The Persecuted Atheist

[swarm]

Among the 8 children in my sweetie's and my immediate family, only 1 was conceived in wedlock.

 

[leopold]

I've been around this planet for a long, long time, and I've never even heard of an atheist being harassed or persecuted for his lack of faith. Who does that? Even the most religious people I know wouldn't do that.

Baron Max

i've seen plenty of "religious" people walk up and down the streets banging on doors to get people "to believe".
i've personally been the victim of such harassment.
i have even intentionally insulted these people so they would leave me and my family alone to no avail.

 

[leopold]

Among the 8 children in my sweetie's and my immediate family, only 1 was conceived in wedlock.

you'll burn in hell heathen!

 

[Oli]

Didn't a recent US president make some comment along the lines of "atheists shouldn't be considered as citizens"?
I'd sorta class that as harassment, big time.

 

[mikenostic]

Among the 8 children in my sweetie's and my immediate family, only 1 was conceived in wedlock.

Grow a spine dude. You sound like a woman with those pet names.

Yes I have and you have never met some of my relatives and their friends. I have been threatened, harassed, my son nearly drowned by my very own relatives in their attempt to baptise him and save his soul from my evil Godless self.

I'm more or less quite agnostic, live in Nashville, TN(middle of the bible belt), and have never had something like that happen to me. Let some theistic MF try that crap with me.

 

[Bells]

Grow a spine dude. You sound like a woman with those pet names.

I suppose it would have been more manly of him if he had called his other half his "bitch".

I'm more or less quite agnostic, live in Nashville, TN(middle of the bible belt), and have never had something like that happen to me. Let some theistic MF try that crap with me.

To understand how, you need to understand the why, basically. The relatives in question had newly discovered "Jeeeesus". And they saw it as their mission to save anyone and everyone. They went door knocking to save people. Prayed on people and apparently performed exorcisms to save people. I was their perfect target. An atheist in their family who loved and trusted them since childhood (we had grown up together basically). So they saw it as their duty to 'save me and take me to Jeeessuuuss".

We are talking about previously intelligent and vibrant human beings who now kneel down in front of their TV's with their hands on said TV, praising God and Jesus, while watching Benny Hinn. They have destroyed all of their DVD's that were normal movies and replaced them with prayer and Christian DVD's. They no longer watch the news, but have subscribed to a Christian TV station and watch it 24/7. And they, in their Jesus addled brain, thought that I must be saved from Satan. They think that I am going to hell, that I am an agent of Satan, that my children are doomed to pain and suffering because they "spawned from my loins" (<<< those words were actually said to me by my cousin after I nearly died giving birth to my second child.. because apparently, it wouldn't have happened if I believed in God). So I am a spawn of Satan and my children are a spawn of me.

It would be amusing if it weren't so fucking depressing.

 

[Oli]

So I am a spawn of Satan

Thank god for that!

 

[Roman]

btw, the religious are only persecuted by the religious.

So you are religious, then?

NOTE Sam, the U.S. and the West will not tolerate tyranny, oppression and terrorism.

lolololol
Get a clue, dude.

I come from, what most people would call, a fairly conservative and quite religious family (my dad's side), though my mother's side were moderate-to-liberal Republicans (Barry Goldwater style) who are not religious and my step-mother's side who are uber-liberal.

When I came out (as gay) to my father, we didn't talk for five years. And while we both had to do a bit of growing in order to have a renaissance in our relationship (worth noting that we are now closer than he is to any of my other five siblings), it was harder for him to hear that I had rejected Christianity in favor of no faith at all.

Dealing with my sister's out-of-wedlock pregnancy (which wasn't so scandalous since she was engaged anyway and was going to marry within the year**) and me coming out to him within the same month taught my dad to accept--for the most part--those things that he cannot change, which was a good lesson. This made it easier for me to be open about my non-religiousness. But, I could see in his face a greater sense of despair when I told him that I thought that Christianity was utter nonsense and that most of its adherents were duped.

This past St. Patrick's day I was out with my friends who--as a matter of coincidence I assure you--are all athiests or agnostics (except for one lady), I made the drunken comment that I thought that all religions were a waste of time and space. This resulted in the lone Christian lady (and not just "ho hum, Christian" but "REALLY SUPER CHRISTIAN") telling me, repeatedly for about a minute, how stupid I was and how she used to think that I was smart and that I was going to burn in hell and how stupid I was and that she no longer thought that I was smart and how could I reject what was so obvious and blah... blah... blah... blah.

