Malaysia imposes dress code for non-muslims, THE FRENCH WAY

[Xev]

If female workers living in Malaysia disagree then perhaps they should return to their home countries where they are not restricted.

More specifically, where they won't be raped or killed for showing their fucking ankles.
Crush the inferiour bastards of Judeo-Christian spawn, I say! Take their goods and their women and burn the rest to the ground!

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

Quote from Malaysia Travel Guide: CUSTOMS AND RULES
Malaysia's culture is vastly different to the west and it is much appreciated when foreigners respect both its laws and heritage. Most Malaysians are devout Muslims and Islam itself provides the social fabric of the country. Therefore it is advised that unless travelling in the main centres respectful attire should be worn, especially by women. Covered shoulders and NO high-cut shorts or skirts. Best to purchase a sarong to wrap up in if you feel you may expose a little too much flesh in ALL Muslim areas. Not only will you feel more comfortable, the locals will appreciate it when they see you have made an effort. http://www.hoteltravel.com/malaysia/guides/tips.htm

Travel tip from Nepal: While traveling dress appropriately. Women in particular should avoid dressing in skimpy outfits. http://www.nepal-trekking.net/travellers-info.htm

Quote from Rumsfeld on dress code for servicewomen in Saudi Arabia: "We are guests in certain countries. At our request, they allow us the use of bases or fields," he said. "It is more in our country's interests to be in that country and recognize that we have to live with some of their laws and rules and customs." http://www.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/05/15/saudi.dress.code/

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

Quote:More specifically, where they won't be raped or killed for showing their fucking ankles. Crush the inferiour bastards of Judeo-Christian spawn, I say! Take their goods and their women and burn the rest to the ground!

But Xev that's precisely my point it isn't just the Judeo-Christian spawn, in Hindu or Buddhist parts of Asia the same principle still applies...cover the fuck up!! Granted one will not find the same kind of aggression wearing a skimpy tube and shorts in Bangkok, Hanoi or Phnom Penh but the moment one leaves the city a woman is expected to be appropriately dressed. When in Rome Xev When in Rome.

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

You know what? If a western woman leaves her home country for any of these places insisting on bearing her flesh though warned then the stupid wench deserves whatever she gets.

 

[Raithere]

You know what? If a western woman leaves her home country for any of these places insisting on bearing her flesh though warned then the stupid wench deserves whatever she gets.

Better be careful there Lucy, your inspired wisdom may attract the attentions of some overly exuberant male who may force himself upon you. But of course, you deserve whatever you get, your actions prompted his behavior.

I expect misogyny in men, why is it I am always so surprised to find misogynistic women?

~Raithere

 

[everneo]

Certainly there are situations where some aspect of a woman's behavior elicits a reaction in a particular aggressor. The thing is, which aspect of a woman's behavior will elicit a response cannot be predicted. For one aggressor it may indeed be offense taken at a woman's attire, for another it may be how much she reminds him of his dominating mother or the fact that she is taller than he is.

I agree. But the characterization of a rapist and his behaviour differs with societies. As i said, in liberal societies sex ( which might be available otherwise without necessarily resorting to rape) might not be the primary factor for a rapist. Sexual urge factors in importantly along with other psychological factors in a conservative society.

The only factor that is constant with the victim is that which is constant for all victims of similar forms of aggression (from theft to rape to mugging to serial killing) that factor is perceived vulnerability. Predators select victims who appear to be vulnerable. The only reliable prevention is to avoid appearing vulnerable and to avoid putting yourself in a position of vulnerability.

Obviously the vulnerability is removed, say in malaysia, by banning the cause that is the revealing dress. You can't employ the similar methods of security prevailing in liberal west where individual right gets more weightage than that of the general society. The vulnerability, in the case of societies like malaysia, is the woman's perceived willingness to arouse other men by the telling dress. She, thus seen as a de facto sexual object to be treated in any possible way by her revealing dress. This would not be the case in west or in any liberal society. Oh, am i sounding like proud muslim/syrian..?!

