Perfectly evil God

[Xelasnave.1947]

Jan doesn't read. Too busy asking questions I presume.

Its a pity Jan wont just read the first page, clearly any inteligent person would realise its all made up.
Maybe Jan knows its made up but has faith nevertheless.
Arguing with Jan is like hitting yourself on the head with a hammer it feels so much better when you stop but you still feel dazed and confused.
I would love to take Jan back in time and have my opposition try a cross examination, I bet they would give up and leave the business.
I would love to hear Jan's reply to a judge when he demands Jan answer the question.

Alex

 

[Seattle]

Its a pity Jan wont just read the first page, clearly any inteligent person would realise its all made up.
Maybe Jan knows its made up but has faith nevertheless.
Arguing with Jan is like hitting yourself on the head with a hammer it feels so much better when you stop but you still feel dazed and confused.
I would love to take Jan back in time and have my opposition try a cross examination, I bet they would give up and leave the business.
I would love to hear Jan's reply to a judge when he demands Jan answer the question.

Alex

He would just insist that he already answered the question or he would ask another question or answer another question.

You hit it on the head with your other comment. Jan knows it's all made up but has faith anyway.

 

[Jan Ardena]

Yeah. I get that Goodness (agathos) is a euphemism for God.

So you're saying that Jesus was really saying that no-one can be called God other than God. Correct?

No. But the transcripts are there to read.

jan.

 

[Jan Ardena]

Its a pity Jan wont just read the first page, clearly any inteligent person would realise its all made up.

Are they simply words to yo you, or do they mean something?

I would love to hear Jan's reply to a judge when he demands Jan answer the question.

jan

 

[Jan Ardena]

You hit it on the head with your other comment. Jan knows it's all made up but has faith anyway.

Did he lodge it in his head?

Hope the nails alright. It would be a shame to waste a perfectly good nail.

jan.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Are they simply words to yo you, or do they mean something?

The words simply mean the author has made stuff up and had no idea about the events written about.
It seems ironic that when a witness is asked to swear upon the bible that they will tell the truth they place their hand upon a book which clearly does not start with the truth.
It is strange so many people can maintain their faith when they actually read the bible.
I suppose that if you have been indoctrinated from childhood it destroys ones ability to think and analyze rationally and so you go thru life believing in made up stuff.
Brain in a blender, a mind rendered incapable of accepting an obvious reality where Gods are recognised as myths from ancient times where superstition substituted for truth.
One can understand how ignorant folk could be easily fooled but what excuse can a modern human offer to justify still believing in superstitions, how can a modern intelligent well informed human read the Bible and not conclude the obvious that it was made up by an uniformed human.
The answer can be found by understanding that these poor folk have been robbed of the ability to think from an early age which is both sad and cruel.
Jan may I ask how old were you when God came into your life?
Alex

 

[Jan Ardena]

The words simply mean the author has made stuff up and had no idea about the events written about.

Really? That's what they mean to you.
Do your words mean you have made stuff up?

It seems ironic that when a witness is asked to swear upon the bible that they will tell the truth they place their hand upon a book which clearly does not start with the truth.

I can see you point of view.
Don't worry about trying to learn anything outside of your perception.
Ignorance can be blissful.

It is strange so many people can maintain their faith when they actually read the bible.

Really?
It must be nice to be able to just brush things aside because you simple can't get your head around them.

I suppose that if you have been indoctrinated from childhood it destroys ones ability to think and analyze rationally and so you go thru life believing in made up stuff.

I think that applies with any type of indoctrination. Don't you?

Brain in a blender, a mind rendered incapable of accepting an obvious reality where Gods are recognised as myths from ancient times where superstition substituted for truth.

''Brain in a blender''?
Ewwwwww!!!
I'd sooner be a brain in a vat.

One can understand how ignorant folk could be easily fooled but what excuse can a modern human offer to justify still believing in superstitions, how can a modern intelligent well informed human read the Bible and not conclude the obvious that it was made up by an uniformed human.

I know!
What are those people thinking?

The answer can be found by understanding that these poor folk have been robbed of the ability to think from an early age which is both sad and cruel.

Those poor people.

Jan may I ask how old were you when God came into your life?

Of course you can.

jan.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Do your words mean you have made stuff up?

I have always been honest I certainly do not to make up anything certainly I would not make up any thing regarding creation because I don't know and it is easier, for me at least, to say I don't know.
I was raised to place honesty above everything and it works for me.

Don't worry about trying to learn anything outside of your perception.

I don't Jan but I certainly enjoy learning how you approach things. You do things a little differently to me but that does not mean that I can't show you respect.

Ignorance can be blissful.

I can't take advantage of you by providing a reply that must be on everyone else's lips so I will just say yes ignorance can be blissful.

It must be nice to be able to just brush things aside because you simple can't get your head around them.

Jan I said it was strange I did not say I did not understand.
Nevertheless I have to brush away my concerns about folk who can happily follow scriptures that are clearly made up and realise faith does not have to back down when confronted with facts.

I think that applies with any type of indoctrination. Don't you?

Yes I agree but there is something about indoctrinating children with religion that makes it worse than any other form that I can think of but only because it works unfairly with children but indoctrination has been used on adults in more harmful ways.
I just think it is not fair to raise children to believe God is a given which presumably would be opposite to your view, maybe not, you can express your view if you wish.

What are those people thinking?

One can only wonder.

Those poor people.

It is nice you can show compassion Jan.

Of course you can.

Thank you Jan but I should not get so personal,that is information that you can present if you wish and I should not have asked.
Alex

 

[Seaman]

Be aware that the position I am taking here is an intellectual one and is not necessarily a reflection of my personal beliefs. Think of me as Devil's Advocate (or evil God's advocate, if you prefer).

