Islam Must Rule the World

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Yup. Point?

I have friends who are Israeli. None of them have ever been beaten by their fathers or cut off anyone's finger. When were you last in Israel? Are you getting all your info from Syrian TV? Is it the same Syrian TV that aired "Knight Without A Horse"?



Some don't care for their own laws. These would be criminals. Again, compare them to members of the Iranian 'justice' industry, where correct application of Iranian law means teenagers must swing and women be hounded under a burkha.



Kind of a polemical overexaggeration at the start; propaganda, really. Secondly and more pointedly, how is the killing of Israeli children with mortars and rockets and suicide bombers and poison and stabbing and whatnot (which, owing to the alternately indiscriminate or intensely personal methodology of the attacks, is far more morally wrong than the accidental killing of children while trying to strike terrorists, who often hide behind civilians) going to "stop Israel from killing innocent people"? You make it sound as if the Israelis are deliberately trying to kill civilians and Hamas and Hezbollah defend them, when exactly the opposite is true. The Israelis seek truces; Hezbollah rearms with missiles. Does this seem like they want peace?

And you get your info from American TV, the same media that aired the "300" bullshit?
Anyway, you are seriously denying that Israelis, devout religious people, do not take their Torah word for word? You are denying that within the old testament, it is said that you shall cut the hand of a man who steals?

Good to see that you know there are Israeli criminals as well.



:roflmao: Israel wants truce! LOL I forgot when bombing infrastructure was an act of Peace. If Israel wants peace, get their ass out of Palestine and they can have as much of it as they want. Antarctica is up for grabs, why can't they fuck themselves over there?:confused:

Not only that, but the IDF has commited numerous atrocities against Palestinians, so what WOULD you expect Hesbollah to do?
Hesbollah targets IDF members not Israeli infrastructure.
Hesbollah wants justice, Israel replies with more cluster bombs. Does that seem like they want peace?

As well, please give this a thought. Imagine, whatever state you live in (if you do) was taken over by a bunch of fake-asses claiming it to be theirs. They drove you out, killed your people, and now you live as a refugee in a neighboring state.
Now, wouldn't you fight back?
 
Well you just don't make sense there. First of all, what mess? The war in Iraq?
no the internal dividedness, the conflicts within Islam between its sects

look at the mess when America decides to go barging in uncalled for, yea look at that mess. So tell me, why was it stable only a century ago? Oh yea, America........
Lol, you little obsessed anti-american, I didn't even mention America and I'm not an American.

Anyway, are you implying that Christianity or :roflmao: JUDAISM would be any better?

No, not any superstition (religion) but reason (or atheism).
 
Norsefire said:
:roflmao: Israel wants truce! LOL I forgot when bombing infrastructure was an act of Peace. If Israel wants peace, get their ass out of Palestine and they can have as much of it as they want. Antarctica is up for grabs, why can't they fuck themselves over there?:confused:

This kind of stupid attitude is PART of what keeps the conflicts going. Reality lesson: Israel won't go anywhere, so live with it, or conflict with it and even more innocents will die.
 
no the internal dividedness, the conflicts within Islam between its sects

Lol, you little obsessed anti-american, I didn't even mention America and I'm not an American.



No, not any superstition (religion) but reason (or atheism).

No, no no no far from it. Islam has united the ME, but why did I mention America? Because it was the foreign interference, not Islam, that divided the region. There may be different sects, but you dont see Catholics and Methodists bombing each other now do you?

On your last comment, agreed.
 
This kind of stupid attitude is PART of what keeps the conflicts going. Reality lesson: Israel won't go anywhere, so live with it, or conflict with it and even more innocents will die.

Eh, she will, or all her people will die. If conquest is what it takes, by all means Israel will be conquered.
 
The Israelis seek truces; Hezbollah rearms with missiles. Does this seem like they want peace?

Dear geoff,

i hope all is well.

