how peaceful is islam ?

[GeoffP]

If a person is wrongly sentenced to death, this is a regrettable thing. If it is intentional the ones responsible will be burned in Hell as they are made to take an oath in court that if they lie, may they be cursed three times. In Islamic shariah law, the defendant must be found guilty without a feather of a doubt. If not, then the prosecution cannot go on and the prosecutor can be punished for presenting false evidence.

This - is - ludicrous. If fault is found and someone wrongly sentenced to death, waving false allusions to a perceived punishment in the afterlife is amount to nothing: no justice whatsoever.

Amount to saying: kill em all, let God sort em out.

Geoff

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

shariah law and the words of the Qu'ran are different

 

[GeoffP]

So is shariah law wrong, then?

Geoff

 

[spidergoat]

Those who murder, rape, oppress others should be punished. This is common sense, and some acts like murder and rape require a high punishment like execution to prevent these crimes from increasing.

Who is punished, the rapist or the victim?

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

So is shariah law wrong, then?

Geoff

It's like any religion, the rules are rewritten by guys to suit themselves.

Quoted from web:
"Shariah law: FAQs

CBC News Online | May 26, 2005

What is Shariah?
The word Shariah means "the path to a watering hole." It denotes an Islamic way of life – not just a system of criminal justice.

It is a code of living that most Muslims adopt as part of their faith. Some countries formally institute it as the law of the land, enforced by the courts.

However, the way Shariah law is applied from country to country can vary widely.

How did it originate?
According to Muslim scholars, the Prophet Muhammad laid down the laws. Some of the laws are said to be direct commands stated in the Qur'an. Other laws were based on rulings Muhammad is said to have given to cases that occurred during his lifetime. These secondary laws are based on what's called the Sunnah – the Prophet's words, example and way of life.

One of the major concerns of people critical of Shariah law is that it is subject to interpretation and evolution. There is virtually no formal certification process to designate someone as being qualified to interpret Islamic law.

As it stands today, almost anyone can make rulings as long as they have the appearance of piety and a group of followers."


NOTE the distinction made above between words of Qu'ran and Mohammed own rules, words of 'God' and of Mohammed would differ slightly re self interest do you not think?


The Qu'ran is an interesting document with rules and guidelines about how to 'live'. Bearing in mind the period it was written, it brought order to very disorderly period in time. It also took 22yrs to write and was written in such a way that cannot be replicated today, was dictated by an unschooled illiterate. No scholar today can explain how such an individual came up with a text such as that of the Qu'ran, hence accepted as words of 'God' in absence of better explanation! There is nothing like it. Not even Shakespear can rival it. Translated version not same as original arabic as poeticness and rhythum lost.

Its also 'predictive' and some of the things it predicted are coming to pass, and yet you would never have imagined at that time such things exisiting...so its interesting.

It promotes equality for women too, so it just shows how FAR from the original text some religious practices have stretched!

 

[GeoffP]

Generally, the victim, in my understanding.

Geoff

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

I think Islam is funny.

A lot of Mouslim Suckers died for a single piece of crap cartoon about a lunatic who existed more than 20o0 years ago.

These Mouslim are like animals, they live like animals, they die like animals and hence they can be killed like animals.

Oh I forgot, they treat animals better than women.

You display distinct lack of knowledge about er.......everything......and brainwashed by propoganda.

One reason USA determined to continue brainwashing u fools....OIL, beginning and end. U wonder why USA targetting IRAN....obvious as soon as IRAQ was invaded, IRAN would always be next cos OIL wise thats the next place to go to steal it.

Muslims don't go banging on doors trying to recruit and convert as do some religions and they don't deny mixed religion marriages to ensure purity of their faith. These simple facts alone should tell u something?

There will always be extremists who use religion to gain power and there will always be corrupt governments who feign attacks on themselves so they can retaliate and look like the victim fighting back rather than the super power trying to dictate and dominate.

