Dude. Most Muslims are peaceful people, not terrorists.
There was no need for him to wave his religion around in my face. He chose to ask me if I knew a prayer.
The Persecuted Atheist
- Thread starter S.A.M.
- Start date
Dude. Most Muslims are peaceful people, not terrorists.
There was no need for him to wave his religion around in my face. He chose to ask me if I knew a prayer.
AFAIC, the 'peaceful' Muslims that do not adamantly stand against the terrorists that attempt to make the moderates look bad, are no better than the terrorists.
Active terrorists? No. Vocal terrorists or terrorist sympathisers/apologists? A resounding yes!
Bells
Staff member
Which can and does happen to a lot of people.
Again, can and does happen to a lot of people.
Has happened to me as well. Had nothing to do with religion.
Refer to above.
Refer to above.
Do I sense belittling in your tone? Sarcasm?
I am an atheist, as you well know.
Have I been harassed or persecuted? Yes. Mostly from members of my own family. I have been abused, called a plethora of names (whore, slut, amongst many because I was apparently living in sin with my now husband before we were married), told I was the devil's spawn, threatened and abused during a time where I needed the support, all because I did not believe in God. I have had some members of my family come to my home under the pretext of coming to help me during a time of need and then abuse me and harass me to the point where a kindly neighbour heard their yelling abuse at me and came to my aid (I was heavily pregnant and ill at the time and alone since my husband was at work) in forcing them to leave my apartment. I have had members of my family try to baptise my son in their bathtub during a family gathering, by luring him into the bathroom, locking him in the bathroom and forcing his head underwater while chanting prayers. I have been threatened with harm for not believing in God. I have been shunned and ostracised by members of my own family because I am an atheist.
So frankly, your belittling tone is really not appreciated.
I suspect you could write a book on it. I've had similiar experiences which I plan to elaborate on later.
It saddens me to hear such but it's good to get it out.
Thanks.
Only at the perceived levels of harassment that were presented.
Thanks for being forthcoming.
How do you think your experience compares to (Q)? Are they equivalent?
What is your opinion of the persecution that he suffers?
My "tone" was reflective of the sentiment expressed in the OP.
Do you think Muslims do not suffer harassment, persecution or beatings such as you have? Maybe not from immediate family members [I was under the impression that your parents were not so strict?] but definitely at the social level.
So what does that say about those who sit back while their country destabilises peaceful countries? Kills millions? Tortures hundreds? What do they deserve?
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Bells
Staff member
If a person feels or is harassed, do you really need levels or degrees of harassment for it to somehow count?
How can they be? They are not the same. I am not going to say that I am more or less harassed than Q or anyone else is. Why? Because if Q felt harassed, then he felt harassed. It is not for me to say 'well I'm more harassed than you are'.
Only sympathy really. I hate door to door visits from self proclaimed missionaries who are trying to convince me to join their religion. Some are more forceful than others. My own mother was once reduced to tears by one such visit.
I don't quite get what it is you want here. Do you assume that only one particular group is harassed? Should one group get more pity or understanding than another group? Should it only be recognised for one group? Harassment is harassment.
Of course they do. So do homosexuals, people of colour, women, men, children, atheists, Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, Pagans, etc. Do you think being a Muslim you have more right to be aggrieved about your harassment? Do I have more right because I am an atheist? Of course not. That it happens at all shows that people are bigoted one way or another.
My harassers were not my parents, but cousin's who were like my siblings growing up and who 'found Jesus' and now feel the need to force it on everyone and to judge everyone who does not believe as they do. From my parents I just get messages of constant messages of how I am a disappointment because I do not believe in God. But they respect my lack of beliefs and do not attempt to force me into believing again.
WHO said Muslims do not suffer harassment, persecution or beatings???
We'd be much better off if most people had your attitude, Bells.
Beat me to it & said it better than I did.
What country?
And as long as your cousins go around trying to force their supposedly peaceful religion upon people, we will happily go around and destabilize those 'peaceful' (cough cough...Afghanistan/Taliban) countries the way we see fit.
NOTE Sam, the U.S. and the West will not tolerate tyranny, oppression and terrorism.
Like what? Like military troops carpet bombing civilians who follow a non-Muslim way of life? Dropping bombs on weddings and schools? Sending drones to attack people who have no idea where they can go because they are in their own homes?
