UFO Crash Site

phlogistician said:
BUT, if you mean that ALL world govts conspire to cover up evidence of aliens, well, that just doesn't fly. For that to be the case, firstly, they'd all have to agree, and see this one issue as mutually beneficial to all, and that would just not happen. I don't think there is a single other issue known, which can illustrate that ALL world govts can agree and co-operate. So, no precedent there.
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Not all governmets hide UFO information Belgin, France and Russia just to name a few. They have went public on many occasions.

phlogistician said:
But lately? Well, technology is inexspensive, and pervasise, and not just the remit of the Military, or Govt. (ie Stealth bombers can be detected using mobile phone mast arrays.)
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Sure if you have the pilots cell phone number you just call him up and ask him where he is.

phlogistician said:
People have camcorders, cameras, mobile phones, the internet. There's just no way any Govt could suppress this information anymore, if we're still being visited. We'd have good quality pictures, video, the govt couldn't stop it..
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And they do not stop it. Here is a pretty good video.

http://switchboard.real.com/player/...ownload.akamai.com/5022/clips/RomanekUFO1.ram

And if you want to check out the exlaination of the video.

http://www.neilslade.com/ufos.html

phlogistician said:
So, just how do all world govts work around these obstacles?
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Not all governments hide this information. Our government in the United States well secrecy is the order of the day. We have more evidence and technowledgy than any other government in my oppinion. We do share our secrets with our close alies. And now I think we are finnaly going to see materials with nano technowledgy that are the same as were discribed in the Roswell incident 50 years ago. So I think secrets are only kept by our government untill they are no longer usefull. If they are hiding technowledgy or evidence of a recovered ETV then it probobly is to the government a matter of national security. The issue of ET's is grater that national security and many great men are working to bring out the truth and they will prevail.
 
Starman said:
We do share our secrets with our close alies.
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Then Canada must not be a "close ally" because, as I said before, the Canadian government is utterly incapable of keeping that kind of secret.
We have no state-of-the-art military technology, so we have no deep, dark military secrets, so we have no experience at keeping secrets.

If the US was sharing those secrets with us, you can bet they'd wind up in the trunk of somebody's car at a hockey game.
 
There is more physical evidence to suggest that Wilbert Smith was cognatively influenced by the advanced cancer he had than actually in "contact with aliens," a claim which he made on more than one occasion.

If memory serves correct, this was the guy in the late 50's or early 60's that believed there were regions of loose "binding" in the atmosphere and that he could build a meter to detect these regions and thus prevent aircraft accidents. Of all the aircraft accidents that have occurred in the United States since 1960, do you know how many were attributed to "misadventure with loose binding material of the atmosphere?"

Anybody with delusions can sign memos to other people... that doesn't mean other people aren't taking him with a grain of salt.
 
Starman said:
Not all governmets hide UFO information Belgin, France and Russia just to name a few. They have went public on many occasions.
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I presume you mean 'Belgium' and no, those countries haven't gone 'public' and officially declared the existence of UFOs at all. A few people from those countries have made some claims. Big deal.


Here is a pretty good video.
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'pretty good'? It's crap! The usual zoomed in, no landscape features for scale, camera shake drivel we're alway offered. Utter rubbish. It's impossible to get an idea of scale, or realtive motion from that clip. Know Why? Because the hoaxer can't his model big enough, or move like a UFO, so they zoom in so you can't compare it's size to anything, and can't tell if it's moving, because we have no reference.


Not all governments hide this information.
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So how come aliens aren't proven then, and we don't have the evidence from one of these non conspiratorial countries?
 
phlogistician said:
I presume you mean 'Belgium' and no, those countries haven't gone 'public' and officially declared the existence of UFOs at all. A few people from those countries have made some claims. Big deal.
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Here is Belgium going public.
http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc473.htm

phlogistician said:
So how come aliens aren't proven then, and we don't have the evidence from one of these non conspiratorial countries?
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Here is the French going public.
http://www.virtuallystrange.net/ufo/updates/1999/jul/m21-007.shtml
 
The one thing that tends to be neglected about any forms of report submitted about "aliens" is the overexhausted biase that the reporters tend to have. No mention is ever made towards the underhanding black projects that go on involving espionage and Mindcontrol techniques. If it was all to be drawn out into the open you'll find that half of the kooks that think they have been speaking to aliens have actually been part of some weird National Security psychological experiment, and the "aliens" are more likely to be "handlers".
 
Starman said:
Here is Belgium going public.

Here is the French going public.
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Nope, that's a couple of crank websites. They DO NOT speak for the Belgian or French governments!

If you'd linked to an offical source, on a govt web site, that declared 'we have proof aliens exist' that would be 'going public' but all you have, is a report about a radar anomaly.
 
phlogistician said:
Nope, that's a couple of crank websites. They DO NOT speak for the Belgian or French governments!

If you'd linked to an offical source, on a govt web site, that declared 'we have proof aliens exist' that would be 'going public' but all you have, is a report about a radar anomaly.
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Phlogistician the Belgian government went public when the as you say radar anomaly occurred in the AP. This made national news in the United States. It was not evidence of Extra Terrestrials it was evidence of a UFO. It was caught on radar performing maneuvers and traveling at speeds that are incapable of our known flight vehicles of today. If you want evidence of a government coming forth with evidence of an ET or Alien as you put it, well I have not seen this as of yet.