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

Get a grip Raithere and read all of my posts. The issue raised is codes of conduct in another culture. Yes, if a woman is warned that wearing a short skirt will attract negative attention in another country and she insists on doing so then she is inviting trouble and I have no sympathy. While in India I changed my habits and dress to suit the environment because I was no longer in NY and free to wear whatever, I did not wear whatever and INSIST that local men respect my physical boundaries and complain because they don't understand my version of liberty and the pursuit of the plunging breastline and shortening skirt. Gee...let's see now, I wore jeans in India and was harassed...an Indian woman told me to wear local garb and WOW I was left alone. So yea a woman who ignores advice in another culture is a stupid wench.

 

[Proud_Muslim]

I think PMS has a point guys. The way a woman dresses does provide us with clues as to her intent. In a work environment a woman would dress differently than in a club afterwork. Why? The answer is obvious,she dresses more provacatively in a club setting to appear more attractive and to attract whatever she's attracted to.

Fianlly, the voice of reason has arrived.

That doesnt mean that a man who sees this woman in both environments assume she's more "rapable" in the club attire. One can assume that the man might find the woman more attractive in club attire.

Very good point, I have been saying that all along, why women dress differently when they go to work interviews than when they go to night clubs ?????

It takes a minimum of two persons for rape to take place and since the man is the "weapon carrier" and is physically stronger most if not all the blame goes to the man. But just as in automobile accidents no accident is 100% one's fault, it may be that the accidental victim could have more careful and thoughtful and avoided the accident. I imagine that plenty of females that have been raped could have avoided the rape by prudent action such as the woman that went up to Mike Tysons room. What was she thinking?

Exactly, I am sure most women dont want to be raped, but their behaviour and their outrageous dress invite such crimes.

Now I believe PMS when he says that rape and other crimes are more prevalent here. USA leads the world in crime of all sorts. Why? Because it's a free country and our justice system sucks. We could easilly reduce all sorts of crime by reducing one's freedom. We could turn this country into "1984" and eliminate almost all crime.

The Amazing thing is in your country and other liberal countries is that sex is available for free, your societies are very liberal and yet you have the highest rate of rape in the world...this fact tells us a lot about the motivation behind rape in the west.

But we chose not to because we cherish our freedom, something that PMS doesnt care about.

You see my friend, the concept of freedom is relative one, what might be freedom for you might not be for me, I came from different culture and different environment where Freedom there has a very different meaning.

Thank you for your comments again, I appreciate them.

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

Quote:The Amazing thing is in your country and other liberal countries is that sex is available for free,

Why Proud Muslim do you have to pay for it in yours?

 

[Bells]

----------
M*W: Bells, you hardly fit the description of a martyr at the stake! What gives? You do realize, I hope, that all those 9 million women who were tortured and burned were good Christian women. Why would your dad, uncles, and cousins set YOU afire? I'm missing something here!

LOL I was being sarcastic.

Lucy
Yes you are very correct in a way. Having travelled to Asia I too noticed that the men there were more apt to approach women dressed in western clothing. However, most of the local women also wore the same clothes I was wearing. The tour guide and the hotel staff informed us that the local men treat the western women that way because for them it was ok to do so because we weren't from there, we weren't local women. While I was always careful to dress in a manner that would not be deemed to be offensive to the locals, just the fact that I was not from that part of the world meant that it was basically an open ticket to harrass or touch. The only time we felt safe was when our local tour guide was with us. It was also the same when I went back to Mauritius for a holiday. They could pick that I was not from there, even though I was born there and spent a good part of my childhood there, but apparently to them it was obvious that I was not 'from' there per se, so they took it as normal to harrass and approach me on the street, especially if I was walking alone. So to reduce any risk to myself, I never walked on the streets alone and always had a male relative or friend accompany me. They never did the same to any of my female relatives who lived there, because they lived there. I dressed in the same way that everyone else did. In fact I dressed more conservatively than most of the locals regardless of the heat, in a bid to attract less attention. Although even that did not work. I was later told that it was not how I dressed but because it was obvious that I did not live there. So it was the kind of thing of harrass the women who weren't from their country or lived in their country, but it was ok to harrass women who came from elsewhere.