I find such protestations of harassment incredibly ludicrous. Considering how Americans have sent warships to force people to open their economies, let loose with biological, chemical and nuclear weapons on societies they disagreed with and currently constitute a global military threat with over 1000 bases in foreign countries, not to mention the invasion, occupation, murder and torture that has affected tens of millions in the last 7 years. For you to project yourself as being forced into anything at all is the height of irony.
For atheists who apparently have more power in these countries to consider themselves as persecuted while supporting such regimes [not to mention self proclaiming to be a significant proportion of the people who manufacture the weapons of mass destruction] is even more so.
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i never could understand "baptizing a baby".
how on earth could a baby knowingly accept god?
the spin doctor speaks! all hail the mighty propagandist!
the spin doctor speaks! all hail the mighty propagandist!
To truly appreciate the irony, imagine that was Iran we were talking about and Iran was the US. What would you think?
Who was the real danger?
When theists tell gays that they can't have the same rights as non-gays because their religion says they're bad, that's persecution. When theists tell women that they can't use contraception or have abortions because their religion says its bad, that's persecution. When theists enact laws that don't allow people to buy alcohol because their religion says its bad, that's persecution.
These are just a few examples off the top of my head.
These are just a few examples off the top of my head.
When atheists make gas chambers to perform experiments on entire families simply because they are Christian, thats persecution.
And if I had claimed that atheists never persecute theists, or asked you for examples of theists being persecuted, that would probably be relevant. In your opening post you asked for examples of atheists being persecuted, so I gave you some. WTF is your point?
Edit: Here's an interesting question. As an atheist, I agree that this example of persecution of chrisians is a bad thing and should be ended. SAM, do you feel that the examples that I listed of the persecution of atheists are a bad thing? Or do you support them?
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WHERE in that report is the claim they perform experiments on entire families simply because they are Christian???
superstring01
Moderator
I come from, what most people would call, a fairly conservative and quite religious family (my dad's side), though my mother's side were moderate-to-liberal Republicans (Barry Goldwater style) who are not religious and my step-mother's side who are uber-liberal.
When I came out (as gay) to my father, we didn't talk for five years. And while we both had to do a bit of growing in order to have a renaissance in our relationship (worth noting that we are now closer than he is to any of my other five siblings), it was harder for him to hear that I had rejected Christianity in favor of no faith at all.
Dealing with my sister's out-of-wedlock pregnancy (which wasn't so scandalous since she was engaged anyway and was going to marry within the year**) and me coming out to him within the same month taught my dad to accept--for the most part--those things that he cannot change, which was a good lesson. This made it easier for me to be open about my non-religiousness. But, I could see in his face a greater sense of despair when I told him that I thought that Christianity was utter nonsense and that most of its adherents were duped.
This past St. Patrick's day I was out with my friends who--as a matter of coincidence I assure you--are all athiests or agnostics (except for one lady), I made the drunken comment that I thought that all religions were a waste of time and space. This resulted in the lone Christian lady (and not just "ho hum, Christian" but "REALLY SUPER CHRISTIAN") telling me, repeatedly for about a minute, how stupid I was and how she used to think that I was smart and that I was going to burn in hell and how stupid I was and that she no longer thought that I was smart and how could I reject what was so obvious and blah... blah... blah... blah.
There are other stories, but I'm more passionate about my rejection of religion than I have ever been about the whole gay thing. Coming out was a no-brainer and took little effort. I mean, I'm gay, it's who I've always been and who I'll always be. The homofobia that has peppered my life has been tolerable and I've been able to adapt quite well to it. But coming out to my family as an atheist has been unbelievably difficult for them and myself. There is, on some level, a choice when it comes to religion and people see that and it concerns them when you reject THEIR choice. My dad is constantly trying to adjust to it. He offends easily when I won't say "amen" at the end of prayers (though out of decorum, I do bow my head and remain silent) and partake in other religious activities. I won't go to church services (like baptisms, where--oddly enough--my younger sister wanted me to be a GOD PARENT) except for weddings.
I refuse to be some obnoxious agnostic/atheist (I'm still trying to define my belief) who is always bitching about how religion permeates society (I really don't care) or how evil Christianity is (people are evil, Christianity just reflects that, non-religious people are just as evil), but I won't partake in a Christian ceremony any more than a [born again] Christian would participate Islamic or Shinto religious ceremonies.
~String
**It's funny that this was such a huge issue, because my eldest uncle was conceived out of wedlock, my eldest sister was conceived out of wedlock, and numerous children of cousins were brought into existence much the same way.
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