I imagine you forgot about the little Military Aid worth only 30 Billion dollars 9or is it pounds) And all the nukes and not to mention the ongoing development of their neutron bombs

~~~~~~~~~
take it ez
zak
 
Eh, she will, or all her people will die. If conquest is what it takes, by all means Israel will be conquered.

hi norsefire..

hows it going?

Eeerrrr no she wont move, that is unless you want a Nuclear holocaust.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
take it ez
zak
 
No, no no no far from it. Islam has united the ME
It is far from united. And at least 3 major countries there, at least their governments, Egypt, Turkey (both of which have non-Islamic governments) and Saudi-arabia (and Pakistan, if you would consider them middle eastern) are in favor of the US and other western countries, and 2 others occupied. Why do you think that it is united? (illusions of grandeur don't count)

, but why did I mention America? Because it was the foreign interference, not Islam, that divided the region. There may be different sects, but you dont see Catholics and Methodists bombing each other now do you?
Maybe not now (although there is infighting) but just look at European history, there was a lot of conflict between different sects within Christianity. Not like that has much to do with this does it. It had and has its own problems. I'm not sure what your getting at here.

Eh, she will, or all her people will die. If conquest is what it takes, by all means Israel will be conquered.
The last few times they did that, they failed horribly. Israel bullies everyone who oppose them there and yet nothing happens. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't bat an eyelash if they did burn. Then again I'm not sure what effect that will have on our economies, probably bad, so I'd rather not see that happen.
 
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And you get your info from American TV, the same media that aired the "300" bullshit?

300 bullshit? Are you upset about the Greek epic? Hey, tell it to Leonidas. Not American TV's fault that Xerxes and his Immortals got their asses kicked.

Anyway, you are seriously denying that Israelis, devout religious people, do not take their Torah word for word? You are denying that within the old testament, it is said that you shall cut the hand of a man who steals?

Well let's see: with your vast command of media resources, have you ever detected a case where someone in Israel got his hand cut off for stealing? Ever? Anywhere?

Good to see that you know there are Israeli criminals as well.

Ah - you err. The Israelis who tortured people in their jails - which, apparently, amounts to uncomfortable positioning and bags soaked in urine; I wonder how it might compare to torture in Iranian or Saudi or Turkish or Egyptian or Pakistani jails, just of sheer curiousity - are criminals by their own laws.

The people who hung the girl in Iran are not criminals by their own laws, but merely criminals of rationality, humanity and morality. Not legally. So little teenage girls can continue to raped by their uncles and then hung quite legally in good ol' Iran, whereas the Israelis have to face justice for their actions. That's the difference. The Iranians - despite their vastly more evil actions - are not going to be punished, since they merely upheld the laws of their land.


Israel wants truce! LOL I forgot when bombing infrastructure was an act of Peace. If Israel wants peace, get their ass out of Palestine and they can have as much of it as they want. Antarctica is up for grabs, why can't they fuck themselves over there?:confused:

Because they have no historical claim to Antarctica. The Jews, for their own security, wanted a place to live in safety. Now, admittedly, they didn't get that since their immigration was railed against by prominent figures such as the Grand Mufti, but the fact of the matter is that they immigrated peacefully and were then attacked. You seem to think that the evil Jews were on the offensive from the get-go. They weren't. They were pushed into being that way.

Not only that, but the IDF has commited numerous atrocities against Palestinians, so what WOULD you expect Hesbollah to do?

Stop firing rockets so there can be peace and economic stability.

Just kidding: I actually expect them to fire more rockets pretty much no matter what.

Hesbollah targets IDF members not Israeli infrastructure.

This is a lie.

Hesbollah wants justice, Israel replies with more cluster bombs. Does that seem like they want peace?

Hezbollah wants the death of the Jews and the destruction of Israel. (Apparently they also want to "drink Jewish blood" - although that might be Hamas. Hamas is tougher, anyway, than Hezbollah ever could be. Not that they're better than the IDF, but definitely braver than those losers at Hezbollah.)

As well, please give this a thought. Imagine, whatever state you live in (if you do) was taken over by a bunch of fake-asses claiming it to be theirs. They drove you out, killed your people, and now you live as a refugee in a neighboring state.
Now, wouldn't you fight back?

That's interesting. Now give this a thought:

Your people are being persecuted everywhere worldwide. Things are getting worse and worse. You decide to run for it before things get really crazy and, say, I don't know, some lunatic starts throwing you in ovens. Time to go.

You start emigrating to a place where, historically, your people came from and where you think you can build a society. But, when you show up, you find out that the religion of your neighbours - more numerous and better armed and backed than you are, with about a billion coreligionists lined up behind them all the way to the borders of India - think that because of your religion, you should be automatic second-class citizens, and they're not afraid of showing it. But, to be honest, you've already done that crap and you're not doing it again - and, moreover, this is your homeland. This is where your people come from, for crying out loud. Their spiritual and genetic point of origin. No way you're doing this again. So you decide not to be pushed around and you push back. Well! That touches off a firestorm, since the religious attitude of your neighbours - laid out fairly explicitly in their religious texts - is that nonbelievers have to be subservient, or convert, or die - and you're not converting. This is your spiritual homeland too, for fuck's sake. The neighbours take your resistance to being treated like shit as a call to something they call jihad (the 'lesser' kind, but seemingly the more noticeable one) and gather up arms. They start killing your people. You have guns too, a few, and you fight back. Some of your people are massacred, and some of your resistance cells go off the reservation and do the same.

Then the locals decide to call in all their friends, and all their armies from outside. You're stuck with no tanks, not many guns, and no friends. But you fight anyway; and, frankly, you kick the shit out of them. One would think it would end there; but oh, no. The hate goes on and on and on, endlessly, and all because you wouldn't do as the religion of these idiots dictated and lie down to take it up the ass, because you thought that was degrading - imagine that - and since everybody always does that to you and to avoid making waves with the locals. But on your homeland? Fuck that noise. If the neighbours can't treat you like a human being or even, say, a 'protected' 'Person of the Book', then fuck 'em.

And that's where we are today.

Also, please define "fake asses". Is this some kind of Syrian ritual involving manhood? :confused:
 
Dear geoff,

i hope all is well.

I imagine you forgot about the little Military Aid worth only 30 Billion dollars 9or is it pounds) And all the nukes and not to mention the ongoing development of their neutron bombs