 

[spidergoat]

Modern society runs on oil, so any country that produces enough of it becomes a world power, that makes it important. That is how Iraq and Iran have the power to cause trouble. I'm not saying I support this war, but that's the reality of life in the 21st century.

Iran will not be next, I predict. It's just an issue to run on for November, same as abortion and gay marriage.

 

[DiamondHearts]

Theory,

Shariah law is based on the Quran and Sunnah, however there are variations of Shariah because Islam is not one monolithic group. There are many tanzeems, organizations, within Islam which differ on policies on how to interprete Islam and how to practice Shariah. Since 1924 and the dissolution of the Uthmania Khalifah (ottoman) the shariah is subject to variation since there is no worldwide Islam body which is accepted as the leader and Khalifat among Muslims. Shariah law is a complete system and should be preceeded by the formation of the Khalifat. Shariah law is an entire system of rule like Representative Democracy, and Communism. Most islamic governments only practice minor aspects of Shariah, and this is only due to the cultures of the countries, most Muslim countries are secular by nature, this is largely due to Western control and pressure in the region. Muslims as a whole would like Shariah law to be implemented in their countries and the establishment of a Khalifat.

Islam in the Quran is called a deen, which means a complete way of life. Shariah is the political, judicial law of the Quran and Sunnah. Shariah is flexible outside of the Quran and Sunnah, and is open to general consensus and majority opinion as was the practice of the Holy Prophet (s) and his companians.

Theory, I know you want to understand Islam unlike some of the people on this thread. So I will answer your questions.

A Muslim is someone who submits to Allah (swt) almighty in Islam.
Islam is the religion, way of life, of someone submitting to the will of Allah (swt) as a Muslim.

Islam is not merely a religion, and a Muslim who sidelines their religion is not considered a true Muslim.

Allah (swt) has created Islam as a guideline for life, which includes the government structure, the economic policies, political life, public life, private life, and dealings with people along with much more.

i can understand why you wouldn't respond to racism
but idiocy?
i am an utter and complete IDIOT when it comes to islam
so remember that when my questions about islam seem idiotic

I was not referring to you. I was referring to this:

Who is punished, the rapist or the victim?

And this:

Generally, the victim, in my understanding.

Geoff

Peace

 

[spidergoat]

http://www.muslimtents.com/sistersinislam/PressStatements/06042000.htm

 

[GeoffP]

Muslims as a whole would like Shariah law to be implemented in their countries and the establishment of a Khalifat.

And all of them would like to be killed if they ever decide to leave islam.

Right?

Diamond, you're an utterly lost cause.

Geoff

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

Theory,



A Muslim is someone who submits to Allah (swt) almighty in Islam.
Islam is the religion, way of life, of someone submitting to the will of Allah (swt) as a Muslim.

I found my book, this is what it says re the above:
"Islam is not the same as Muslim. Islam is a way of living one's life; Muslim is a descriptive term for the huge group of people who aspire to follow the tenets of Islam."

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

http://www.muslimtents.com/sistersinislam/PressStatements/06042000.htm

This link is good example of how 'you' guys make up your own rules to suit your own needs. These rules re four witness'es to rape were NOT I can almost guarrantee written as rules in the Quran.

Mohammed may have writen them..I really don't know..??But then he as a man...not 'God.' There IS a difference.

Check back 100 yrs, did we have a penalty in UK for rape at all...witnesses or no witnesses...was it considered a prisonable crime.......? Hmmmmm indeed

 

[DiamondHearts]

“Concerning a woman who was pursued by a man, and she killed him to protect herself, Ahmad said: ‘If she knew that he wanted [to rape] her, and she killed him to protect herself, then she is not at fault.’ Ahmad mentioned the hadeeth which al-Zuhri reported from al-Qaasim ibn Muhammad, from ‘Ubayd ibn ‘Umayr, in which it said that a man had visitors from [the tribe of] Hudhayl, and he wanted [to rape] a woman, so she threw a rock at him and killed him. ‘Umar said, ‘By Allaah, there is no diyah for him ever’ i.e., she did not have to pay the ‘blood money’ for him. If it is permissible to defend one's money, which one can give away, then a woman defending and protecting herself and her honour which cannot be given away, is clearly more permissible than a man defending his money. If this is clear, then she is obliged to defend herself if she can, because letting someone overpower her [rape her] is haraam, and by not defending herself, she lets him overpower her.” [al-Mughni, 8/331]

In Islam, sexual autonomy and pleasure is a fundamental right for both women and men (Ghazâlî); taking by force someone’s right to control the sexual activity of one’s body is thus a form of hiraba.

