Questions on atheist morality

S.A.M. said:
Its atheists who are always talking about the evil theists. Clearly, its time to set some concepts right. According to Varda, rape, incest, murder and torture is "society", which is what all officially atheist societies have descended to, in the absence of religion.
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A question-and-answer session with Imam Abdul Makin in an East London mosque asks why Allah would tell Muslims to kill and rape innocent non-Muslims, including their wives and daughters, according to Islam Watch.

"Because non-Muslims are never innocent, they are guilty of denying Allah and his prophet," the Imam says, according to the report. "If you don't believe me, here is the legal authority, the top Muslim lawyer of Britain."

The lawyer, Anjem Choudary, backs up the Imam's position, saying that all Muslims are innocent.

"You are innocent if you are a Muslim," Choudary tells the BBC. "Then you are innocent in the eyes of God. If you are not a Muslim, then you are guilty of not believing in God."

Choudary said he would not condemn a Muslim for any action.

"As a Muslim, I must support my Muslim brothers and sisters," Choudary said. "I must have hatred to everything that is not Muslim."
 
S.A.M. said:
Religion makes people live together, gives guidelines about how they should treat each other, gives rules for a healthy society. Ideas about incest, rape, torture, murder are derived from religious teachings about what is not good for human society. Ideas about the rightness of charity, sacrifice, treating the stranger as a guest (rather than shooting him on sight) and a necessity of freedom from greed, envy, sloth, jealousy, etc are also derived from religion. Animals may have all these notions but they do not have the moral values that religion ascribes to them.
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Animals don't blow each other up in the name of their gods.
 
(Q) said:
Animals don't blow each other up in the name of their gods.
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You're the one who was supporting shooting one year old terrorists, so I fail to see what relevance your point has here.
 
LOL. One-year old suicide bombers and homicidal monkeys.

Violent crime is anomalously low in secular Scandinavia and inexplicably high in India.

But anyway, you is ALL :crazy:.
 
S.A.M. said:
You're the one who was supporting shooting one year old terrorists, so I fail to see what relevance your point has here.
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Have you ever seen a therapist about your habitual lying? It really is getting out of control.

Didn't you say you weren't in the mood for lying today? Why the change of mind?
 
S.A.M. said:
Religion makes people live together, gives guidelines about how they should treat each other, gives rules for a healthy society. Ideas about incest, rape, torture, murder are derived from religious teachings about what is not good for human society. Ideas about the rightness of charity, sacrifice, treating the stranger as a guest (rather than shooting him on sight) and a necessity of freedom from greed, envy, sloth, jealousy, etc are also derived from religion. Animals may have all these notions but they do not have the moral values that religion ascribes to them.
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you are so deluded
there is war happening everywhere
rapes, murders, child abuse, baby throwings
 
S.A.M. said:
You need to read up on Islam
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And yet, when someone does read up on it, you make the claim that it can't be translated from Arabic and what we're reading is all misinterpretation.

You just can't stop contradicting yourself. Spin round and round, Sam. :runaway:
 
redarmy11 said:
LOL. One-year old suicide bombers and homicidal monkeys.

Violent crime is anomalously low in secular Scandinavia and inexplicably high in India.

But anyway, you is ALL :crazy:.
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The Scandinavians already finished their 300 years of genocide
 
S.A.M. said:
Religion makes people live together, gives guidelines about how they should treat each other, gives rules for a healthy society. Ideas about incest, rape, torture, murder are derived from religious teachings about what is not good for human society. Ideas about the rightness of charity, sacrifice, treating the stranger as a guest (rather than shooting him on sight) and a necessity of freedom from greed, envy, sloth, jealousy, etc are also derived from religion. Animals may have all these notions but they do not have the moral values that religion ascribes to them.
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How does it do this? How are these teaching derived from religion, when the teachings are the religion? Teachings about what is "good for society" can self-evidently be determined by the simple process of figuring out what is good for society.

There is a flaw however, everyone within that society must be the same religion, lest the rules conflict.
 