~~~~~~~~~
take it ez
zak

True: yet Israel can hardly unleash their arsenal without a reason. They're pilloried enough in the international community even when they fire back with a reason.
 
Seeing as they managed to bomb civilians in Lebanon with impunity (receiving overnight deliveries of arms from the US) and were able to completely destroy the whole country without accountability, all for two soldiers captured in a conflict, that statement seems rather ridiculous
 
Yup. Point?

My point was to answer the question you asked me.

A really rational man might be aware that the immigrant Jews bought the land (at cut-throat rates, I might add) from the Ottomans, who owned it. Darn colonial powers. Yet, I daresay you won't find any bitching by Palestinians and proponents of Palestine against the Turks. Excess of rationality, maybe?

Up until 1948, the Jews only purchased 12.5% of the land they had turned into their own state of Israel. From that point on, they expanded their territory through the 1967 six-day war. This was in direct violation of the Geneva Convention wherein land cannot be confiscated through the aftermath of war. The Israelis continued to gain land and build new Jewish settlements. Even George W. Bush publicly denounced that the building was to stop...but did it?

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article2584164.ece

"A senior legal official who secretly warned the government of Israel after the Six Day War of 1967 that it would be illegal to build Jewish settlements in the occupied Palestinian territories has said, for the first time, that he still believes that he was right.

The declaration by Theodor Meron, the Israeli Foreign Ministry's legal adviser at the time and today one of the world's leading international jurists, is a serious blow to Israel's persistent argument that the settlements do not violate international law, particularly as Israel prepares to commemorate the 40th anniversary of the war in June 1967.

The legal opinion, a copy of which has been obtained by The Independent, was marked "Top Secret" and "Extremely Urgent" and reached the unequivocal conclusion, in the words of its author's summary, "that civilian settlement in the administered territories contravenes the explicit provisions of the Fourth Geneva Convention."

The Israelis knew that the settlements were illegal.
 
True: yet Israel can hardly unleash their arsenal without a reason. They're pilloried enough in the international community even when they fire back with a reason.
geoff

so what are you saying the Nuclear and Neutron bombs are for??