Proud Muslim
In 2000 in Sydney (Australia) a young Australian girl was gang raped by 25 Lebanese men in their late teens and early 20's. This rape was racially motivated in that they called her a christian pig and aussie slut. She had been coming home on a train from a job interview, dressed fairly conservatively. On the security video on the train, it showed a couple of these men approaching her and chatting to her on the train. She was then kidnapped from the train station and taken to a vacant factory where the rest of the gang arrived after having been sms'ed and called from mobiles and this girl was then gang raped and brutalised in a manner that even had the police officers investigating the crime cry on national TV. During the rape she was called a christian slut and aussie pig repeatedly and also other names. She was then hosed down by the rapists and taken to another location and raped again. After these men were caught and tried, the Australian public were up in arms. The crime was one of the most vile crimes committed here against a young girl who had done nothing wrong except be an Australian non-muslim. Muslims across the country were horrified. The Lebanese religious leader in Sydney called for the men to be sent back to Lebanon to face the death penalty as all they would get here would be life imprisonment because these men had committed an act so vile against another person. Further investigation later showed that up to 7 women were gang raped around that time. I have no time to do a search on articles on this issue, but it is well documented and many articles are available on the matter.

Other articles you might find of interest are:
http://www.hraic.org/rape_and_islam.html

http://www.afrol.com/Categories/Women/wom003_violence_unfpa.htm where it stated:

Molestation of young girls is another profoundly disturbing aspect of this problem. A study in Zaria, Nigeria, for example, found that 16 per cent of hospital patients with sexually transmitted infections were under age 5. At the Genito-Urinary Centre in Harare, Zimbabwe, doctors discovered that more than 900 children under age 12 had been treated for a sexually transmitted disease in 1990 alone.

Yes I'm sure these young children were dressed soooo provocatively.. And then it went on to say this:

Throughout the world, perhaps as many as 5,000 women and girls a year are murdered by members of their own families, many of them for the "dishonour" of having been raped, often as not by a member of their own extended family. Many forms of communally sanctioned violence against women, such as "honour" killings, are associated with the community's or the family's demand for sexual chastity and virginity.

In Egypt, a father paraded his daughter's severed head through the streets shouting, "I avenged my honour."

Charming!

And just as frightening in that article was this:

At least one in every three women has been beaten, coerced into sex, or abused in some other way, usually by an intimate partner or family member, according to a new report by the United Nations Population Fund, UNFPA. In Africa, domestic violence, rape and other sexual abuse and female genital mutilation are of special concern.

Documenting the extent of the problem, The State of World Population 2000 report says that gender-based violence constitutes a life-long threat for hundreds of millions of girls and women around the world. Gender-based violence - in various forms including rape, domestic violence, "honour" killings and trafficking in women - exacts a heavy toll on mental and physical health. Increasingly, gender-based violence is recognized as a major public health concern and a serious violation of basic human rights.

The problem seems worst in Asia and in the Muslim world. However, African women are subject to a range of oppressive threats.

Could it be PM that the reason that there are less reported rapes in Muslim countries is due to the fact that under Muslim law, there must be 4 men present who can corroborate the rape of the woman or else the woman can be charged with adultery? Could that be one of the reasons why so few rapes are reported in muslim countries? After all, most rapes take place where there are no witnesses to the crime.

