Proof God Exists

[Jan Ardena]

Dywyddyr,

Not at all.
Since I don't know that omniscience for god and free will for us are claimed in any other religion.

Yes at all.
You don't have to know about ''religions'', as we're not talking about ''religions'', you only need to have a definition of God, and ''Christian'' is not a definition of ''God''.

Still wrong.
I'm pointing out that, according to the claims made in the Bible EITHER god is not omniscient OR we do not have free will.

But while you are using the bible (as pointed out previously), you have not effectively used it
to show that your argument has any merit. Because in the same scripture, we understand that we are part God, and part nature. In the same scripture we understand that God IS pure spirit (not material) meaning part of us must also be pure spirit.

You can't just cherry pick the bit you want, and discard the rest because it fucks up your wafer-thin argument.

Physicality doesn't come into it.

Of course it does.
If there is a part of us that doesn't perish, then we're not what/who we think
we are.

If you'd bothered to read, at all, my argument, that's one possible option. But then again, you tend to argue against what you think you read rather than what is written.

Of course I've read your argument.
Your argument is posted all over the net.
It the only one you've go on that subject, which is why you have suddenly become dumb-struck at the disbelief that someone has actually pointed out
the failure.

This argument may work with fundamental christians and islamists, but then what do you expect from institutionalised religions who by dint of their own doctines are forbidden to accept anything other than the ''official'' interpretation of the scriptures.

Outside of that, it's very easy to break down, as it lacks scriptural research, and thought.

jan.

 

[Dywyddyr]

Yes at all.
You don't have to know about ''religions'', as we're not talking about ''religions'', you only need to have a definition of God, and ''Christian'' is not a definition of ''God''.

Still wrong.
Different religions appear to define god (and his attributes) differently.

But while you are using the bible (as pointed out previously), you have not effectively used it to show that your argument has any merit.

In other words you're now contradicting your earlier claim.

Because in the same scripture, we understand that we are part God, and part nature. In the same scripture we understand that God IS pure spirit (not material) meaning part of us must also be pure spirit.

So what?
Does that mean that logic doesn't apply?

You can't just cherry pick the bit you want, and discard the rest because it fucks up your wafer-thin argument.

And you, apparently, STILL can't actually reply to the argument itself but have make specious complaints.

Of course it does.
If there is a part of us that doesn't perish, then we're not what/who we think
we are.

Wrong again.
Address the argument as presented.

Of course I've read your argument.
Your argument is posted all over the net.
It the only one you've go on that subject, which is why you have suddenly become dumb-struck at the disbelief that someone has actually pointed out
the failure.

You haven't pointed out a failure, at all. All you done is said "because it's that way".

Outside of that, it's very easy to break down, as it lacks scriptural research, and thought.

It doesn't need scriptural research, it's based on two simple claims. And you, as usual, haven't applied any thought.

 

[Arioch]

@Jan --

Stop. Please, for the love of my bleeding eyes and brain cells currently undergoing apoptosis, please stop with the semantics. You're killing me here.

 

[Dywyddyr]

@Jan --

Stop. Please, for the love of my bleeding eyes and brain cells currently undergoing apoptosis, please stop with the semantics. You're killing me here.

Don't ask him to do that!
It what he does, er, best. Actually it's all he does.
Skirt, evade, divert, obscure. Then he works up through misdirection and false claims until he gets to outright lies.

 

[Jan Ardena]

@Jan --

Stop. Please, for the love of my bleeding eyes and brain cells currently undergoing apoptosis, please stop with the semantics. You're killing me here.

Please start understanding things properly then.
If I say to you evolution is only a ''theory'', no doubt you
will proceed to explain to me the difference between the common use of
the word and the scientific meaning of the word.
In other words your intention will be to explain what is meant by it's use.


jan.

 

[Arioch]

@Jan --

There's semantics which are presented as a point of argument(the theory thing you mentioned is as good an example as any), and then there's semantics in place of an argument. What you're doing is the latter.

 

[Jan Ardena]

@Jan --

There's semantics which are presented as a point of argument(the theory thing you mentioned is as good an example as any), and then there's semantics in place of an argument. What you're doing is the latter.

Example?


jan.

 

[Aqueous Id]

Please start understanding things properly then.
If I say to you evolution is only a ''theory'', no doubt you
will proceed to explain to me the difference between the common use of
the word and the scientific meaning of the word.
In other words your intention will be to explain what is meant by it's use.



jan.

I take it you deny theory and/or the theory of evolution?
why?

 

[wynn]

Please start understanding things properly then.

This instant, declare you are Dyw's and Arioch's spiritual master,
or shut up!

 

[chimpkin]

If there is no God and no continuity of the soul, what point is there to life at all?