Well anyway at least they might be able to use some of these WMD on Irans Nuclear Program, even though the IAEA havent find any proof the iranians are building a bomb..

moving on

they are really pilloried Geoff, espically when they were blowing Lebanons infastructure to shit last year, with the approval of the UK and US with their rejection to try and broker a ceasefire straight off.



Because they have no historical claim to Antarctica. The Jews, for their own security, wanted a place to live in safety. Now, admittedly, they didn't get that since their immigration was railed against by prominent figures such as the Grand Mufti, but the fact of the matter is that they immigrated peacefully and were then attacked. You seem to think that the evil Jews were on the offensive from the get-go. They weren't. They were pushed into being that way.

:

yes i always knew the Stern Gang, Haganah, and the Irgun were pacifists


Hezbollah wants the death of the Jews and the destruction of Israel. (Apparently they also want to "drink Jewish blood" - although that might be Hamas. Hamas is tougher, anyway, than Hezbollah ever could be. Not that they're better than the IDF, but definitely braver than those losers at Hezbollah.)

:

Eeer geoff when was Hizbollah created.. You infer that they have been around since the creation of Israel with this rhetoric.

That's interesting. Now give this a thought:

Your people are being persecuted everywhere worldwide. Things are getting worse and worse. You decide to run for it before things get really crazy and, say, I don't know, some lunatic starts throwing you in ovens. Time to go.

You start emigrating to a place where, historically, your people came from and where you think you can build a society. But, when you show up, you find out that the religion of your neighbours - more numerous and better armed and backed than you are, with about a billion coreligionists lined up behind them all the way to the borders of India - think that because of your religion, you should be automatic second-class citizens, and they're not afraid of showing it. But, to be honest, you've already done that crap and you're not doing it again - and, moreover, this is your homeland. This is where your people come from, for crying out loud. Their spiritual and genetic point of origin. No way you're doing this again. So you decide not to be pushed around and you push back. Well! That touches off a firestorm, since the religious attitude of your neighbours - laid out fairly explicitly in their religious texts - is that nonbelievers have to be subservient, or convert, or die - and you're not converting. This is your spiritual homeland too, for fuck's sake. The neighbours take your resistance to being treated like shit as a call to something they call jihad (the 'lesser' kind, but seemingly the more noticeable one) and gather up arms. They start killing your people. You have guns too, a few, and you fight back. Some of your people are massacred, and some of your resistance cells go off the reservation and do the same.

Then the locals decide to call in all their friends, and all their armies from outside. You're stuck with no tanks, not many guns, and no friends. But you fight anyway; and, frankly, you kick the shit out of them. One would think it would end there; but oh, no. The hate goes on and on and on, endlessly, and all because you wouldn't do as the religion of these idiots dictated and lie down to take it up the ass, because you thought that was degrading - imagine that - and since everybody always does that to you and to avoid making waves with the locals. But on your homeland? Fuck that noise. If the neighbours can't treat you like a human being or even, say, a 'protected' 'Person of the Book', then fuck 'em.

Come on geoff, now come on as if the ISraelis really want a just / fair peace as shamir says

Yitzhak Shamir: "The sea is the same sea, and the Arabs are the same Arabs".

when justifying his non participation in the various peace processes and not to mention the doubling ( i dont remember the number) of settlements in the occupied terrirtoires after the oslo accords.

I just lveo the way a jewish family from manchester or whereveer in the world can move back to israel regardless while the palestinain refugee situation is still nto solved.

Having said that, the fucked up Arab leaders dont want a solution either, as i have mentioned on many occasions before.

