In regards to atheism.

[Xelasnave.1947]

First you have to think like a jelly and ask yourself

Do you want to be nailed to the wall?

Next you have to accept

wait for it

Jelly Is

Yes jelly is....

But I want to take you to the next level of enlightenment can you offer a way to nail it to a wall.
You must know I love destroying anologies and this one I have nailed so to speak.
Give up?
Alex

 

[Michael 345]

Yes jelly is....

But I want to take you to the next level of enlightenment can you offer a way to nail it to a wall.
You must know I love destroying anologies and this one I have nailed so to speak.
Give up?
Alex

My solution

Gather tools

nail the large flat head type

suitable hammer

jug to boil water

bowl to make jelly

unformed jelly and

shallow almost flat silicone jelly mold

Hold a 3 hours safety meeting to ensure you can proceed

I'll skip the next boring 25 steps

Place large flathead nail in the middle of the silicon mould point up

Make jelly and pour into mould making sure nail stays upright

When jelly sufficiently set and nail will not fall over

place in freezer overnight

Choose a suitable wall and position

Take out jelly from mould

Place point of nail in centre of where you want jelly

Tap head of nail gently until jelly flat on wall

Caution this state will not last



I reckon I can go another 800 post on this if I change jelly to someone and wall to a cross to stay on topic

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

My solution

Full marks,

You could also leave the jelly in the mold and nail the mold and jelly to the wall.

Choose a suitable wall and position

Predrill hole for nail.
Bless nail.

Caution this state will not last

Select wall at South Pole.

I reckon I can go another 800 post on this if I change jelly to someone and wall to a cross to stay on topic

You may need larger freezer.

Second method.

Lay wall on the ground nail jelly and wonder what was the point.

Alex.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Method number 4

Place netting in mold pour in jelly set, remove and nail.

Alex

 

[Michael 345]

Method number 4

Place netting in mold pour in jelly set, remove and nail.

Alex

And that from your perspective is why you are without jelly

Jellyists

Until you look around you and accept everything is jelly you will remain Jellyists

Jelly Is

Is that so hard to accept?

 

[Jan Ardena]

Jan I say the same to you.

We're talking about you, not me.

You would have to be God to be able to take everything into account Jan.
Does it not make sence to operate with what we can establish within some sort of reason rather than just invent an entity which even if found to exist would be beyond our understanding.

Who has invented an entity?
Certainly not me. But if I were to, you would be right.

If God exists we can obviously say he was not an invention of man but there is no escape from the proposition that man created religion.

Seeing as all you have is speculation, why don't try from a differnt angle? It's not as if you have anything to lose.

I understand the proposition but that does not really take us any where.

You mean it doesn't take you anywhere. I can't be held accountable for that.

You can say God is everything but if you really accept that it means that you and I are each a part of God talking to each other, mere voices in his head.

It's kind of pointless discussing it at this point, because you seem unwilling to try and comprehend what I'm saying. You just keep coming with the same old stuff.

jan.

 

[Jan Ardena]

I get it you are busy and had no time to think.

If you could continue re perceptions that could work.

Alex

No, I meant it.
You start at that point and work your way back till begin to comprehend what is being said. You must accept that God Is. Not believe it, just accept it. Like you are prepared to accept any character. When I watch a movie, I find that you get the best understanding when you accept what is unfolding in front of you. Once you understand what you are reading, or if somebody tries to explain to you, then you will be in a better position to form proper opinions. At the moment you're just speclulating, and defending. Hardly a good platform for comprehension.

jan.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Is that so hard to accept?

I like jelly.

It can be proved by our sences.

Sight ....you can see it.
Touch .....you can feel it.
Smell....you can smell it.
Hearing....drop it and you can hear it.

Jelly is real.
Jelly exists.

Jelly makes great wall art.

Some use jelly instead of brains.

Alex

 

[Michael 345]

Give up?
Alex

Bout time you did

As I understand it from a recent post you have to run the movie backwards until you understand what it is all about

(Hint - it does NOT involve jelly) but jelly still Is

 

[Michael 345]

It can be proved by our sences.

Sight ....you can see it.
Touch .....you can feel it.
Smell....you can smell it.
Hearing....drop it and you can hear it.

Jelly is real.
Jelly exists.

As I said

That's EVIDENCE

We live in a wondrous Universe brought to by the Jelly Is

living in the sky with unicorns

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

We're talking about you, not me.

No Jan you are talking about me and I am talking about you.

Who has invented an entity?

Being subjective it is invented by the mind of he who would imagine it.

Certainly not me.

Of course you have invented it Jan there is no other explanation.

Your God is real in your mind but does not exist elsewhere and if it did you would be compelled to show it, would you not? or would you hide this God that you wish to exist?

Seeing as all you have is speculation,

Jan to even glimpse this God of which we find no evidence we can only employ speculation.

