote a book entitled the "New Anti-Semitism" comparing Muslim opposition to Israel as Anti-Semitism.

What Daniel Pipes wrote and what you opine about him are two different things. He did not invent that term as you claim he did.

Q, if you are going to claim that I lie, you should get started, I will be satisfied with only five examples, if you can even provide one that is.

Go back through your own posts and you'll find far more than that where I pointed them out at the time. Denying that would be yet another lie on your part.

 

[S.A.M.]

What Daniel Pipes wrote and what you opine about him are two different things. He did not invent that term as you claim he did.

He's credited with it. Do you have evidence otherwise?

Daniel Pipes is the author of several concepts that have been imposed in the public debate.
Above all, he is the inventor of the «New Anti-Semitism» [16]. This term is used to identify the opposition of American Muslim pressure groups against American Jewish pressure groups regarding the Palestinian issue. It is an amalgam between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism that has been quite used lately. He is also the inventor of the «Militants of Islam» [17].
The expression identifies those Muslims who, not satisfied with their domestic prayers, join community organizations and defend the rights of the Palestinians to the detriment of the Israelis supported by the United States. It creates a new amalgam between Muslim identity, the struggle against the State of Israel, and the challenging of Washington’s policy. This presents those Americans of Muslim religion as traitors, mainly.

Finally, he invented «the Middle East complot theory». The Arabs, who refuse to accept their incapacity to solve their problems, imagine they are victims of Western complots [18].

http://www.voltairenet.org/article136260.html#nb16

Who in your opinion, really invented the term? And per chance, is this another one of your idols?

 

[quadraphonics]

The pseudo-Christian Western civilization is inherently Atheist and opposes God.

You post things like this, and then go on to criticize people for racism and imperialism with a straight face.

That's why nobody respects your point of view.

 

[DiamondHearts]

You post things like this, and then go on to criticize people for racism and imperialism with a straight face.

That's why nobody respects your point of view.

I don't seek respect or support from Zionists. You should try reading the rest of my post for perspective. How can a nation which divorces God from its governing system be Christian? It cannot, and the slide of Western civilization into Atheism is proof of it.

 

[quadraphonics]

I don't seek respect or support from Zionists.

Indeed. The imperative is to strike at the nefarious, omnipresent Enemy, apparently.

You should try reading the rest of my post for perspective.

Does that blanket retort still sound cute to you, after so much overuse?

How can a nation which divorces God from its governing system be Christian?
It cannot, and the slide of Western civilization into Atheism is proof of it.

Yeah, that's the sort of blatantly imperialistic formulation I'm referring to.

You possess a very ugly mind.

 

[Michael]

It should be noted that Western Civilization is rooted in Polytheism, Republic and Citizenry.

 

[Michael]

I'd also like to point out a couple of observations.

1) The Christians who did post pretty much all agree that The Qur'an is Satanic. Being monotheistic there is a natural amount of intolerance presence BUT because the Christian theology hinges on forgiveness there is usually a positive spin.

2) Muslims don't like this attitude. They don't like that Christians teach their children that Muslims are following the Devil's Recipe Book aka The Qur'an.

3) Muslims also take this same attitude. Muslims mirror the Christian perspective for everyone else's beliefs. Take the Baha'i for example. Or the Ahmadiyya. Muslims often teach their children to be intolerance of these people's religious books (and ideas). Unfortunately forgiveness isn't the central tenant in Islam. It's the Qur'an is the world's only perfect religious book and Mohammad is the world's only Last Prophet. Which is why Muslims are even more intolerance that the other monotheists.


Ultimately this leads to Christians targeting Muslims.
And to Muslims targeting Baha'i and the Ahmadiyya.
etc....


It's very very easy to see how monotheism as an ideology is naturally intolerance - it even arose during periods when Jewish were in a bad head-space. Evil begets Evil so to speak.


Think of these scenarios:

This Chinese God is fascinating. She may be real. I will respect the shrine and give some support to the monks therein.

This Greek God is probably not real. But She may be real. I am fascinated by the tales of her and I wonder how that relates to Greek History.

The Hindu God is not real. But, some Indian people need something they can see and touch - you know, to hold on to - unlike me. I'm so much smarter than these people.

The multiple Arab Gods are false. Worshiping them will result in eternal damnation and hell-fire. I will not even step foot into this city until my followers burn down and destroy all Arab shrines and kill anyone not willing to bend to the One True God.