I dare SAM to tell us that religious rules are superior because God made them, and He has it all figured out. Failing that, the rules are derived as any other, by members of society determining how they would like society to be. No deity is required.
 
(Q) said:
Have you ever seen a therapist about your habitual lying? It really is getting out of control.

Didn't you say you weren't in the mood for lying today? Why the change of mind?
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Here you go:

(Q) said:
It's irrelevant what I think about it. I wasn't there.

Bells and SAM however, appear to be the combat professionals and claim to know the difference between terrorists and 1 year old babies. We should all follow their sage JUDGEMENTS.
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http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?p=1697837#post1697837

Clearly its hard to distinguish one year old babies from terrorists when you break into their homes and deliberately gun them down. One needs to be there and an expert to perform this extremely difficult operation.:mad:
 
spidergoat said:
How does it do this? How are these teaching derived from religion, when the teachings are the religion? Teachings about what is "good for society" can self-evidently be determined by the simple process of figuring out what is good for society.

There is a flaw however, everyone within that society must be the same religion, lest the rules conflict.
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All religions have the same basic rules. They all prescribe methods to live together.
 
Enmos said:
And God is just a way to keep people from straying from those rules ?
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Uh no, it is belief in God that creates society. As soon as a society starts becoming less religious, first, the family starts breaking up, followed by the community and then the society. Everything becomes about the individual.

spidergoat said:
I dare SAM to tell us that religious rules are superior because God made them, and He has it all figured out. Failing that, the rules are derived as any other, by members of society determining how they would like society to be. No deity is required.
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Thats zanna. No one knows why religion creates society.
 
S.A.M. said:
Uh no, it is belief in God that creates society. As soon as a society starts becoming less religious, first, the family starts breaking up, followed by the community and then the society. Everything becomes about the individual.
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And, you have factual information for your assertions?
 
(Q) said:
And, you have factual information for your assertions?
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Empirical

Adolescents in families actively involved in religious activities tend to enjoy stronger family relationships than youths whose families have less or no religious involvement, a new University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill study shows.

The research, part of the larger UNC-based National Study of Youth and Religion, revealed significant statistical links between religion and family ties, said study director Dr. Christian Smith.

"We found that of the 27 family relationship variables we examined for this report, all were significantly related to some dimension of family religious involvement, after controlling for the possible effects of other social and economic factors," said Smith, professor of sociology.
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http://www.unc.edu/news/archives/may03/smith050703.html

But I don't need it. I've seen how India has changed in urban areas and not much has been for the better
 
(Q) said:
From the link:

Note: To reach Smith or for copies of the report, call Roxann Miller, director of communication for the National Study of Youth and Religion, at (919) 966-1559. More information is available at www.youthandreligion.org.

Unbiased empirical evidence.

:roflmao:
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Uh its a study on youth and religion at UNC by the sociology department. The data is available for atheists to reevaluate, if they wish. What would you have them call it? Study on Youth and Nonreligion?

The Lilly Endowment Inc. funds the four-year UNC project, which began in 2001. Among goals are to identify effective practices in the religious, moral and social formation in young people’s lives and to foster informed national discussions about the influence of religion on adolescents.

The U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics sponsored the 1997 National Longitudinal Survey of Youth, which was conducted by the National Opinion Research Center at the University of Chicago.

Here is another:

http://richarddawkins.net/article,923,Study-Religion-is-Good-for-Kids,Melinda-Wenner-Yahoo

Kids with religious parents are better behaved and adjusted than other children, according to a new study that is the first to look at the effects of religion on young child development.

The conflict that arises when parents regularly argue over their faith at home, however, has the opposite effect.

John Bartkowski, a Mississippi State University sociologist and his colleagues asked the parents and teachers of more than 16,000 kids, most of them first-graders, to rate how much self control they believed the kids had, how often they exhibited poor or unhappy behavior and how well they respected and worked with their peers.

The researchers compared these scores to how frequently the children's parents said they attended worship services, talked about religion with their child and argued abut religion in the home.
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Of course, you could simply say that you do not believe any studies conducted by theists. I could similarly refuse to believe any studies conducted by atheists. And then what?
 
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