How would you feel if you accepted that there is no point to life at all?
What within you mentally would fall down if you think that life is entirely pointless?
Yes, try it as an exercise, will you?

 

[Pincho Paxton]

@Pincho --

Ugh, the old "if you can say that it's wrong then you must know what the right answer is" bullshit. The hallmark of an amateur philosopher who's had minimal or no education in the subject. You're the second person today who's tried this line of bullshit on me.

I may not be able to tell you right off the bat what pi over eight is but I can tell you that one and zero are wrong answers. Cut the bullshit and come back to me when you've graduated from grade school.

Lol.. you can do pi on a computer using 1's and zeros, because a computer is binary. And how do you know that pi exists anyway? And if I'm the second person to say this to you, then that tells you something that has nothing to do with philosophy. And swearing every post doesn't make your post any more significant, it makes you seem immature.

 

[kx000]

I am the spiritual leader to Dyw and Arioch of God until something greater is given unto us. Rule 1, give up your lust for knowledge or I will not teach you.

 

[LIGHTBEING]

I am the spiritual leader to Dyw and Arioch of God until something greater is given unto us. Rule 1, give up your lust for knowledge or I will not teach you.

Really, that's rule #1? You certainly could have made up something more exciting.

 

[wynn]

Really, that's rule #1? You certainly could have made up something more exciting.

Technically, giving up the desire to know might be extremely exciting - just not in ways most people would appreciate.


:xctd::xctd::xctd:

 

[kx000]

Technically, giving up the desire to know might be extremely exciting - just not in ways most people would appreciate.


:xctd::xctd::xctd:

Give up your lust and I will show you why. Give me your lust, give me your word, give me your shame, and your hate. Show me your anger and I will show were to put it. Give me your brain, give me your braun. I want it all and I want it now. Come with me and I will take you to the apex of knowledge, that is the tipy top of the coldest mountain. We will climb down together, and we will stop and mine were and when we want. Give me your lust and I will show you why. But the times are urgent, I want it, I want it now.

 

[Jan Ardena]

I take it you deny theory and/or the theory of evolution?
why?

I haven't got to the stage of complete denial yet (macro).
I'm still waiting to be convinced by the evidence that is out there.


jan.

 

[Dywyddyr]

I am the spiritual leader to Dyw and Arioch

Um, no, you're not.

or I will not teach you.

Since you don't know anything how can you teach?

 

[spidergoat]

I haven't got to the stage of complete denial yet (macro).
I'm still waiting to be convinced by the evidence that is out there.


jan.

No scientist is losing sleep over your lack of conviction.

 

[Arioch]

@Signal --

I have no spiritual master and I don't need one. I'm filled with awe at the universe all on my own, no supernatural or half-baked theologians needed.

@Pincho --

Lol.. you can do pi on a computer using 1's and zeros, because a computer is binary.

Irrelevant to my point, red herring fallacy.

And how do you know that pi exists anyway?

Again, this is irrelevant. My point was that you don't need to know the right answer to tell when an answer is bullshit. This is yet another red herring.

And if I'm the second person to say this to you, then that tells you something that has nothing to do with philosophy.

It's a philosophical position, how could it have nothing to do with philosophy?

And swearing every post doesn't make your post any more significant, it makes you seem immature.

Give me one reason why I should let that bother me? I swear because it's a good way to vent frustration(much better than punching a pillow or potentially harming those around me) and because when it's used in the right way it adds an emotional value to the post(in communicating my emotions). I'm a writer(what? did you think that this is all I do?), I'm not going to eschew the use of words just because some people might consider me immature for using them. If someone would judge me just on that then I really don't have any reason to care what they think, the mature thing to do is to judge a person's argument not on how it sounds but on it's validity.

And quite frankly you, and a few others here, have given me absolutely no reason to give a shit about your opinions.

@Knowledge --

I am the spiritual leader to Dyw and Arioch of God until something greater is given unto us. Rule 1, give up your lust for knowledge or I will not teach you.

Yeah...not going to happen. Even if I wanted to give up my lust for knowledge I couldn't, it's human instinct to learn about the world around us, even newborn infants do it(to an extent limited by their physical capabilities). What you're asking isn't just difficult and likely painful, it's just plain impossible. You and your god both seem to like giving impossible decrees and demands, don't you?

@Jan --

I haven't got to the stage of complete denial yet (macro).

Small wonders.

I'm still waiting to be convinced by the evidence that is out there

You haven't actually been looking at the evidence have you?

 

[wynn]

@Signal --

I have no spiritual master and I don't need one. I'm filled with awe at the universe all on my own, no supernatural or half-baked theologians needed.

My comment to Jan wasn't aimed at you or Dyw.
Jan knows very well what I'm talking about.