Imaguine if their was peace in the MiddleEast how then could ISrael justify its arms programs espically its WMDs including Nukes and neutron bombs


~~~~~~
take it ez
zak
 
Seeing as they managed to bomb civilians in Lebanon with impunity (receiving overnight deliveries of arms from the US) and were able to completely destroy the whole country without accountability, all for two soldiers captured in a conflict, that statement seems rather ridiculous

Yes. Lebanon is one gigantic crater from north to south. The entire country has been carpetbombed. Every building flattened, every child personally run over by a Zionazi tank. Yep. Totally destroyed. Not strikes in specific locations against the positions of terrorists hiding "hull-down" to residential complexes, schools and mosques, but rather a complete mowing of the nation, utterly. Total obliteration. Complete destruction. Nothing left but rubble and a few Syrian dinars in an old ministerial attache case.

...do you know, perchance, the meaning of "hyperbole"?

I was also amused by the "without accountability". To whom is it that the Israelis should be accountable, being a separate nation? To whom is Hezbollah accountable?

Wait, wait...I know this one...Tehran?

Up until 1948, the Jews only purchased 12.5% of the land they had turned into their own state of Israel.

Really?

In 1921, Colonial Secretary Winston Churchill severed nearly four-fifths of Palestine — some 35,000 square miles — to create a brand new Arab entity, Transjordan. As a consolation prize for the Hejaz and Arabia (which are both now Saudi Arabia) going to the Saud family, Churchill rewarded Sherif Hussein's son Abdullah for his contribution to the war against Turkey by installing him as Transjordan's emir.

The British went further and placed restrictions on Jewish land purchases in what remained of Palestine, contradicting the provision of the Mandate (Article 6) stating that “the Administration of Palestine...shall encourage, in cooperation with the Jewish Agency...close settlement by Jews on the land, including State lands and waste lands not acquired for public purposes.” By 1949, the British had allotted 87,500 acres of the 187,500 acres of cultivable land to Arabs and only 4,250 acres to Jews.2

[Ed note: this would be 2.3%, not 12.5%, meaning that Jewish immigrants were even more discriminated against than previously thought. - Geoff]
2. Moshe Auman, “Land Ownership in Palestine 1880-1948,” in Michael Curtis, et al., The Palestinians, (NJ: Transaction Books, 1975), p. 25.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/myths/mf2.html

I also point out that there was in fact no "state of Israel" prior to 1948: they "had" not turned anything into anything until that point; furthermore, separation was a British decision designed to curb ongoing violence at the end of the Mandatory period.

From that point on, they expanded their territory through the 1967 six-day war. This was in direct violation of the Geneva Convention wherein land cannot be confiscated through the aftermath of war.

I assume you have a reference for this? In a related side-point, will Jordan, Egypt, Iran, Iraq and Yemen be returning property and land left behind by Jewish emigrées after 1948? Also, I wonder what would have happened had Palestine and Egypt and Syria and Jordan won the war? Would they have withdrawn as per the Geneva Convention regulations you report? Hmmm...:rolleyes:. I guess I don't really wonder.

The legal opinion, a copy of which has been obtained by The Independent, was marked "Top Secret" and "Extremely Urgent" and reached the unequivocal conclusion, in the words of its author's summary, "that civilian settlement in the administered territories contravenes the explicit provisions of the Fourth Geneva Convention."

Yes, it may indeed have been illegal - I won't even adopt the styles of some other debaters on here that might demand to see such a document - but again: were the Arab armies going to up and leave if Israel lost? Simply: no. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
 
geoff

so what are you saying the Nuclear and Neutron bombs are for??

Deterrence. Have you seen them use one yet? Do you actually expect them to nuke Iran? Come on, zak: think about it.

they are really pilloried Geoff, espically when they were blowing Lebanons infastructure to shit last year, with the approval of the UK and US with their rejection to try and broker a ceasefire straight off.

Two soldiers were taken. Why should they be forced to release other terrorists - one who bravely stove in the head of a little girl before she could cast a Zionist spell on him, one supposes - to get back their men?

yes i always knew the Stern Gang, Haganah, and the Irgun were pacifists

Why, every bit as much as Hizbollah, Hamas, the armies that invaded Israel in 1948, the terrorists that were fighting them before, including the Arab Legion and any local warlord with some rifles. I do indeed aver, not infer, that Arab attacks were going on well prior to the latest round of sillies. Some Israelis, as you point out, have indeed given up on peace, however.

I just lveo the way a jewish family from manchester or whereveer in the world can move back to israel regardless while the palestinain refugee situation is still nto solved.

It takes two to solve that equation, zak: Israel and their Arab neighbours. There was no "Palestine" until the surrounding nations' political apparati decided they didn't want them, and realized their incredible usefullness as political pawns.

Imaguine if their was peace in the MiddleEast how then could ISrael justify its arms programs espically its WMDs including Nukes and neutron bombs