You speculate that you have found God and you speculate that you have indeed found God in your mind.

You speculate upon Gods existence but your speculation goes without evidence. Your reality is personal is that beyond your ability to grasp?

It's kind of pointless discussing it at this point, because you seem unwilling to try and comprehend what I'm saying. You just keep coming with the same old stuff.

And repeating God is.... does not suffer the same critism.

I offer you opportunity to present evidence yet you fail to offer evidence.

You suggest perception is important then suggest a back track and where do we return?...God is.

Your invention although real to you does not exist...

Alex

 

[Michael 345]

No Jan you are talking about me and I am talking about you.

And the wheels on the bus go round and round

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

You must accept that God Is.

Why because you say so?
Present your authority entitling you to make such a demand.
Can you?
Will you?

When I watch a movie, I find that you get the best understanding when you accept what is unfolding in front of you.

So embrace fiction if you wish and treat it as your reality but remember that reality you embrace is within your mind the events of, and the characters in, the movie do not exist other than as an imaginary perception.

At the moment you're just speclulating, and defending.

Speculating yes, that you have nothing more than a vivid imagination in which you harbour a reality embracing your creation that does not exist.

And what do I defend?

The reasonable expectation that if one presents a story that evidence should accompany the story to identify it as fiction or nonfiction?

Do I defend any more than reason and truth.

Why employ such a tactic?

Hardly a good platform for comprehension

How can you say this, how?
Would you reject evidence and still ask that one should comprehend?

Your argument has run out of steam.
You are falling behind on the road to a higher enlightenment.
Try harder.

Alex

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Bout time you did

Not yet ...not when we have just started.
We have already learnt God is...
Who knows what will be revealed next?
Alex

 

[Jan Ardena]

Of course you have invented it Jan there is no other explanation.

Yes there is. You cannot currently comprehend God.

Your God is real in your mind but does not exist elsewhere and if it did you would be compelled to show it, would you not? or would you hide this God that you wish to exist?

Alex can't see God, therefore God does not exist. End of.
There's not a lot you can say, other than to try and say the same thing, in a ever so slightely different way. The thing is, you are limited to God not existing.

Jan to even glimpse this God of which we find no evidence we can only employ speculation.

Oh well!

You speculate that you have found God and you speculate that you have indeed found God in your mind.

Where did I speculate that?

You speculate upon Gods existence but your speculation goes without evidence. Your reality is personal is that beyond your ability to grasp?

There's not much to say to that.
But it all stems from 'I can't see God, therefore God does not exist'.
And we know you can't go anywhere with that.

And repeating God is.... does not suffer the same critism.

No. Because you don't even try to get it.
I get where your coming from. You're atheist. You're limited to God does not exist, because you can't see Him. You will always be limited, until you want to break free from your current state of closed-mindedness.

I offer you opportunity to present evidence yet you fail to offer evidence.

Therefore God does not exist. Ta Daaaa?
Oh you're just a big ol' winner aren't you?

You suggest perception is important then suggest a back track and where do we return?...God is.

As you've no idea of God, other than what you wish think in order keep your ignorance fresh, I suggest you contemplate God Is.
Or not. It's your choice.

Your invention although real to you does not exist...

That statement is the top of your game. You cannot follow with anything. You don't even have a reason to want to say it. You can't explain it. You know nothing about God, other than God does not exist for you. But you can't even accept that. If God doesn't exist for you, then there is no God for anybody. That's the sad part.

How many more times can you say the same thing.
It has no effect, because you are atheist, meaning, God does not exist as far as you're aware. So obviously you're capable of saying something like that. But it is ultimately meaningless.

jan.

 

[Jan Ardena]

Why because you say so?
Present your authority entitling you to make such a demand.

Sorry, I was just trying to help you along.
That was a waste of time, hey.

So embrace fiction if you wish and treat it as your reality but remember that reality you embrace is within your mind the events of, and the characters in, the movie do not exist other than as an imaginary perception.

Your thinking is so wooden. Just because movies are by and large, fiction. It doesn't mean they don't contain truth, wisdom, information.
But you get the best out of it, when you accept the scenario, superman can fly, the hulk turns green when he mad, marty mcfly did go back to the future. It doesn't mean you believe it, it just mean you enjoyed it.
You can enjoy learning about God, without thinking that you have believe it. But you don't want to. You want to remain in your state, and pass to others.

And what do I defend?

You defend your ignorance.

How can you say this, how?
Would you reject evidence and still ask that one should comprehend?

You're pretending to want knowledge of God (you say evidence, but you've no idea what that could possibly be), when I tell you something, you reject it because you think there's not enough of it. So I give you a few little hints on how to begin to get your mind prepared, and you just throw it back in my face.
It is very boring, because you're trying to get some kind closure, or win the discussion. But you're limited. You can only repeat the same stuff. If you refuse to try and comprehend God, then your questions, and queries are meaningless.
They all add up to 'Alex can't see God, therefore God does not exist.