It is such a common occurence in the Muslim world that, although the vast majority of Muslims abhor it, it barely registers a protest. Simple-minded and patriarchal interpretations of Sharia law in countries such as Pakistan, Sudan, Malaysia, and Nigeria are punishing Muslim rape victims for the "crime" of being raped, due to the equating of rape with zina, or extramarital sex. The latest incident involves 26-year old Zafran Bibi of Pakistan, who, after reporting a rape (with the child of said rape in her arms), was unable to produce four male witnesses of the crime and was sentenced to death by stoning for zina. This follows the recent death sentence (which has since been commuted) confered upon Safiya Hussaini Tungar-Tudu in Nigeria under similar circumstances. While the punishments for so-called hudood crimes are rarely carried out, hundreds of women who have reported rapes are held in jail under these laws. These latest cases have increased the debate in Muslim countries about the application of hudood punishments and calls by Muslim scholars and women's groups for their repeal or reform. "With the men, they apply the principle that you are innocent until proven guilty," said Asma Jahangir, an official of the independent Human Rights Commission of Pakistan and the author of a book on hudood. "With the women, they apply the principle that you are guilty until proven innocent."

http://www.altmuslim.com/gender.php

PM it is obvious that your education (or lack of) has taught you that women who dress in a western style and who may show some skin are provoking the rape. It is sad that you could think that. However, you still have shown no real proof for it, only opinions that mirror your own. And even if your opinion be true, why should women change the way they dress because men can't handle it? Why don't men change their attitudes or curb their urges? Why is it that we women have to pay for men's lack of self-control?

I would also like you to answer these question. Why is it that men are also raped? Are they dressed too provocatively as well? Why are babies raped? Is it because some pervert saw their bare bottom during a nappy change and was provoked? Your argument is unfounded on just these questions PM. It is not only women are raped, but men, boys, girls, babies, the elderly. How do you contribute your argument to these victims of rape? Or is it that you follow the true sharia law in that a woman is to blame for the rape if she has no male witnesses to support her claim? Because your whole argument seems to be pointing in that direction. You're basically stating that the man is not to blame for a rape but the woman because she may have asked for it in the manner of her dress. You're a sad creature PM and frankly, I have only pity for you and for the women in your family.

 

[Raithere]

So yea a woman who ignores advice in another culture is a stupid wench.

I got your point, I just think you carried too far. If people deserve to be assaulted simply because they are stupid then I have the right to go on a killing spree on my drive to work each day. Not to mention work itself. "You were trying to free some space on your hard drive so you deleted the windows directory? Again!?!" Raithere pistol whips the customer... he had it coming.

Yes, people should be careful and adopting the local customs of attire while traveling in some countries is a good idea. But this ignores the whole point of the thread. It also ignores a major issue in such countries (and this is a point I'll hopefully get to respond in more depth to when I get a chance to reply to everneo). The clothing customs in these countries, and the attention you received when breaking the local taboos for instance, bespeaks an objectification of women. This, is the primary social problem at hand and relevant to pretty much every post in this thread. This is why so many people feel that the woman has some inherent blame for the actions of someone else.

The notion is ludicrous, which I attempted to demonstrate in my previous response to you. So please consider, for what other crime do we so easily lay the responsibility on the victim? Do we blame children for being appealing to pedophiles? "That nasty, stupid, little child deserved what she got. Did you see how short that skirt she was wearing was?" Sometimes extreme examples are good for displaying erroneous reasoning.

~Raithere

 

[Proud_Muslim]

Proud_Muslim:

I tried pointing out some things to you in a fairly subtle way, but it seems you completely missed the point. Since you are obviously not very bright, I'll explain things one more time, in terms you might understand.

Oh I see, and certainly you are very bright, right ?

No, according to "Toronto police" and such other sources as gave their opinions in your quoted article. As Raithere said, opinion polls don't tell us facts - they tell us opinions.

But opinion polls FORM facts.

1. Rape statistics do not tell us the number of rapes which have occurred. They tell us how many rapes have been reported.

Indeed, in the U.S. for example, for every 1 rape that is reported, 10 are NOT.

2. Rapes were less likely to be reported prior to the rise of the women's liberation movement.
3. That movement happened to coincide with the invention of the miniskirt.

