Of stampcollectors and atheists

[Myles]

not a highschool student who believes his teacher is deluded

Sorry LG but you do talk a lot of bollocks.

 

[Enmos]

once again, issues of evidence boil down to qualification and knowledge (unless you want to advocate that your current abilities to determine energy and mass are authoritatively complete)

for instance a suitably qualified physicist can verify the existence of electrons.

For everyone else, it might as well be an invisible stamp

Well, 'invisible' is a really extraordinary quality.
Is the stamp also untouchable or in any other way imperceivable ?
If something is imperceivable by definition, how can one ever know if it exists ?
Though, in my opinion, if a supposed something cannot be perceived by definition it doesn't exist.

And you missed this post:

Good point man!

If a stamp has no energy and no mass, how do we prove that it exists!!!???

“ Originally Posted by lightgigantic
well technically speaking, an invisible stamp also exists
”


Well, you can't say it doesn't exist, just like SAM cannot deny the possibility of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

Well that's not really the point, is it ?
If someone comes to you claiming he has an invisible stamp he is making an extraordinary claim.
So he better proof the invisible stamp exist.
If he can't, what will you do ?
You will do this :crazy:, and walk away.

 

[lightgigantic]

Sorry LG but you do talk a lot of bollocks.

ever tried explaining something to someone who simply folds their arms and says "what a load of crap" all the time?

 

[lightgigantic]

Well, 'invisible' is a really extraordinary quality.
Is the stamp also untouchable or in any other way imperceivable ?
If something is imperceivable by definition, how can one ever know if it exists ?
Though, in my opinion, if a supposed something cannot be perceived by definition it doesn't exist.

And you missed this post:

hence behind extraordinary claims are extraordinary qualifications

if a person insists that their current powers of comprehension and perception are authoritative, progress becomes difficult



"[To Robert Fulton:] What, sir, would you make a ship sail against the wind and currents by lighting a bonfire under her deck? I pray you excuse me. I have no time to listen to such nonsense."
-- Napoleon I

 

[Enmos]

hence behind extraordinary claims are extraordinary qualifications

if a person insists that their current powers of comprehension and perception are authoritative, progress becomes difficult



"[To Robert Fulton:] What, sir, would you make a ship sail against the wind and currents by lighting a bonfire under her deck? I pray you excuse me. I have no time to listen to such nonsense."
-- Napoleon I

That goes both ways.

I can see woodpixies, can you ?

 

[lightgigantic]

That goes both ways.

I can see woodpixies, can you ?

I can perform heart surgery, can you?


IOW separating the chaff (or quacks) from the wheat involves familiarity with the subject of hand (most people are not heart surgeons, but its reasonably easy to determine who is a qualified heart surgeon)

 

[Enmos]

I can perform heart surgery, can you?


IOW separating the chaff (or quacks) from the wheat involves familiarity with the subject of hand (most people are not heart surgeons, but its reasonably easy to determine who is a qualified heart surgeon)

Yeah you have powers. Bad counter example though.

I have the power to see woodpixies. You will only be given this power if you believe in them.

Your turn.

 

[lightgigantic]

Yeah you have powers. Bad counter example though.

I have the power to see woodpixies. You will only be given this power if you believe in them.

Your turn.

basically religion without philosophy is sentimentalism
if all a process can indicate is faith, its kind of the same

For instance if I want to determine who is a qualified heart surgeon, I don't simply rely on faith

 

[Enmos]

basically religion without philosophy is sentimentalism
if all a process can indicate is faith, its kind of the same

For instance if I want to determine who is a qualified heart surgeon, I don't simply rely on faith

Can you argue against my example or not ?

 

[Enmos]

Guess not then :shrug:
I saw you were replying, why'd you quit ?

 

[John99]

What if you were blind?

 

[Enmos]

What if you were blind?

Then what ?

 

[John99]

Then what that? What does what you see have to do with anything?

 

[Enmos]

Then what that? What does what you see have to do with anything?

I'll let you figure that out on your own. I'm off to bed.

 

[John99]

Dont go to bed.

 

[lightgigantic]

Can you argue against my example or not ?

if you can't provide anything to your claim of perception except faith, there is no need

Guess not then :shrug:
I saw you were replying, why'd you quit ?

I have this aspect to my existence called "real life"

 

[greenberg]

A high school student could do it. Ignorance is no excuse.

He could do it, yes.
But a high-school student does not have the expertise to know why the way he arrived at the results is a correct way to arrive at those results.
To know something to be a truth, one also needs to know why their presumed knowledge isn't simply a lucky guess.

 

[Myles]

ever tried explaining something to someone who simply folds their arms and says "what a load of crap" all the time?

Yes, as a last resort. Look at your posdt number 9 where you claim that an invisible stamp actually exists.I cannot remember exactly why you brought this up but it was in some sense connected with the idea of god being capable of existence even though he cannot be perceived by us.

Now the reason you can talk of an invisible stamp is because stamps exist.Thus, you can imagine an invisible one. If there were no such thing as a stamp, it would make no sense to say anything at all about stamps. Extending this principle to the concept of god, as we have no visible god as a basis of comparison, it is nonsense to talk of a god who cannot be perceived. We obviously cannot perceive that which does not exist.

 

[Myles]

basically religion without philosophy is sentimentalism
if all a process can indicate is faith, its kind of the same

For instance if I want to determine who is a qualified heart surgeon, I don't simply rely on faith

No. but if you want to determine who is qualified to talk about god, you will have no choice but to base your decision on faith. Your example does not hold.

 

[lightgigantic]

Yes, as a last resort. Look at your posdt number 9 where you claim that an invisible stamp actually exists.I cannot remember exactly why you brought this up but it was in some sense connected with the idea of god being capable of existence even though he cannot be perceived by us.

Now the reason you can talk of an invisible stamp is because stamps exist.Thus, you can imagine an invisible one. If there were no such thing as a stamp, it would make no sense to say anything at all about stamps. Extending this principle to the concept of god, as we have no visible god as a basis of comparison, it is nonsense to talk of a god who cannot be perceived. We obviously cannot perceive that which does not exist.

actually it was more to indicate that there is a slight distinction between an invisible thing and a non-existent thing.

Seems like you are more in to discussing non-existent stamps