Three Experiments Challenging SRT

Hi OnlyMe. Mainly from the above, I think I understand relativistic effects in terms of gravitational fields and time dilation thereof. So thanks for that.

I'm trying to get my mind around velocity (SR) and acceleration (GR), and I'm not clear on whether orbital motion is considered velocity or acceleration.

As you and others discuss orbital motion of atomic clocks in terms of SR, that would indicate velocity, however, I thought from previous posts (though I could be mistaken) that SR involves velocity in a straight line only. Could you please clear up this point ?

Also, underlined by me above; out of interest, what is your philosophical perspective ?

In general, one would think of the curved path of an object as accelerating and thus subject to being addressed within the context of the equivalence principle. Objects orbiting a gravitational mass are also subject to the gravitational field of that mass. This presents a special case where the gravitational "force", "pulling" the object toward the center of mass of the gravitational field, is exactly balanced by the centrifugal force, acting on the object in direct opposition to gravity. The result is that the two cancel each other out and the object experiences a free fall state.

Note, the centrifugal force is a ficticiuos force. The functional force is an object's inertial resistance to the constant and in the case of an orbit uniform acceleration toward the gravitational center of mass. This is the same as the force the object would experience were it to be under a constant and uniform acceleration along a single line of motion, and thus as per the equivalence principle, indistinguishable from the force of gravity.​

So the velocity of the object in that curved path time dilates it in a manner consistent with SR, or slows it's clock accordingly.

It is important to keep in mind that while the free fall conditions resulting by a balance between the force of gravity and the centrifugal force, eliminates any time dilation due to the acceleration associated with the curved orbital path, the object is still in a location in the gravitational field where the field is weaker than it would be on the surface, of say the planet it is orbiting, so its clock will run faster than it would on the planet's surface, thus time dilated in a manner consistent with GR.

I added the philosophical disclaimer in my earlier post, because trying to explain these issues in "words" and or lay terms almost always involves analogy and some philosophical perspective or context. I was attempting to emphasize that the conceptual models described, in these posts are not exactly equivalent to the conceptual model(s) of a rigous mathematical description. An example, in lay terms I say gravity pulls objects.., while that is an accurate classical description, it is not an entirely accurate description within the context of GR. It is just the best I can do, without getting far too complex to address the basic ideas, as simply as possible.

Also keep in mind that what I am attempting to describe, winds up being a very rough sketch... An introduction that can then be improved on, by some of the more technical descriptions.
 
In general, one would think of the curved path of an object as accelerating and thus subject to being addressed within the context of the equivalence principle. Objects orbiting a gravitational mass are also subject to the gravitational field of that mass. This presents a special case where the gravitational "force", "pulling" the object toward the center of mass of the gravitational field, is exactly balanced by the centrifugal force, acting on the object in direct opposition to gravity. The result is that the two cancel each other out and the object experiences a free fall state.

Note, the centrifugal force is a ficticiuos force. The functional force is an object's inertial resistance to the constant and in the case of an orbit uniform acceleration toward the gravitational center of mass. This is the same as the force the object would experience were it to be under a constant and uniform acceleration along a single line of motion, and thus as per the equivalence principle, indistinguishable from the force of gravity.​

So the velocity of the object in that curved path time dilates it in a manner consistent with SR, or slows it's clock accordingly.

It is important to keep in mind that while the free fall conditions resulting by a balance between the force of gravity and the centrifugal force, eliminates any time dilation due to the acceleration associated with the curved orbital path, the object is still in a location in the gravitational field where the field is weaker than it would be on the surface, of say the planet it is orbiting, so its clock will run faster than it would on the planet's surface, thus time dilated in a manner consistent with GR.

I added the philosophical disclaimer in my earlier post, because trying to explain these issues in "words" and or lay terms almost always involves analogy and some philosophical perspective or context. I was attempting to emphasize that the conceptual models described, in these posts are not exactly equivalent to the conceptual model(s) of a rigous mathematical description. An example, in lay terms I say gravity pulls objects.., while that is an accurate classical description, it is not an entirely accurate description within the context of GR. It is just the best I can do, without getting far too complex to address the basic ideas, as simply as possible.

Also keep in mind that what I am attempting to describe, winds up being a very rough sketch... An introduction that can then be improved on, by some of the more technical descriptions.

Hi OM; it seems a lot harder to get from gravitational time dilation to time dilation in terms of SR. I suppose I can only keep thinking about it, keep reading, keep contemplating the many and varied arguements here, and hopefully, form some clearer views in due course. Thanks for your help thus far.
 
That's a rather odd position to be in. You have such emphatic views on SR yet you haven't thought about GR long enough ? Odd !
Special Theory of Relativity destroyed (both theoretically and experimentally), but it is in physics will do not change anything:
As teached SRT in universities, so will teach this nonsense again.
Relativistic nonsense of Einstein printed in a references, so it will be printed in the future.
This is because science is fully controlled PRasts.
They do not allow to replace SRT to something else, if this other author of SOMETHING is not "God's chosen" clubman.