Rape increased dramaticlly after the introduction of the miniskirt, before that, there was a rape but I think it was far less than now.

4. The incidence of rape in Muslim nations is very likely to be at least as frequent as in western nations, but the reporting rate is far lower.
5. Therefore, your beloved list of countries means nothing.

This is NOT valid excuse since you dont have any evidence about the lack of reporting in the Muslim world, I will disregard your above statement.

I do not claim to be an expert on rape, but clearly I am more educated about it than you, and that is all that matters here. I'm glad you find that interesting.

More educated ?? and what determine the degree of education ?

No, and it doesn't mean you're right either. You'd be just as wrong if you were a Christian. I don't see how your religion has anything to do with your stupidity on this matter.

You implied that I am the only one here with 'wrong' information and I said to you if there are another Muslim here, he/she will agree with me because this is Islamic concept regarding women issues.

Once again, in case you missed it the first three times:

The rape statistics you posted are misleading because they only show the reported incidence of rape, not the actual incidence.

Oh I see, if the same statistics were showing Muslim country to be in the lead in rape or any other bad thing, it wont be misleading, right ???

This is nothing better than a wish on your part. You're just sweeping the problem under the carpet and pretending it doesn't exist, instead of dealing with it.

I am not sweeping anything, we in the muslim world DONT have this problem, maybe we have some rape cases EVERY YEAR but our men marry early and the same with our women, so their sexual urge is filled at early stage, while you guys in your culture, changing girlfriends and boyfriends always create this sexual urge which lead in many cases into rape.

I doubt you know much about the West. Do you get all your information from TV and movies?

You might be shocked to know that I live in the west, I live in one of the most advanced western countries in the world, no, certianly not the U.S. and I have been travelling so much, I studied in the west for years and I speak 3 western langauges in addtion to my mother langauge ( Arabic ) and I know very well your culture, I interacted with your people and I saw your behaviour and how it changes during the weekends specially on friday night and saturday night.

You have amazing things that we muslims should take from you, and we have amazing things that you guys should take from us, I refuse this self-rightous western attitude and this arrogant western view of the world in which what is good for you must be good for everyone else.

Racial slurs do not help advance your argument.

I agree and I wish you can watch what Flores is writing to me.

Not "we". You. You blame the raped women. Just read this thread again.

This BS, I dont blame the raped women all the time, I said, I refuse to blame the man ALONE, in some cases it is women's fault as well.

I'm sure there are many educated Muslims who appreciate the real nature of rape, but we're not talking about them here. We're talking about you, who clearly has no clue.

Oh I see, for someone to be educated, he has to agree with you or else he has no cule !!

The reason women dress differently when they go to work compared with when they go to a nightclub is that work is a different environment from a nightclub (except for nightclub workers!).

And that was my point, women want to be taken seriously at work and that is why they dress more modesly.

Hopefully you can appreciate that people wear different clothes in different settings now. I assume you wear the same clothes wherever you go.

yep, you got that right !!

Maybe you only have one set of clothes. I don't know.

Again, stupid comment that need not any attention.

But in modern western democracies, and elsewhere, you will find a wide variety of dress styles.

what has dress style got to do with 'democracies' ?????????

There's also this thing called "fashion", but I suspect that might be a bit too complicated for us to get into here.

Fashion does not mean to walk half naked in the street .