Your argument has run out of steam.
You are falling behind on the road to a higher enlightenment.
Try harder.

I'm okay with you thinking that because I know you are incapable of comprehending God. It's just a pity that your mind is closed, or we could have a nice conversation on mutual grounds. But you will insist on blowing your horn with the same old tune.
Mix it up man.

jan.

 

[Michael 345]

Who knows what will be revealed next?

Jelly really really Is?

Except when it isn't????

 

[Beer w/Straw]

Well, at least Jan the guru hasn't asked for money.

Oh, and if you want to find God, plan a vacation July 1st maybe?


Ottawa has promised to introduce legalization by July 1, but cannabis industry is divided on challenges ahead

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toron...a-industry-readies-for-legalization-1.4076157

That's basically what Jan is.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Sorry, I was just trying to help you along.

Apology accepted.

But I get it now.

You are trying to introduce me to God so to speak whilst I am asking for evidence.

I thank you for, on your part, taking it to that level.

I sence you feel you are doing me a favour and I appreciate that.

So I will ask nicely and with respect to your approach if there is any other way to do it or in your view is the lay back and let it flow approach the only way.

You can't just send me some photos of God at a rally or something?

Your thinking is so wooden.

I like trees.

It doesn't mean they don't contain truth, wisdom, information.

They are written by folk who write for a living, they employ certain tactics to make the movie entertaining, they seek a reality for others to enjoy.

That's OK to entertain the masses.

But these writers often have little life experience and can only try to replicate the real world using their imagination and borrowed experience.

I do not sift through created experience for truth I find it in the real world via participation and interaction with people who exist and learn from events that I witness in the real world and not on a screen.

I rather watch a documentary or a show on animals rather than a made up story.

So I put no value in finding truth from superman stories.

Those stories leave the viewer open to wild imagination rather than creative imagination.

You can enjoy learning about God, without thinking that you have believe it.

I can, I could, I am talking to you.

OK rather than evidence tell me something so I can learn more about your position.

You defend your ignorance.

You attack what you perceive as my ignorance but I am not defending it.

So I give you a few little hints on how to begin to get your mind prepared, and you just throw it back in my face.

Just remember Jan I am not seeking admission to your universe I simply ask that you describe it for me.

But I feel flattered and indeed priveldged that you consider me worthy that you extend the invitation.

That is not lost on me and I don't seek to throw it in your face.

Look Jan I have greater respect for you and your belief than you probably grasp and all I am trying to do when I ask for evidence is to try and work out in my mind how you can accept what I find unacceptable.

A reasonable answer when I say "are you crazy?" ...
I am trying to understand where beliefs starts I suppose.

Is there more than it just popping into your imagination I guess is my question.

I try to understand you I suppose and how you accept God I am not looking to find God.

But you will insist on blowing your horn with the same old tune.

I play the guitar but the rest is right.

Oh you're just a big ol' winner aren't you?

Now Jan I started seeking victory I have enough wisdom to see that.

That is how it goes with forum chatter.

We all like to think we can win.

But sincerely now it is not about wining.

I am not confident I could beat you in an argument as I think you are very very good.

You are probably better educated and you come over as smarter than me.

But I respect you Jan and am interested in what you have to say about how you think about God and where and how you developed your faith.

You know how I think that won't change and although I say I will take you to a higher level of enlightenment that won't happen either.

I don't want to win anymore I don't want to try and put you under me...and I sincerely regret that was a small part of my motive earlier.

I have a saying that I usually rely upon but forgot it for a while here...

Never look up to someone or down to someone...

We are all equal and all worthy of high respect.

Thank you for treating me better than the others.

Alex

 

[Michael 345]

Thank you for treating me better than the others.

You are way way way to polite

I was wrong to equate your conversation (it fails as a debate) to Ping Pong

Much more Ping Po(e) Po Po Po

Same same nothing

Your politeness is being taken advantage of or I am way to cynical?

I sometimes watch the entertainer Dr Phil

Not so much to increase my medical knowledge, although he does on occasions have interesting Medical cases, but to watch him pick apart the justifications the excuses the person in the social situations put forward for their actions

He has a massive Christian bias which shines out but part of me sorta thinks while his beliefs are genuine is he pushing it for the entertainment benefit value?

Funny thing is the belief while there is not overt

He stops way short of the Telepreacher who puts the head of the sinner on his shoulder mumbling god forgives you

He does push his and families books and charities and borders on promoting Woo sometimes

I would dearly like to see him attempt to untangle this stale pretzel conversation

I would take bets he would use one of his catchphrase

Either

Did someone write stupid on my forehead? Or

This is not my first rodeo. Or

Look I don't have a dog in this fight. Or

You need to understand

That's entrainment

Please apply to go on the show and stop prancing around in the feather weight boxing ring with powder puff words which are soooo ineffective