So there is no point in discussing gravity.

I'm throwed in the garbage disposal my manuscripts in the last year.
My research library will behind the manuscripts, if I can not find who wants to pick up my books.

Master Theory should be seen as an attempt (outgoing) to shut the door with a bang.

As long as the scientific community did not get rid of the domination and oppression of gangs of PRasts, Science in science will not be!
==============

Специальная теория Относительности уничтожена (как теоретически, так и экспериментально), но это в физике ничего не изменит:
В университетах как преподавали SRT, так и будут преподавать эту чушь.
В справочниках чушь релятивистская как печаталась, так она и будет печататься впредь.
Это потому, что наука полностью находится под контролем пиарастов.
Они не позволят заменить SRT на что-то другое, если этому ДРУГОМУ автор не представитель клуба избранных.

Поэтому нет никакого смысла обсуждать гравитацию.
Я ещё в прошлом году в мусоропровод отправил свои рукописи.
Моя научная библиотека пойдёт следом за рукописями, если я не найду желающего забрать мои книги.

Master Theory следует рассматривать как попытку (уходя) громко хлопнуть дверью.

До тех пор, пока научная общественность не избавится от засилья и притеснений банд пиарастов, Науки в науке не будет!
 
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Special Theory of Relativity destroyed (both theoretically and experimentally), but it is in physics will do not change anything:
As teached SRT in universities, so will teach this nonsense again.
Relativistic nonsense of Einstein printed in a references, so it will be printed in the future.
This is because science is fully controlled PRasts.
They do not allow to replace SRT to something else, if this other author of SOMETHING is not "God's chosen" clubman.

So there is no point in discussing gravity.

I'm throwed in the garbage disposal my manuscripts in the last year.
My research library will behind the manuscripts, if I can not find who wants to pick up my books.

Master Theory should be seen as an attempt (outgoing) to shut the door with a bang.

As long as the scientific community did not get rid of the domination and oppression of gangs of PRasts, Science in science will not be!

What can I say ? Not much. I did manage to come to terms with gravitational time dilation after some good help from others. I've been trying to do the same with SR these last few days, and doing my own research on it too, and I just can't get there. I can get no concept, even by analogy, that an objects time is dilated if it moves relative to me, at a constant speed.

I however, am most uneducated in these areas, therefore, have no right to call it BS as you do. Thus I reserve judgement, keep my own counsel, and keep thinking. Sooner or later, maybe something will happen.

Tell me, do you have a version of this master theory that you speak a lot about, in laymans terms ?
 

Made a post here yesterday, though it got lost or is on some moderator queue .. somewhere, along the lines of;

OK, had a look at that thread. The maths is way beyond me but I've downloaded all pages to read and see if I can learn anything.

Further;

1) Does anyone know of a non mathematical explanation of 'master theory' ?

2) Is Masterov banned ? It doesn't appear so, as he would have a line thru his name ?
 
I'm sick.
I'm dying at the moment (maybe).
======================

ß áîëåí.
Óìèðàþ â äàííûé ìîìåíò (êàæåòñÿ).
 
I'm sorry to heat that, it sounds terrible! I hope you get well.

Take care.
 
Waiting of END are tiring.
But to sit at the computer I do not have the strength too.
I will try nonetheless.
-------------------------

Please note that I offer you the only ones opening which for physicists (in my opinion) would have to be ashamed.
I intend to publish only the discovery of this type (much as I can).

I have other opening.
But I'm not going to expound them.
Mankind will make these discoveries in the future (maybe).

This is my protest against the domination of Nazi gangs that occupy academic institutions around the world.

My publications on this forum have the goal to draw your attention to the deplorable state of the science (not just physics).
Science is in deep crisis.
The crisis in science is due to the fact that science is occupied by Nazi lobby that lobbies scientific theories, the authors of which are members of Jewry, which in their environment cultivates chauvinist ideas chosen by God.

Einstein's theory is the symbol and proof that the Jews - the most intelligent among us, that is proof of God's chosen people and the exclusivity of the Jewish nation.
Therefore, the Jewish lobby was used to protect SRT methods that scientists use is not accepted.
Moreover, I think that such methods immoral and despicable.

For example: in this forum repeatedly offered complicated mathematical computations, devoid of any logical content that are designed only for drown a scientific discussion in empty polemics.
And that's not the most sneaky method that the Jewish lobby was used to protect the theories of Einstein.
========================

Ожидание конца утомительно.
Но и сидеть за компьютером я сил не имею.
Буду пробовать тем не менее.
-------------------------

Обратите внимание на то, что я предлагал вашему вниманию лишь те открытия, за которые физикам должно было бы быть стыдно (по моему мнению).
Я намерен публиковать лишь открытия этого типа (сколько успею).

