The interesting point you make is that:
"The way I want to believe this universe is organized"
Therefore your beliefs are derived from your desires. They have no value in relation to what is.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
We Are All Hindus Now
- Thread starter Michael
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The interesting point you make is that:
"The way I want to believe this universe is organized"
Therefore your beliefs are derived from your desires. They have no value in relation to what is.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
I must say i do not spend my waking hours all wrapped up in guilt. Guilt is a very good thing because it is a message from God into the conscience of man. Guilt for me is something that happens and it is then and there that it is to be dealt with by acknowledgment of it to God. After that i move on happy and at peace knowing i am forgiven by a loving God. Guilt for me is something that lasts a few seconds.
People who are racked by Guilt are those who are also blighted by pride. The proud think they should be able to achieve goodness, but of course they fall short of it and fall into guilt-ridden depression. The proud think mankind should be able to create a perfect society of prosperity, peace and security. They latch onto ideologies that offer the promise of a perfect society. But of course when their movements collapse (as they always do) they fall into depression and deep hatred for others whom they believe have let them down.
All these negative feeling do not stem from our inability to realise perfection. They stem from a foundational belief that perfection is an achievable goal.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
You cannot rip my ass mentaly earth.Just a little correction.
I do not believe people are born guilty. There is i believe a time of innocence before the knowledge of Good and evil takes hold. There may be people who suffer certain mental conditions that never come to the knowledge of good and evil.
But a normal person who lives a normal length life, they are sinners and guilty as charged. God has provided us with the atonement through the Messiah Jesus, it is a gift. And it is the only way to the Father.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
Yes isn't this the way we all approach these subjects? Since no one can prove anything; all of us (including you) want to believe in this ot that particular religion or no religion at all.
I think this is related to what you mentioned
"Muslim prison gans on the rise......"
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article5509740.ece
Just what we need!
Well, I'm not sure. Open a thread and make your case. Is it really consumerism OR could it be that given freedom 99% of people become boring and sloth?
When I go shopping for veggies I go to the farmer's market - fresh and cheap and no middle man. IS THAT consumerism? SHould I grow my own instead?
I LOVE PS3 and Guitar Hero Metalica !!!
IS THAT consumerism?
What the hell is Consumerism?
I think fundamentalism of intolerant ideas is the ban of humanity in a multicultural world. fundamentalism of certain principals is good. (ex: slavery is evil, pedophilia is evil, murdering people for crack money is evil...)
Modern secular Societies are simply so successful that many people become arse wipes because they have so much free time and too much moneyt THAT'S a problem with people not consumerism. Most people are idiots.
Just live with it.
I went to London last year, spent half the time in the museums. Most people I know spend half their time buying new fashion and cloths. Both of us consumed
I understand your concern BUT this could also be a really unique and great opportunity ... maybe. To re-educated a whole group of Muslims in the real tenants of Islam and Islamic history. Using moderate like-minded Imam's. Could be good. Real good.I think this is related to what you mentioned
"Muslim prison gans on the rise......"
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article5509740.ece
Just what we need!
Yes isn't this the way we all approach these subjects? Since no one can prove anything; all of us (including you) want to believe in this ot that particular religion or no religion at all.
Good point. To an extent you are right.
I have however during the time of my journey in my faith come to things that are very hard to accept, things that required me to use my trust in God.
Have you come to these issues within your journey?
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
Good thought! I couldn't agree more. I can see how the process goes both ways. You see now in the news how Iranians are more open to a more flexible approach to western culture. I see women protesting in public that is great!!!
I think that hopefully one day we will all find a point of balance among all of these religions and ideologies. We all have baggage of cultural ideas that are inserted in our brains since we are born, some are right, some are wrong, we just follow them. But we all have brains and intelligence to question them and pick and choose what we feel is right.
I have to tell you, I used to have personal conversations with God every day when I was younger. Then i realized nobody was listening and I quit believing. I had prayed and begged so much but then I realized if god existed was there only to punish me, not to reward me if I did something right. Therefore I did not need him.