I like discussions and I assume you are raising this point for purely philosophical reasons. Fine, but lets also admit that God is not evil and could not be so. He created a wonderful world for us and we should be grateful.

 

[river]

Let us engage in a philosophical discussion.

I propose that God exists. Moreover, I assert that God is maximally, perfectly evil. By this, I mean that God's ultimate aim for human beings is to maximise their suffering and pain. This is God's plan for the world.

Some misguided atheist types would no doubt claim that the God I have described does not exist. Some misguided religious types might make a similar claim, probably on different grounds. So...

Challenge #1: Can anybody produce a convincing argument that the God I have described does not exist?

and

Challenge #2: If you're religious, you might have been brought up to believe that God is perfectly Good rather than perfectly Evil. My claim is that this is a mistake. Can you show that I am wrong and you are right?

Be aware that the position I am taking here is an intellectual one and is not necessarily a reflection of my personal beliefs. Think of me as Devil's Advocate (or evil God's advocate, if you prefer).

The perfect evil god could never exist .

Because this god would wipe out all life in the Universe . Which would Hence destroy this god .

Perfect evil god depends on life to exist , ironically .

Further , the perfect meek god would be to weak to survive .

 

[Michael 345]

He created a wonderful world for us and we should be grateful.

I have this from another forum but I have not checked the bible references and I have drastically reduced the post size

The bible says again and again that atheists go to hell
The bible also says atheists are atheist BECAUSE GOD WANTS THEM TO BE

He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart
John 12:40

God sends them a powerful delusion
Thessalonians 2:11–12

Make the heart of this people calloused
Isaiah 6:10

In sum
god makes it physically impossible for us to believe
Then god demands that we do anyway
Then god refuses to provide proof because if you have proof it's not really believing
Then god punishes atheist for doing what he made atheist do by burning atheist in hell for eternity

Please explain this
wonderful world
and why we
should be grateful?

Cheers

 

[birch]

God can't be evil because evil is doing something that displeases God. God can't displease God.

a typical example of brainwashed mind. who says god can't be evil? actually according to you apparently. evil is evil, whether it's god or not.

God is God. You can't characterize anything that God does as good or evil. It's just God's actions. It takes man (or the Devil) to be good or evil.

another absolutely nonsensical statement. yes, i can characterize god just as you characterized man or the devil. pay attention to the reverse: so man is man and the devil is the devil. it's just man's or the devil's actions. see how that works?

God is what could be known as evil if it were not done by God

ridiculous. all this statement means is you are excluding god from judgement or evaluation. that is actually a choice.

The only person who can address these questions is the Devil. The Devil knows God and isn't afraid of God.

you don't know this either.

The Devil actually is God as well. God is everything so yes, God is evil and good.

how do you know god is everything? how do you know or assume there is one god? how do you know there is a devil? you are extrapolating from the duality in this universe.

your lack of conceptual thinking limits your ability to consider that there may be a god that is all good or completely evil. you assume blindly that what you experience here in the now is all there is. maybe a true god is totally good and you are being fooled under a lesser being that just has some power over this domain. there are any number of possibilities.

consider the gnostics don't have the same view as you. your views stem from orthodox christianity.



.

 

[Seattle]

a typical example of brainwashed mind. who says god can't be evil? actually according to you apparently. evil is evil, whether it's god or not.



another absolutely nonsensical statement. yes, i can characterize god just as you characterized man or the devil. pay attention to the reverse: so man is man and the devil is the devil. it's just man's or the devil's actions. see how that works?



ridiculous. all this statement means is you are excluding god from judgement or evaluation. that is actually a choice.



you don't know this either.



how do you know god is everything? how do you know or assume there is one god? how do you know there is a devil? you are extrapolating from the duality in this universe.

your lack of conceptual thinking limits your ability to consider that there may be a god that is all good or completely evil. you assume blindly that what you experience here in the now is all there is. maybe a true god is totally good and you are being fooled under a lesser being that just has some power over this domain. there are any number of possibilities.

consider the gnostics don't have the same view as you. your views stem from orthodox christianity.



.

My views stem from atheism.

 

[birch]

The perfect evil god could never exist .

Because this god would wipe out all life in the Universe . Which would Hence destroy this god .

that has nothing to do with the definition of evil. if it wiped out all life in a universe that is full of suffering, that's not anymore evil than a god that allows or even creates it.

Further , the perfect meek god would be to weak to survive .

that would depend on the context. here, not likely. elsewhere, a meek god may if the parameters are in it's favor.

 

[birch]

My views stem from atheism.

those views are definitely not atheistic. it's very obvious that it stems from religious conditioning, whether you realize it or not.

 

[Michael 345]

My views stem from atheism.

In that case you give atheist a bad name

Get thee begone and speak no more of that of which you know not

 

[Seattle]

Any views I spout regarding "God" are of course from religious conditioning since I, personally, don't think there is such a "thing" as "God".

 

[Jan Ardena]

Any views I spout regarding "God" are of course from religious conditioning since I, personally, don't think there is such a "thing" as "God".

More like you are in denial of God?

If I'm wrong please explain why you don't actually believe there is "such a thing as a God".

Jan.

 

[Seattle]

More like you are in denial of God?

If I'm wrong please explain why you don't actually believe there is "such a thing as a God".

Jan.

I have no reason to believe in such a silly concept. Just because it's silly doesn't mean it's not true but without having any reason to think that it is, I live my life as is it isn't true. That's my response (and yours) to other such situations.

I am in denial of ghosts?

 

[James R]

More like you are in denial of God?

We've already been through this.

To deny something, the something first has to be shown to exist. God hasn't been shown to exist.