The COMETA report was not meant for the public. It's purpose was to brief the French Government on the topic of UFO's. This report has not been translated in English that I know of but that is not important. The people who wrote the report were a very credible members of the French Government past and present. What is important is that the report was generated by a non bias group that came to the conclusion UFO's are real. Now this report was taken seriously by the highest members of the French Government if you do not want to take it seriously well that is up to you.
 
Starman, you completely miss the point that these conclusions drawn by third parties on crank web sites from these reports are not acknowledged by the relevant governments.

I could write a report, about anything, but that doesn't mean my employers, whoever they are, or have been, endorse it.

See, George W. Bush believes in God. That doesn't make god more credible. It's not _who_ wrote the report, it's the evidence.

And yes, UFOs are real, they are secret aircraft. So don't hide behind terms. I accept that people sometime see craft that they can't identify, and am confident they are all terrestrial in origin. But they are not aliens. Accepting they are secret aircraft is no mystery, is it, so what are you claiming UFOs to be?
 
Phlogistician said:

See, George W. Bush believes in God. That doesn't make god more credible. It's not _who_ wrote the report, it's the evidence.
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Indeed. Yesterday I was trying to catch up on a story about prayer and in-vitro fertilization. The study is discredited now, though a couple of prestigious people had their names on it, including the former chair of Columbia University's OB-GYN department.

The triangles, especially, I think are terrestrial objects. One must wonder at the effort of retooling the factory inside Phobos to change from cigars to saucers to flying wings to triangles. If I'm not mistaken, Borg cubes are next.
 
Yeah, I actually picked up the story for a "Science and Society" topic. Seems I missed yours.

Whoops.
 
phlogistician said:
And yes, UFOs are real, they are secret aircraft. So don't hide behind terms. I accept that people sometime see craft that they can't identify, and am confident they are all terrestrial in origin. But they are not aliens. Accepting they are secret aircraft is no mystery, is it, so what are you claiming UFOs to be?
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I would say that UFO's are Unidentified Flying Objects and I would put forth that they are just that, "Unidentified" so for you to make a claim that they are secret aircraft of Terrestrial origin would be just as difficult to prove as Extra Terrestrial origin. So as to not to misuse the term "UFO" the object is not identified. Aliens are people from outside the Country of Origin. If you wish to refer to intelligent life forms from other planets that support life I would call them ET's or Extra Terrestrials and their space craft I would term, ETV's as our government refers to them Extra Terrestrial Vehicles.
 
SkinWalker said:
Are you talking about region 1, 2, or 3 in the pic below?

<img src="/attachment.php?attachmentid=3565&stc=1>
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And getting back to this thread what is known is object #3 is an Antena at the site and object #2 is a road that leads up the front of the hill to the crest of the hill. I am looking for anyone who can do an in-depth photo analysis of this image or someone who can obtain better imagery of this object #1 the exact Long and Lat are as follows

Lat 32.4647709
Long -106.50210
 
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Starman said:
I would say that UFO's are Unidentified Flying Objects and I would put forth that they are just that, "Unidentified" so for you to make a claim that they are secret aircraft of Terrestrial origin would be just as difficult to prove as Extra Terrestrial origin. [/quote[

No, it's not hard for me to prove at all. Lockheed 'Skunkworks', produces many and various secret advanced aircraft prototypes. There, I've demostrated that there _are_ secret aircraft manufacturing facilities. So some things in the sky are piloted, terrestrial craft, and 'unidentified' because they are secret, and we aren't supposed to know what they are. Case proven, I think.


So as to not to misuse the term "UFO" the object is not identified.
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By whom? You are suffering a logical failure here I fear. If these UFOs are not natural phenomena, stars, planets, ball lightning or whatever, and are piloted aircraft, _somebody_ knows what they are! The pilot, for one, be they terrestrial or ET! So therefore the only truly 'unidentified' objects are natural phenomena, because that identification relies solely on the observer!


Aliens are people from outside the Country of Origin.
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That a rather US biased perspective. In the UK, we call people who aren't from the UK 'foreigners' mostly, and reserve the word 'aliens' for people who aren't from this planet more often. But, we need a common frame of reference, so if you prefer, I'll use the term ET.


If you wish to refer to intelligent life forms from other planets that support life I would call them ET's or Extra Terrestrials and their space craft I would term, ETV's as our government refers to them Extra Terrestrial Vehicles.
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So are you saying UFOs are ETVs?

What are you saying?
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phlogistician said:
By whom? You are suffering a logical failure here I fear. If these UFOs are not natural phenomena, stars, planets, ball lightning or whatever, and are piloted aircraft, _somebody_ knows what they are! The pilot, for one, be they terrestrial or ET! So therefore the only truly 'unidentified' objects are natural phenomena, because that identification relies solely on the observer!
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Oh, dear, phlogistician, you have me leaping to starman's defence. While in strict logical terms what you say above is correct, in practical terms it is nonsense. The term UFO is conventionally, and consistently, used from the perspective of the observer(s) reporting it. If they cannot identify it, and it is flying, then it is a UFO.
 
Ophiolite said:
Oh, dear, phlogistician, you have me leaping to starman's defence. ....
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I know I'm being picky, but Starman seemed to be ruling out terrestrial craft as being unidentified, merely because they are terrestrial, and therefore that someone knows what they are, so they don't qualify.

I was pointing out that the same goes for non-terrestrial craft too.

If that's not what Starman meant, maybe a more precise definition of his beliefs would help us all.
 
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