I saw too many "bad" people being rewarded while I was immediatelly punished for "little" sins I could'nt avoid commiting. So if God existed, was very unfair, for a while I kept the idea I would be rewarded when I die, I even started wishing I could die soon so I could get my reward.
Then is when I decided there should be an alternative approach. I believe there is a vey intelligent system we are in, I believe the system is in place to make us evolve, I am trying to "decode" this system to understand the reason behind the events in our lives, especially the unpleasent ones. I do not need to find a reason for happiness as I beleive this is our natural intrinsec basic emotion.
I guess your faith was in a god that would keep you from harm and give you your desires. Fortunately for me i believed in a God that would give me strength to face harm and peace of mind to accept what i came to have.
This world is unjust. Some people exploit others causing poverty and misery for others. They do this to gain luxury and easy living for themselves. They call the others suckers but this will not justify their actions.
And suffering is the price of sin. No need for God to punish you because the outcomes of sin cause suffering anyway.
Both these things are true irrespective of God being or God not being.
It was never a reward. That word lets me know more about the false god that was either placed in your mind or you developed in your mind through your own thoughts.
Eternity with God is a Gift. A gift to there to be had by accepting it.
Cool, glad you decided to change, sad you decided to chuck the baby out with the bathwater.
Peace that comes from contentment is for me our natural intrinsic basic emotion. All others including happiness can only ever be temporary.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
@ Adstar:
I feel my strength comes from myself, I've developed it after a lot of struggles adn suffering, and this strenght makes me feel balanced. I was able to succeed in some aspects of my life against all odds alone and not depending on any other person nor God.
If believing in God makes you feel balanced, happy; if you are able to succeed without depending on any other person such as spouse, children et c. and if being religious does not give you the impression that you must to impose those beliefs on others, I completelly respect you for having religious beliefs. My life might have been simpler if the religious beliefs would have been suited for me, but they weren't. I have many friends who are very religious and successful and we all respect each other.
I feel my strength comes from myself, I've developed it after a lot of struggles adn suffering, and this strenght makes me feel balanced. I was able to succeed in some aspects of my life against all odds alone and not depending on any other person nor God.
If believing in God makes you feel balanced, happy; if you are able to succeed without depending on any other person such as spouse, children et c. and if being religious does not give you the impression that you must to impose those beliefs on others, I completelly respect you for having religious beliefs. My life might have been simpler if the religious beliefs would have been suited for me, but they weren't. I have many friends who are very religious and successful and we all respect each other.
Its just not clear exactly what you are looking at when you make remarks about religion being the greatest enemy of our time.
I imagine that you have more dimensions to your life than PS3 and vegetable purchases
a subcategory of capitalism - namely making all moral/social/ideological imperatives relative to capital
discussing the pro's and con's of (any) fundamentalism first of all requires an analysis of one's values.
.... otherwise its the very nature of any particular ideology to be intolerant of a particular other
if many people are becoming arse wipes because of the ideology, its tends to indicate a flawed ideology
(Actually I would argue that it also bears an effect on what they are wiping their arse on ... namely the planet ... so its like a double whammy)
there's more to it than just mere free enterprise I'm afraid ......I went to London last year, spent half the time in the museums. Most people I know spend half their time buying new fashion and cloths. Both of us consumed
haha... maybe
I never say Religion is the greatest enemy of our time. I'd venture to say adding 10 million+ people to the planet each day is the greatest enemy of our time. Also, I understand that people, many people anyway, need a religion for now. Although, IF generations of people grow to adulthood feeling safe, then, for most people religion will cease being so important. Or even a little important. As that's the case. Perhaps we should make a new religion? One that can bring meaning in a modern world? One that isn't tied to Heaven and Hell. Haven't we moved past this simple Carrot and Stick approach to life and meaning therein?
Haaa! NO fracking way!!!
Why Live?
