Reincarnation

[spidergoat]

spidergoat,



What do you mean?

I mean like some objective third party could have gathered all the details the kid remembered and then checked them against the actual place.... before he visited there.

What details could this kid have known that could not have been known or simply guessed at?

individuality?
Does it take a culture to spawn individuals, or, individuals to spawn a culture?

jan.

Neither. True individuality is rare, almost non-existent.

 

[wynn]

The idea of every soul having been the mother and father of
every soul at some time or other.
Who knows, you and I may be the off-spring, of our off-spring.

Buddhism sure has a generously egalitarian doctrine!

 

[wynn]

That's just philosophical pondering, and while we ponder, life passes us by.
Pondering is okay, but the reality is, we have to live, here and now.
Reality comes from how we act, happiness comes from contentment, contentment comes from peace, and peace comes from fullfiling your active potential. Thought, and ponderance is good if it helps us to live such a life, otherwise we waste precious time.

Allright, you win.

 

[Jan Ardena]

Allright, you win.

If winning is obtaining satisfaction, then i can only win if you also win.

jan.

 

[drumbeat]

Hey guys, if you've got some time, check out this video.
I would like hear your thoughts on it.

I have just watched all five parts.

Like spidergoat said, it could have done with more extensive research before he visited the place, but in reality this probably wouldn't have come to much and may have stressed the kid out.

The only things that matched was an island with a family name. All the houses were white, dogs would be common, and its a small island where most live by the sea. It was extremely vague and woolly. There was no-one called Shane and no car accident known.

He could have heard the name of the island on the local news.
He could also have overheard someone talking about someone getting knocked over by a car.
He might have had a nightmare that same night about someone getting knocked over. It could have been scary enough as a 2 year old for him to confuse it with a memory. SO many possibilities.

He did believe he was telling the truth though, which is why it confused adults. As soon as he came back, he was calmer and had seemingly realised his 'other' mum was no longer available, almost like his grieving process was over.

 

[lightgigantic]

You do know that belief in Christianity and belief in reincarnation are incompatible?

never heard of pre-Constantine christioan scholars I take it

 

[lightgigantic]

I really do not need to investigate it more than I have during my lifetime and come to my conclusions about such nonsense. Because I do not think that it even exists is because as to this day no one has ever proven that they are reincarnated except those who BELIEVE they are.

so IOW you have an opinion based on a lack of investigation ... hence your title
:shrug:

 

[drumbeat]

never heard of pre-Constantine christioan scholars I take it

All that link mentions about reincarnation is that there is no evidence that the guy believed in it. Have I missed something?

 

[Jan Ardena]

drumbeat,

I have just watched all five parts.
Like spidergoat said, it could have done with more extensive research before he visited the place, but in reality this probably wouldn't have come to much and may have stressed the kid out.

How do you mean ''extensive research''?
Was the kid lying?
Did the kid's recall seem staged?
What would be the point in setting something like that up?

The only things that matched was an island with a family name.

Which 'IS' evidence?

All the houses were white, dogs would be common, and its a small island where most live by the sea. It was extremely vague and woolly. There was no-one called Shane and no car accident known.

So the kid was lying, let's all pack up and go home.

He could have heard the name of the island on the local news.

So?
Why at the age of 2 would a kid decide to make up
such an elaborate tale, not to mention accurate?

He could also have overheard someone talking about someone getting knocked over by a car.

So he thought;
''hmm! that would give this tale a nice twist, i'll ponder
over this on mummies breast milk.
Wait!
I've been weened of them.
Damned mummy,
from this day forward she's not my mummy anymore.''

Who is this kid?
Stuey?

He might have had a nightmare that same night about someone getting knocked over.

He could have.
But come on!?

It could have been scary enough as a 2 year old for him to confuse it with a memory. SO many possibilities.

And he could be telling it just like it was.
It could have been a past life experience.

I'm not saying it was, it just could have been.
That being said, we can learn from that.
It shouldn't matter that you presently don't believe it.