There are other stories, but I'm more passionate about my rejection of religion than I have ever been about the whole gay thing. Coming out was a no-brainer and took little effort. I mean, I'm gay, it's who I've always been and who I'll always be. The homofobia that has peppered my life has been tolerable and I've been able to adapt quite well to it. But coming out to my family as an atheist has been unbelievably difficult for them and myself. There is, on some level, a choice when it comes to religion and people see that and it concerns them when you reject THEIR choice. My dad is constantly trying to adjust to it. He offends easily when I won't say "amen" at the end of prayers (though out of decorum, I do bow my head and remain silent) and partake in other religious activities. I won't go to church services (like baptisms, where--oddly enough--my younger sister wanted me to be a GOD PARENT) except for weddings.

I refuse to be some obnoxious agnostic/atheist (I'm still trying to define my belief) who is always bitching about how religion permeates society (I really don't care) or how evil Christianity is (people are evil, Christianity just reflects that, non-religious people are just as evil), but I won't partake in a Christian ceremony any more than a [born again] Christian would participate Islamic or Shinto religious ceremonies.

~String

**It's funny that this was such a huge issue, because my eldest uncle was conceived out of wedlock, my eldest sister was conceived out of wedlock, and numerous children of cousins were brought into existence much the same way.

Do you think that you might be overreacting a little bit, or at least a little rude? Religion is as much a set of customs and behaviors that unite people as it is a world view. Being asked to be a god parent isn't so much a religious thing as it is a trust thing. Right? I mean, it's basically asking you to look after her child should it be orphaned.

I have super religious people in my family, and I nod and smile and mumble the Lord's prayer when I have to. There's no sense in being rude about not going to church with them when I'm visiting or whatever.

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

Have you ever been harassed or persecuted because of your lack of faith, Bells?

Baron Max

Hmmm Try the page previous to your post?

I've been around this planet for a long, long time, and I've never even heard of an atheist being harassed or persecuted for his lack of faith.

Baron Max

That's difficult to believe.

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

Didn't a recent US president make some comment along the lines of "atheists shouldn't be considered as citizens"?
I'd sorta class that as harassment, big time.

The 1st President George Bush.

Of course.

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

Grow a spine dude. You sound like a woman with those pet names.

Grow a BRAIN, Rude.

 

[mikenostic]

I suppose it would have been more manly of him if he had called his other half his "bitch".

No. wife/woman/partner/other half/significant other would have sufficed just nicely w/o him emasculating himself.

To understand how, you need to understand the why, basically. The relatives in question had newly discovered "Jeeeesus".
So I am a spawn of Satan and my children are a spawn of me.

It would be amusing if it weren't so fucking depressing.

Funny how I always tend to meet the bitchy, flaky, immature women, but never people like this (well I have met bible thumpers but never ones who were as aggressive as the ones you had to deal with).
Do you still talk to/associate with them?

Grow a BRAIN, Rude.

You've been taking Snappy Comeback lessons from Derek Zoolander, haven't you?
I'm going to go cower in the corner in fear of your exquisite wit.

 

[Bells]

Funny how I always tend to meet the bitchy, flaky, immature women, but never people like this (well I have met bible thumpers but never ones who were as aggressive as the ones you had to deal with).
Do you still talk to/associate with them?

I tried. For sake of "family", I tried. But they are still the same (a bit worse perhaps) and I am still the same in my views. So no, we no longer speak or associate. My parents still see/speak to them often, but I do not. Which saddens me because I still remember what they used to be like. I still remember the people they used to be and to see them now, it does cause some heartache. But you get that I guess. That's life. You can choose your friends, but you can't choose your relatives. I live in the hope for change or a few knocks to their heads to make them see sense.

 

[mikenostic]

I tried. For sake of "family", I tried. But they are still the same (a bit worse perhaps) and I am still the same in my views. So no, we no longer speak or associate. My parents still see/speak to them often, but I do not. Which saddens me because I still remember what they used to be like. I still remember the people they used to be and to see them now, it does cause some heartache. But you get that I guess. That's life.