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

Bells I never knew any middle-class Indian woman to leave her home at night unescorted. As a matter of fact I once took two danish guys out to a local 'westernized' pub to prove to them that all they would see is a bunch of men sitting around drinking while all their mothers, sisters daughters and wives were at home. I WAS THE ONLY WOMAN IN THE CLUB. While living in India I predominantly stayed in Bangalore which was quite 'liberal' compared to other Indian districts. Part of the problem for Western women is the perception of promiscuity which many pick up from the media. And hell compared to what is expected of women in many of these places the assumption of us is correct...we are looser and freer and more sexually promiscuous. If you have lived in Asia then you know very well that in many areas local women (especially outside major cities) do not wear western clothing, date as we do in the West or have the sexual freedom we do in the west. In Cambodia a womans virginity is still highly prized and many marriages still arranged. Cambodian men who are actually quite docile felt lucky to gain the attention of a western woman precisely because he was outside his cultural restraints and may actually get laid without marrying. These differences are significant for any western woman exploring a foreign culture. True enough that if you are a white woman then you will be harassed more so than if you are ethnic. I am not implying that changing ones dress will put an end to rape, but if I am in another culture I have to respect local custom and local law and indeed it is safer to do so. In Thailand I never thought twice about being harassed and never had a problem, India was different, Malaysia is different...hell Greece and Southern Italy were frigging different (to tell you the truth in all of my travels I have had more problems with this sort of thing in Europe than in the States or Asia)

 

[okinrus]

So you believe that it's the difference in dress rather than the actual dress itself that leads to rape and harassment?

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

Quote:I got your point, I just think you carried too far.

LOL. Hell Raith I carry everything too far.

Quote:The clothing customs in these countries, and the attention you received when breaking the local taboos for instance, bespeaks an objectification of women. This, is the primary social problem at hand and relevant to pretty much every post in this thread. This is why so many people feel that the woman has some inherent blame for the actions of someone else.

Now you see this is also a point I am trying to make. Yes, yes, yes most women outside the west do not have the same liberty as in the west under their reactionary patriarchal systems and of course the women are blamed...hell we blame them right here at home just look at the response to Kobe Bryant and I do believe someone mentioned the Tyson rape, but this is THEIR social problem to solve not ours. Shit men cannot even control their behaviour in the west, look at the stories being released about rape in the armed services, women are still beaten, raped and often its by a boyfriend or husband, we do not have the moral high ground here, we don't even have some archaic religious custom to point the finger at. If a foreign man (take your pick) is in the States and attempts to treat an american woman walking down the street with disrespect as he would in his home country then he will be placed in check by our society. When I go to India or Pakistan or wherever it is not my place to force my understanding on their society and indeed it would not even be welcome. I recall in India how resentful Indian feminists were at the assumption that western feminists knew how to revolutionize their society. These activists take what they need from the West and then temper it to suit their culture. A Madhyam project at All India Radio on domestic violence was partly censored because of an inserted statement about the goddess Sita (Sita walking through fire to prove her chastity and innocence to her husband Rama) inserted in an effort to draw a correlation between myth and the perception and treatment of women. I was told that it was censored because implying anything negative about the goddess could cause a riot in the streets...especially since the piece was produced by a foreigner. These women aren't dullards, they are just as capable of transforming their own society but it has to be done differently and in a different time frame than what we would prefer here in the West. It is not up to us to decide what laws they inact, if there is enough outrage they will transform it from within and on their terms. Someone once wisely told me that you help people on their terms and control people on your terms.

 

[Proud_Muslim]

Bells I think how men react to specific female dress or perceives the woman based on how she's dressed is largely a matter of culture. For example I remember while traveling in India that walking around in jeans and a t-shirt provoked local men to think they could physically touch me or proposition me. My field advisor in the country suggest I wear punjabs or a sari, and although I considered the sari more revealing than jeans I must admit I was left alone. Also the men seemed to have a certain idea about western women from media ie: we are sexually liberal and promiscuous compared to their women ergo western clothing symbolizes this liberality. I could walk around NY in a see-through lingerie top or a slip dress, which has become fashionable for a while, and though i would register looks and comments no one would cross the boundary to touch. I wouldn't dare do the same in Asia...even in the nonmuslim countries because I would be viewed and treated as a prostitute by both men and women.

Well said, at least your are well travelled woman, but others are less fortunate to travel and see that there are other cultures than theris and that NOT everything good for you is good for everyone else.