He did believe he was telling the truth though, which is why it confused adults. As soon as he came back, he was calmer and had seemingly realised his 'other' mum was no longer available, almost like his grieving process was over.

The psychiatrist did say this kind of calm was common in those kind of cases
where kids are concerned. And there are alot of cases.

jan.

 

[drumbeat]

You have completely missed the point.
All those questions are already answered in my post you quoted.

You really do not seem to understand the difference between someone who KNOWS they are saying false things and someone who is saying false things but believes he is telling the truth.

One is mistaken and the other is lying.

 

[wynn]

You really do not seem to understand the difference between someone who KNOWS they are saying false things and someone who is saying false things but believes he is telling the truth.

One is mistaken and the other is lying.

Unless we know what the truth is, we cannot know whether someone is telling the truth, mistaken or lying.

In the case of reincarnation, we do not know what the truth is, so we cannot ascertain whether those who speak of past lives are telling the truth, mistaken or lying..

 

[Jan Ardena]

You have completely missed the point.
All those questions are already answered in my post you quoted.

You really do not seem to understand the difference between someone who KNOWS they are saying false things and someone who is saying false things but believes he is telling the truth.

One is mistaken and the other is lying.

Drumbeat, I hear what you're saying.

My point is, why have you chosen to come to this conclusion.
I mean, your point of view, though remotely possible, is not obvious.
You have racked your brain about this.

Why can't you come to the conclusion that it may be true?

jan.

 

[cosmictraveler]

so IOW you have an opinion based on a lack of investigation ... hence your title
:shrug:

No, I've learned through my life by reading, listening and asking questions about reincarnation. I always kept an open mind about it until I finally came to the realization that those who "claim" to be reincarnated could have found out or just made up everything they said about who they were. I've just waited this long to finally decide that they are not telling the truth, to me, that they can prove, to me, that would satisfy my preequisits about being reincarnated. As I have said already they might "believe" that they were but cannot make me belive they were.

 

[drumbeat]

Drumbeat, I hear what you're saying.
My point is, why have you chosen to come to this conclusion.
I mean, your point of view, though remotely possible, is not obvious.
You have racked your brain about this.
Why can't you come to the conclusion that it may be true?

I really haven't!

It just seems there is so much more plausible causes than jumping straight in and thinking "oh wow he must have had a previous life".

The only thing that matched was the name of a local island, and a very common Scottish family name, both of which could have been picked up from anywhere. Young kids have a very good imagination, it seems to me he is just confusing a dream for a memory.

 

[drumbeat]

Unless we know what the truth is, we cannot know whether someone is telling the truth, mistaken or lying.

In the case of reincarnation, we do not know what the truth is, so we cannot ascertain whether those who speak of past lives are telling the truth, mistaken or lying..

Well generally speaking, yes.
But in the case of Jan and his/her video, the evidence was loose and only the vaguest part of the kids story matched up.

And Jan asked me again and again why I think he's lying when I already said that I don't think he lying, mearly mistaken.

 

[wynn]

And you think that he is mistaken because you don't think there is such a thing as reincarnation?

 

[Me-Ki-Gal]

I mean like some objective third party could have gathered all the details the kid remembered and then checked them against the actual place.... before he visited there.

What details could this kid have known that could not have been known or simply guessed at?




Neither. True individuality is rare, almost non-existent.

Me and you spidy. Except you copy Me!!!

 

[drumbeat]

And you think that he is mistaken because you don't think there is such a thing as reincarnation?

Did you watch it?

 

[Jan Ardena]

spidergoat,

I mean like some objective third party could have gathered all the details the kid remembered and then checked them against the actual place.... before he visited there.

How would that have been more credible, than the method they employed?

What details could this kid have known that could not have been known or simply guessed at?

Do you have children?
Or have you spent time amongst 1,2, and 3 year olds?

Neither. True individuality is rare, almost non-existent.

You say ''almost'' meaning there are individuals.
Who are these people?

jan.

 

[Jan Ardena]

Did you watch it?

Originally Posted by SignalAnd you think that he is mistaken because you don't think there is such a thing as reincarnation?

Question's a goodn'

jan.