I think if I knew I wasn't going to speak to them again, I'd go out with a bang by just verbally going the fuck off on them before I left.

You can choose your friends, but you can't choose your relatives. I live in the hope for change or a few knocks to their heads to make them see sense.

True you can't choose your relatives, but you can choose to speak to them or not, as I've had the sad misfortune of having to make that decision a few years ago! Just like you can't really choose who you fall in love with ('cause I know I've fallen for girls I knew that would never work out), but you can choose to not be with them due to the realization of incompatibility.

 

[copernicus66]

“ Nothing as bad as all the terrible trauma that atheists are suffering

"The persecution my people have suffered is greater than the persecution your people have suffered!" For some reason I'm reminded of the Zionists, who tout something similar when they are criticised for their excesses in regards to the Palestinians.

Anyhoo, atheism isn't even acknowledged in a number of Muslim countries.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_against_atheists

In Iran, atheists do not have any recognized status, and must declare that they are Muslim, Christian, Jewish or Zoroastrian, in order to claim some legal rights, including applying for entrance to university,[51] or becoming a lawyer.[52] Similarly, Jordan requires atheists to associate themselves with a recognized religion for official identification purposes,[53] and atheists in Indonesia experience official discrimination in the context of registration of births and marriages, and the issuance of identity cards.[54] In Egypt, intellectuals suspected of holding atheistic beliefs have been prosecuted by judicial and religious authorities. Novelist Alaa Hamad was convicted of publishing a book that contained atheistic ideas and apostasy that were considered to threaten national unity and social peace.[55][56] Compulsory religious instruction in Turkish schools is also considered discriminatory towards atheists.[57]

 

[copernicus66]

And there we have it.

So you wanted to start this thread to tell us atheists that any and all harassment we may have suffered at the hands of others is "ludicrous" because you have this need to compare anything and everything to the pain and horror suffered by victims in war? What you failed to grasp is that none of us would dare compare our harassment/persecution/beatings/etc to what victims of war suffer. Because you can't compare it.


Would you walk into a hospital and tell a dying cancer patient on morphine that their pain is nothing or ludicrous compared to the pain someone could suffer as a result of having a bomb dropped on their house?

I've lived with a number of Muslims over the years, and I've noticed a very disturbing mindset amongst them. In their eyes, atheists are the lowest on the pecking order. Naturally Muslims are at the top, because they believe in Allah the almighty. Next come the Jews and Christians, who while they may not believe in the teachings of Mohammed, are still 'people of the book'. Next come all those crazy backward pagans, but hey, at least they have religious beliefs.

And at the very bottom are the atheists. To lack a belief in a deity is anathema to many Muslims, it's essentially a sign of decadence and a lack of morality. Better to have a belief in some god, any god, than no religious beliefs at all.

 

[copernicus66]

Originally Posted by S.A.M.
Nope, me, I'm only persecuted by being refused apartments for buying, set aside for "security checks" when I fly, being put out of stores for my colour or race, being treated like a terrorist for my name, being affected socially by Wars on Terrorz that get imported to my society.

Given your rabid anti-Western opinions and unashamed apologism in favour of terrorists, perhaps your imagined 'persecution' isn't totally unjustified. Maybe the security at airports can sniff out enemies of the State.

 

[Baron Max]

I've lived with a number of Muslims over the years, and I've noticed a very disturbing mindset amongst them. In their eyes, atheists are the lowest on the pecking order. ...
And at the very bottom are the atheists. .....

But that's hardly defined as harassment or persecution.
How do you see that as persecution?

Baron Max

 

[S.A.M.]

To lack a belief in a deity is anathema to many Muslims, it's essentially a sign of decadence and a lack of morality. Better to have a belief in some god, any god, than no religious beliefs at all.

Generally speaking, thats true. Most Muslims will consider atheists to be completely delusional, although they may not express that opinion. But I've noticed that several atheists share this opinion, about theists. And they are certainly not shy about expressing it. Even the nice ones will come up with a "Thank God I'm not a theist!" occasionally

 

[(Q)]

Most Muslims will consider atheists to be completely delusional

Because they don't swallow Islamic myths and superstitions about gods, angels, splitting moons, afterlifes and flying up to heaven? Or, perhaps it's because atheists don't have "rules of war" as a doctrine?

Yeah, that's delusional.