Я имею другие открытия.
Но я излагать их не стану.
Человечество сделает эти открытия в будущем (возможно).

Это мой протест против засилья нацистских банд, которые оккупировали научные учреждения по всему миру.

Мои публикации на этом форуме имеют цель, чтобы обратить ваше внимание на плачевное состояние науки (не только физики).
Наука находится в глубочайшем кризисе.
Кризис в науке является следствием того, что наука оккупирована нацистским лобби, которое лоббирует научные теории, авторами которых являются представители национальности, которая в своей среде культивирует шовинистические идеи богоизбранности.

Теория Эйнштейна является символом и доказательством того, что евреи – самые умные среди нас, что является доказательством богоизбранности и исключительности еврейской нации.
Поэтому еврейское лобби применяет для защиты SRT методы, которые в науке применять не принято.
Более того, я считаю такие методы аморальными и подлыми.

Для примера: на этом форуме многократно предлагались громоздкие математические выкладки, лишенные какого либо логического содержания, которые предназначены лишь для того, чтобы утопить научную дискуссию в пустой полемике.
И это еще не саамы подлый метод, который еврейское лобби применяет для защиты теорий Эйнштейна.
 
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This is my protest against the domination of Nazi gangs that occupy academic institutions around the world.

Really? Nazis? You say some of the damn dumbest things...:bugeye:

My publications on this forum have the goal to draw your attention to the deplorable state of the science (not just physics).

Your publications only draw attention to your deplorable understanding of physics - uh, and reality in general.

Science is in deep crisis.
The crisis in science is due to the fact that science is occupied by Nazi lobby that lobbies scientific theories, the authors of which are members of Jewry, which in their environment cultivates chauvinist ideas chosen by God.

Have you lost your mind?

Einstein's theory is the symbol and proof that the Jews - the most intelligent among us, that is proof of God's chosen people and the exclusivity of the Jewish nation.
Therefore, the Jewish lobby was used to protect SRT methods that scientists use is not accepted.
Moreover, I think that such methods immoral and despicable.

Yes, apparently you have.

For example: in this forum repeatedly offered complicated mathematical computations, devoid of any logical content that are designed only for drown a scientific discussion in empty polemics.
And that's not the most sneaky method that the Jewish lobby was used to protect the theories of Einstein.

No understanding of science and a bigot - what a lovely set of characteristics to bring to a science forum. I find you rather pathetic.
 
No understanding of science and a bigot
Gone through so many threads, I can't remember who posted this link and what thread it was in.
RJBerry comes to mind- although he may have been responding to the poster that posted the link.
Oh well... The link:
http://mathpages.com/home/kmath024/kmath024.htm

Rather than own up up to ones own faults, it's far better to blame the jews.
Then call them Nazi's.


I think I preferred Dingle. At least he was a bit more refined.
 
Really? Nazis? You say some of the damn dumbest things...:bugeye:



Your publications only draw attention to your deplorable understanding of physics - uh, and reality in general.



Have you lost your mind?



Yes, apparently you have.



No understanding of science and a bigot - what a lovely set of characteristics to bring to a science forum. I find you rather pathetic.

It surprises me that 'blatant bigoted lies' are allowed to be published in this forum.
 
This is my protest against the domination of Nazi gangs that occupy academic institutions around the world.
I find it detestable you can accuse people like myself of being in or in somehow a part of 'Nazi gangs'. You're a failure and you're trying to convince yourself otherwise and you're quite happy to make up such nonsense. What a terrible human being you are. I myself am not Jewish but physics is an area which, compared to the population at large, has a higher than average number of people of Jewish descent. The history of the 20th century physics community is littered with Jewish people, many of whom fled Nazi attacks in World War II. As such I would imagine many of them or the Jewish people currently in physics would find such comments from you disgusting.

Congratulations, you're detestable as well as dishonest and delusional.
 
@Masterov,
I hope you are aware that you have just destroyed any possible credibility that your theories may have had?
To me it is obvious that in frustration of your agenda you have now resorted to significant racisim in the vain hope that you will inflict some pain upon those you accuse.
Of course for those you accuse to suffer as you wish them to, they would have to exist wouldn't they?

Any imaginary Nazi's or Jews hiding in the closet or maybe they are under your bed?
 
@Masterov,
I hope you are aware that you have just destroyed any possible credibility that your theories may have had?
To me it is obvious that in frustration of your agenda you have now resorted to significant racisim in the vain hope that you will inflict some pain upon those you accuse.
Of course for those you accuse to suffer as you wish them to, they would have to exist wouldn't they?

Any imaginary Nazi's or Jews hiding in the closet or maybe they are under your bed?

I hope you are aware that you have just destroyed any possible credibility that your theories may have had?

Seems like a plan !
 
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