~~~~~~
take it ez
zak

Again: deterrence. Deterrence is a good thing to have, if you're outnumbered 200 to one. The Americans and Russians had a deterrence reliance on nukes for sixty years even with near-parity in arms: are you implying that either one of them planned to attack? If so, why didn't they? They only had sixty years in which to do it. The Israelis have had, what? Thirty years? They seem very slow about nuking the Middle East, if that's really their goal.
 

Really.

Redemption of land in Eretz Israel, much of which had fallen into neglect under foreign rule, began in the mid-1850s with the first attempts to enable Jews to live productively in Ottoman Palestine without reliance on the "old yishuv" model of overseas support. Sir Moses Montefiore (1784-1885) made the first known land purchase by someone from outside the region in 1855: 10 hectares (250 acres) of orange groves in Jaffa, under a newly-made arrangement with the Sultan allowing these first-ever purchases. Other private acquisitions followed, and by 1882, some 2,200 hectares had been purchased by Jews. Although several of the first Zionist villages (moshavot) were built on this land, the areas were not contiguous and the idea of using land purchase to prepare for Jewish sovereignty was far in the future. Each purchase entailed a cumbersome bureaucratic procedure vis-à-vis the local Turkish authorities, which, in the final declining phase of the Ottoman Empire, were either hostile to or uninterested in Jewish holdings in the sparsely populated backwater province that Palestine had become. Nearly all land was owned by the state (and was passed on to subsequent sovereigns) or by private and public entities through title or leasing arrangements. This state of affairs, coupled with the frequent need to resort to bribery in official dealings, gave the Jewish purchases a clandestine complexion that would recur in subsequent years.

Although the creation of the Jewish National Fund was originally proposed by Judah Alkalai in 1847 it had to wait until the Fifth Zionist Congress in Basel, Switzerland in 1901 to become a reality. The Jewish National Fund (Keren Kayemeth LeYisrael) was established to buy land in Palestine for reclamation and Jewish settlement. In its first decade, the JNF built a worldwide fundraising organization based on sale of stamps, collection "Blue Boxes" in homes and schools and solicitation of donations. In the spring of 1903, JNF acquired its first parcel of land: 800 acres in Hadera. Other modest purchases were made in 1904 and 1908 in Lower Galilee, Judea, and the Lake Kinneret region, and two forms of settlement that would prove crucial in the land-acquisition enterprise were pioneered there: the cooperative (moshav) and the collective (kevutsa, later kibbutz).

From the start, the organization focused on greening the land through the planting of trees. JNF got involved in tree planting for many reasons, including as a way to fulfill the Biblical commandment. In order to solidify ownership of land purchased by JNF on behalf of the Jewish community, and in accordance with prevailing laws of the day, trees were planted whenever a new piece of land was purchased. In 1908, the first JNF trees were planted at Hulda: olive trees in memory of Theodor Herzl, the founding father of Zionism. In 1920, JNF expanded its role to help reclaim the swamps of Palestine. There quickly followed afforestation efforts. Since 1920, millions of trees have been planted in Israel by the Jewish National Fund.

Baron Benjamin (Edmond James) de Rothschild (1845-1934) enlisted in this cause after being petitioned by the leaders of Rishon Lezion, one of the First Aliya villages. His patronage embraced 12 settlements at all three levels of land redemption: purchase, reclamation and economically viable settlement. To make these possible, he established an administration that, although staffed in part by condescending officials who evoked the independent-minded settlers' resentment, institutionalized all three aspects of land redemption. The best-known settlements sponsored by Rothschild are Metulla, Zikhron Ya'akov, Rishon Lezion, and Rosh Pina. Metulla (est. 1896) is an example of a purchase that had the further advantages of controlling water sources and establishing the northern limit of Jewish settlement. In 1900, Rothschild transferred the settlements, their agricultural enterprises, and 25,000 hectares of land to the Jewish Colonization Association (ICA, est. 1891), which he continued to support in various ways.