What's the purpose in life for most people? A life pursuit of material crap? Sure that does make sense. It's simple enough and easy enough for people to understand. I have more, therefor I am happy. My life has meaning because I own stuff. Especially if I own more stuff than you! Gee, I MUST be happier... right??!? I suppose for most of history it's been. I have more KIDS, therefor I am happy.
Who knows?
Most people are simply too fracking lazy to create anything of worthwhile meaning in life - outside of kids and owning stuff they really couldn't be bothered AND they only do those things because it's been evolutionarily burned into their psyche to do them...
See this here. It's one of the world's first lap top. To it's inventor, it gave immense happiness. Creating this I mean. Was it's creating meaningful? Seem so. What about the person who just had a good paying job on Wallstreet in the 1980s who went out and bought this? Was his actions meaningful? Did buying this bring him more or less meaning into his life's existence when compared to it's inventor? I like to think about these things some times
And what I usuing come up with is this:
Does owning this thing NOW still seem meaningful to the Wallstreet Baron who purchased it? Does he still use it? Does he show it to people. Did he toss it in a bin long ago?
Now, what of it's inventor? Does he still show people this thing he invented? I like to think yes he does. He life's pursuit was indeed worthwhile. His invention meaningful. But why? No reason other than it is.
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only if you are also wagering that our current social values will also predominatehaha... maybe
I never say Religion is the greatest enemy of our time. I'd venture to say adding 10 million+ people to the planet each day is the greatest enemy of our time.
given the nature of adulthood, I guess we can expect religion to still bring in the numbers
there is such a version.
Its called actual religiousity.
Given people's predisposition for stabilizing on an unsatisfactory level of performance, it probably won't make the grade for the masses any time soon
who knows?
God of course.
Hence
sure
hence
The first concern of civilized persons is economic development, the next concern is defense against being annihilated, and the next consciousness is mental speculation, the philosophical approach to the values of life.
annamaya and pranamaya actually don't make for vast reservoirs of immense happinessSee this here. It's one of the world's first lap top. To it's inventor, it gave immense happiness. Creating this I mean. Was it's creating meaningful? Seem so. What about the person who just had a good paying job on Wallstreet in the 1980s who went out and bought this? Was his actions meaningful? Did buying this bring him more or less meaning into his life's existence when compared to it's inventor? I like to think about these things some times
accepting a filigree of manomaya does tend to lend an extra dimension to anna and prana maya .... although it still remains paltry.And what I usuing come up with is this:
Does owning this thing NOW still seem meaningful to the Wallstreet Baron who purchased it? Does he still use it? Does he show it to people. Did he toss it in a bin long ago?
Now, what of it's inventor? Does he still show people this thing he invented? I like to think yes he does. He life's pursuit was indeed worthwhile. His invention meaningful. But why? No reason other than it is.
I am not a Hindu nor will I EVER be. I will NEVER worship a cow or anyone other than God/Jesus. The ONLY way to Heaven is through Jesus Christ--just like the Bible says. You want to go somewhere else? Then believe/worship something/someone else. Heaven is created BY God for His kids. We have been tolerant long enough. We were SO tolerant and pc that we let filthy Muslim terrorists into the country who chose to blow the cr@p out of us 911. Thank God we had W to stop that sh*t. He prevented dozens more terror attacks. And he prevented 2 hits on Obama. Hell is real whether you believe it or not. Non-believers will find out when they die. You were right about Religious Fundamentalism being our biggest enemy but you should be less pc and say Muslim Fundamentalism. That is more accurate. They are the ones who have committed more than 14,000 deadly terror attacks since 911. No other religion has committed any.
There are very good reasons in India for considering the cow to be sacred. They clean up garbage on the streets, cow patties are an important source of cooking fuels, and if farmers killed their cows for meat, everyone would starve the next year when they couldn't plow the fields.
(Christians have been responsible for a number of terror attacks on US abortion doctors)
(Christians have been responsible for a number of terror attacks on US abortion doctors)
OMG.
sandy hon...911 was an inside job. W is more of a terrorist than any muslim could ever pray to be. and all in the name of god...of course.