If God has created the Universe and everything in it, then ...

davewhite04 said:
Our Solar system seems completely ordered too, so what?
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But you didn't say that's why you believe in God. You said it was due to your study of biology. The arrangement of our Solar system is far from orderly, especially in it's earlier stages. It's order can be attributed to unintelligent gravity.

As an atheist, I also believe that most of what Jesus is reported to have taught was good.
 
I think the apparent order, or complex interactions of matter, can be attributed to the nature of chemistry. Chemistry is more understood now than in the past, and there doesn't seem to be anything supernatural about it.

Let me ask you, where does God's order come from?
 
spidergoat said:
I think the apparent order, or complex interactions of matter, can be attributed to the nature of chemistry. Chemistry is more understood now than in the past, and there doesn't seem to be anything supernatural about it.
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Where did the chemicals come from?

Do you believe the elements are created when stars are born?
 
Dave,

Well if you didn't crap your nappy then you would have ended up in ER.
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No, she didn’t know you were going to crap. All she had was a high probability expectation that that event was likely soon. If you suddenly had a brain hemorrhage and died then the event would not have occurred. Ignoring for the moment the nasty involuntary bodily actions that occur at death.

Something with omniscience will know with certainty all details of future events including all choices you will ever make, and at the time of creation until the end of time. In very real terms your entire life would have been completely predetermined.

If your god is omniscient then free will is impossible. The two conditions cannot coexist.
 
It is controversial because a birth of a new star has never been observed, that's not science in my book.
 
Cris said:
Dave,

No, she didn’t know you were going to crap. All she had was a high probability expectation that that event was likely soon. If you suddenly had a brain hemorrhage and died then the event would not have occurred. Ignoring for the moment the nasty involuntary bodily actions that occur at death.

Something with omniscience will know with certainty all details of future events including all choices you will ever make, and at the time of creation until the end of time. In very real terms your entire life would have been completely predetermined.

If your god is omniscient then free will is impossible. The two conditions cannot coexist.
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I used a perfect parent in a perfect situation, my bad.

The point is that the parent knew better than you did, and they knew the outcome and you didn't.
 
davewhite04 said:
It is controversial because a birth of a new star has never been observed, that's not science in my book.
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On the night of January 23, 2004, Jay McNeil was in his backyard in Kentucky staring at the stars with his small telescope, as he had each night for years. While he watched, the patch of sky right next to the well-known gas cloud Messier 78 suddenly flared. McNeil, an amateur astronomer, had witnessed the birth of a star, a sight recorded by only two astronomers during the past century.
 
spider,

Stars do create the elements by nuclear fusion, that much is not controversial.
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Right, but they are formed in the process from simpler elements, they are not created from nothing.

We know of no event where something comes from nothing.
 
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