The Universe has no beginning, and No End.

[draqon]

This whole universe is cyclical because its elements follow cyclical patterns.

In world of life starting from very small scale, the cycles can be seen in cells such as Krebs Cycle pictured here:

Following and increasing the scale of elements of the universe, the cycle of life on Earth and cycle of nutrients for life such as Nitrogen Cycle pictured here:

Further increasing the scale of elements of the universe (that includes even more cycles of its own in itself) is a cycle of star system formation pictured here:

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Don't you see that everything in universe is made of cycles of its own? The universe is a cycle of itself!

 

[Dywyddyr]

you are wrong. An asumption that universe is cyclical in time, is as correct as assumption of string nature of universe.

Really?
So which bit of science assumes the universe is cyclical?
Or even works on the idea?

 

[draqon]

described it above

 

[Dywyddyr]

Nope.
The universe being cyclical means that it swings through being there, ends and restarts.
Or am I just reading your bad English wrongly and it isn't what you meant?
That diagram also doesn't say anything about stars dying - how cyclical is when a star dies and everything around it just goes cold? How does the cycle restart?

 

[MacGyver1968]

So goes the way of woo...


This thread needs a good kittening..

for you viewing pleasure, a really cute kitten:

 

[Trippy]

∞ has no end and no beginning if you follow the line, yet it shape is clearly defined with a beginning and an end.

Congratulations.

You missed the point.

 

[Dywyddyr]

So goes the way of woo...
This thread needs a good kittening..
for you viewing pleasure, a really cute kitten:

Kittens are cyclic!
Mine used to spend hours going in circles trying to catch its own tail.

 

[Pincho Paxton]

what though stops the expansion ? gravity ? not so far

The second alternative is that the Universe expands in a circle back to the beginning, but I look at Galaxies, and they look complete to me without needing a Universe model. Just lots of Galaxies. So each Galaxy is a micro-Universe.

 

[Dywyddyr]

The second alternative is that the Universe expands in a circle back to the beginning.

A circle?
In (at least) four dimensions?
Please show us.

 

[Pincho Paxton]

A circle?
In (at least) four dimensions?
Please show us.

No, just 3 Dimensions, time is a description that can't be drawn similar to your version of Gravity. It's easy to draw a circular formation of bubbles. Why do I keep saying bubbles? Because of size limitations. There is not infinity unless you group lots of things together, and call them 1 thing. The Universe is a group of things we give 1 name. Each of these things has a size limit. Each size limit is a bubble. Each bubble has to join to the last. When bubbles join together in a membrane they have to follow the membrane circumference. A membrane circumference is a circle.

 

[Dywyddyr]

No, just 3 Dimensions

So show us a circle in three dimensions.

Because of size limitations.

Which come from...?

There is not infinity unless you group lots of things together, and call them 1 thing.

Er. Could you put that into English?

When bubbles join together in a membrane they have to follow the membrane circumference. A membrane circumference is a circle.

An infinite number of circles, forming a sphere.

 

[Pincho Paxton]

Here is the Joining of the Universe at both ends....

Size limitations come from tension breaks.

Infinity is the combination of many things. You could have infinite marbles, but you can't have an infinite marble.

 

[Grim_Reaper]

Here is the Joining of the Universe at both ends....

Size limitations come from tension breaks.

Infinity is the combination of many things. You could have infinite marbles, but you can't have an infinite marble.

So you are depicting the universe as a set of marbles what about the space between the marbles what about that in your depiction you should be showing the marbles over lapping and filling the voids. But this would then present a problem or universal over lap what would stop one universe from consuming the other.

 

[Pincho Paxton]

I have sort of cheated to show this example, it should really be another spiral like a galaxy, but I just wanted to depict what a circular Universe would look like. But it is possible if the tension is impossible to push further.

 

[Grim_Reaper]

Still even in the spiral what about the space between them

 

[Pincho Paxton]

Still even in the spiral what about the space between them

I think you mean the membranes. When they touch they create a Nebula (pretty colours) Also a hole in the middle between two bubbles. That's the tension break, and I think it's a Black Hole. If you mean what's in the middle of my example.. pressure that is so high that nothing can push its way into it, same with the outside. If this situation was still growing after the bubbles had joined together, then the whole lot would explode. This would relieve the pressure in the middle, so everything would collapse into the middle. I don't really think that the pressure would allow the bubbles to crush each other however, because the limit to crush them all would be probably exactly balanced with the limit to expand into a spiral. So the Universe just stops growing.

 

[Grim_Reaper]

No I mean when you place a spherical object next to another one you get a space between it. And if as you say the surface tension is great enough they will fill in the void and that is where the universal over lap will happen. What you are explaining cant happen there would be ripples in space and time there would be one universe bleeding into the other. I suggest you may perhaps be a victim of a very over active imagination or ou have been watching to much Fringe,

 

[Pincho Paxton]

No I mean when you place a spherical object next to another one you get a space between it. And if as you say the surface tension is great enough they will fill in the void and that is where the universal over lap will happen. What you are explaining cant happen there would be ripples in space and time there would be one universe bleeding into the other. I suggest you may perhaps be a victim of a very over active imagination or ou have been watching to much Fringe,

Yes I have universal material bleeding into the next. I don't have an infinite Black Hole situation. I remove the infinite, and get bleeding instead. Well more like vortex really. I Don't leave them spherical either, I squash them, but that would take too long to draw. I'll try to draw the equal pressures that build up the next bubble.

 

[Pincho Paxton]

This is how I think the bubbles develop (well not completely, I still need to think about it)....

 

[Grim_Reaper]

But outside of the sphere you have space what is that space and if the bleeding occurs there would be tears in space and time you would experience several times and places at once that is not possible.