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

And another thing...now that I'm all pissed off and unable to sleep...the irony of all this is that for all of our liberties (many of which benefit men anyway...yea for the push up bra, booty short and pill) a Phoolan Devi would never have risen to a place of power in the States as she had in India. Here you have a woman who was forced into marriage at the age of seven in exchange for a cow, her husband mistreated her and forced himself on her (RAPE). Sick of it all she ran away (unheard of) and her entire family blamed (they wouldn't protect her from fear) and she wound up in jail were she was again RAPED by guards. She ran away again and found herself among bandits who again repeatedly RAPED her. She sought and found protection from the thug leader (they both fell in love how nice) and she became an outlaw, a bandit (also unheard of). She was so successful at being a bandit, taking revenge on all the stupid little men who harmed her, that she became a cult figure (yea like jesse james and robin hood) among the poor. At some point she was caught and imprisoned for ll years. She ran for office in 96 was voted into parlimant on a platform to improve conditions for women and children. She was eventually assassinated. My point? Well for all the talk of the West and our so moral high ground in response to the conditions of women around the globe and the injustices of men in religious societies or whatever, there is no way in our culture for a poor woman who had been so disgraced by repeated rapes and a life of crime to rise above her 'station' and 'caste' and win a seat in government. Granted we do not have the overwhelming presence of the poor in the west, its mostly those who have something that vote and lobby but it is largely in favor of men. We don't have a Golda, Madam Ghandi or whatever the name of the former Pakastani state leader in our great illustrious history. But hey, cant have everything right?

There is a really good film about Phoolan called The Bandit Queen

 

[Proud_Muslim]

Quote: I think you guys live in closed world, you think what is good for you can be good for everyone !!


I think this is very true

.

This was my quote and I have been saying that for long time, but some people here sadly have this self-rightous attitude syndrome.

It amazes me how quickly this entire thread descended into a free-for-all about a specific religion

Exactly, it is all become about How Islam abuses women!! which is not true and it only shows deep rooted hatred and ignorance about Islam.

there are many many cultures that regard the female dress code from a conservative position and judge the woman based on this code (that includes our own) and may even go so far as to abuse a woman based on her dress as they feel entitled. The law in Malaysia makes sense to me, when in Rome ya know. A woman who expects to have the freedom to go bra-less in India for example should be prepared to be harrassed.

Well said, again, this depends on as you rightly said, the CULTURE, but again some people think their culture ( western ) is the only good one and other cultures and religions and specially Islam are very evil !!

In Jerusalem a woman is required to cover her shoulders and were a skirt of appropriate length when entering a conservative jewish neighborhood, if someone doesn't know this they are quickly clued. If female workers living in Malaysia disagree then perhaps they should return to their home countries where they are not restricted.

Well said, Thank you for your comments.

 

[Proud_Muslim]

Proud Syrian/Muslim,

The way any human looks or 'dresses' (if applicable) can increase the
risk of rape from the opposite / same sex; however, the individual who
performs the rape is to be blamed 100%.

I already explained that I dont buy such nonesense, you cant go around with a basket of delicious food in a place where people are very very hungry, and then BLAME them for eating your food, this is just ABSURD.

This is a concept called accountability. Simply put, you are responsible and liable for the actions you take in life.

And why we dont apply this concept of accountability on WOMEN as well ???

I am sure that many countries have far worse rape problems then yours; however, many of these countries (including the U.S.) hold the rapist 100% accountable for his / her actions without making excuses for them.

And that is why you are FAILING and rape is INCREASING because you GOT IT WRONG.

I am come on, if you think that you are not accountable for where you stick your dick in the absence of consent then you're fooling yourself.

Everyone should be accountable for his/her actions, but why you make it just MEN'S ACTION ? why we dont look at this horrible crime ( rape ) as a REACTION to the actions some women take ?????

 

[Proud_Muslim]

Quote: So afterall, Bush is not very bad as I initially thought, and we must free the world from such mentalities.

Simply frightening. Question is who will fee us from ours.

That was Flores quote, dont take her seriously, she just ramble and insult everyone who disagree with her.