In a military biography of Moshe Dayan, the early Zionist activity is described this way:

"Using Rothschild's money, these Jews purchased land from absentee Turkish landlords. To the Arab tenant farmers, the transfer of land from Turkish to Jewish ownership was of little consequence since the Jews rehired them as agricultural workers."
By the time Israel became a state in 1948, JNF owned 12.5 percent of all the land of Israel on which 80 percent of Israel's population now lives. With this ownership came the responsibility of transforming the land into a beautiful and fertile area that would be a suitable home for the new state.


http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_early_palestine_zionists_land.php

I also point out that there was in fact no "state of Israel" prior to 1948: they "had" not turned anything into anything until that point; furthermore, separation was a British decision designed to curb ongoing violence at the end of the Mandatory period.

Nobody said there was. I said they turned into a state of Israel by 1948 after obtaining land.

I assume you have a reference for this? In a related side-point, will Jordan, Egypt, Iran, Iraq and Yemen be returning property and land left behind by Jewish emigrées after 1948? Also, I wonder what would have happened had Palestine and Egypt and Syria and Jordan won the war? Would they have withdrawn as per the Geneva Convention regulations you report? Hmmm...:rolleyes:. I guess I don't really wonder.

A senior legal official who secretly warned the government of Israel after the Six Day War of 1967 that it would be illegal to build Jewish settlements in the occupied Palestinian territories has said, for the first time, that he still believes that he was right.

The declaration by Theodor Meron, the Israeli Foreign Ministry's legal adviser at the time and today one of the world's leading international jurists, is a serious blow to Israel's persistent argument that the settlements do not violate international law, particularly as Israel prepares to commemorate the 40th anniversary of the war in June 1967.

The legal opinion, a copy of which has been obtained by The Independent, was marked "Top Secret" and "Extremely Urgent" and reached the unequivocal conclusion, in the words of its author's summary, "that civilian settlement in the administered territories contravenes the explicit provisions of the Fourth Geneva Convention."

Judge Meron, president of the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia until 2005, said that, after 40 years of Jewish settlement growth in the West Bank - one of the main problems to be solved in any peace deal: " I believe that I would have given the same opinion today."

Judge Meron, a holocaust survivor, also sheds new light on the aftermath of the 1967 war by disclosing that the Foreign Minister, Abba Eban, was " sympathetic" to his view that civilian settlement would directly conflict with the Hague and Geneva conventions governing the conduct of occupying powers.

Despite the legal opinion, which was forwarded to Levi Eshkol, the Prime Minister, but not made public at the time, the Labour cabinet progressively sanctioned settlements. This paved the way to growth which has resulted in at least 240,000 Jewish settlers in the West Bank today.


http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article2584164.ece

For you to insinuate that all of modern Israel was purchased makes me laugh. Only 12.5% at best (and you yourself say 2.5%) was purchased; the rest was obtained from colonialism and the aftermath of war, all of which were illegal under the Geneva Convention.
 
For you to insinuate that all of modern Israel was purchased makes me laugh. Only 12.5% at best (and you yourself say 2.5%) was purchased; the rest was obtained from colonialism and the aftermath of war, all of which were illegal under the Geneva Convention.

Your point makes me laugh: the Arab armies were going to exterminate the Jews and take all their legally bought holdings, and you complain about the Israelis violating the Geneva Convention?? What planet are you from again?
 
Your point makes me laugh: the Arab armies were going to exterminate the Jews and take all their legally bought holdings, and you complain about the Israelis violating the Geneva Convention?? What planet are you from again?

The Israeli settlement off the bat by the British Mandate was itself a violation - so was the Arabs' initiating of the war. No single entity is at complete fault here; however, the continual colonizing by Israel and growing settlements is what is enraging people like me worldwide.
 
I also believe that ongoing settlement should be stopped. The problem is that the Israelis would argue that so long as there are attacks they need further buffering, and they also have a point.
 
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