Rape as hiraba is a violent crime that uses sexual intercourse as a weapon. The focus in a hiraba prosecution is the accused rapist and his intent and physical actions, and not second-guessing the consent of the rape victim. Hiraba does not require four witnesses to prove the offense, circumstantial evidence, medical data and expert testimony form the evidence used to prosecute such crimes.

Islamic legal responses to rape are not limited to a criminal prosecution for hiraba. Islamic jurisprudence also provides an avenue for civil redress for a rape survivor in its law of "jirah" (wounds). Islamic law designates ownership rights to each part of one’s body, and a right to corresponding compensation for any harm done unlawfully to any of those parts. Islamic law calls this the ‘law of jirah’ (wounds). Harm to a sexual organ, therefore, entitles the person harmed to appropriate financial compensation under classical Islamic jirah jurisprudence. Each school of Islamic law has held that where a woman is harmed through sexual intercourse (some include marital intercourse), she is entitled to financial compensation for the harm. Further, where this intercourse was without the consent of the woman, the perpetrator must pay the woman both the basic compensation for the harm, as well as an additional amount based on the ‘diyya’ (financial compensation for murder, akin to a wrongful death payment).

http://www.crescentlife.com/articles/islamic psych/rape_and_incest_islamic_perspective.htm

Sûrah al An'am 6.151:
"Do not take any human being's life, (the life) which God has declared to be sacred - otherwise than in (the pursuit of) justice: this has He enjoined upon you so that you might use your reason."

 

[GeoffP]

In Islam, sexual autonomy and pleasure is a fundamental right for both women and men (Ghazâlî); taking by force someone’s right to control the sexual activity of one’s body is thus a form of hiraba.

Oh? And what happens to "go into them as ye well; they are a tilth for you"?

It's funny, sharia and Quran. They just can't seem to get along.

Geoff

 

[leopold]

Oh? And what happens to "go into them as ye well; they are a tilth for you"?

It's funny, sharia and Quran. They just can't seem to get along.

Geoff

isn't that like saying catholics and baptists can't get along?
they are both christian

diamondhearts
what "flavors" of islam are there?
i suppose you could say denominations?

 

[DiamondHearts]

isn't that like saying catholics and baptists can't get along?
they are both christian

diamondhearts
what "flavors" of islam are there?
i suppose you could say denominations?

Different Islamic groups have different ways of interpreting shariah, but they interprete the Quran the exact same way. The Quran is plain and easy to understand, so there is little difference on Quran. It is the Sunnah and hadiths which are different and forms the basis of differences among the various groups.

The Sunni are based on the Sunnah, which are the practices and actions of the Holy Prophet (s) as observed by early Muslims. Their books are the Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Tirmizi, etc.

The Shiat are the followers (of Ali), they base their beliefs of Imams loyal only to Hazrat Ali during the dispute of the the assassination of Hazrat Usman. They don't believe alot of the books of Sunnah which Sunni believe in, but they essentially have the same view of the Quran and also same basic beliefs, notably the seven principles of faith and five pillars of Islam.

Sufi is not a division in Islam because they believe in Quran and Sunnah the exact same way Sunnis do. The Sufi are known mainly as religious Sunni monks who believe that one's life should be mainly spent in worshipping Allah (swt) in solitude from the worldly life. Sufi's believe in the Sunni scholars and have their own personal religious teachers.

Wahabbi, Salafism are different in that they believe mainly in the teachings of a few of the early scholars and reject some of them. Their division is based on the teachings of Sheikh Abdullah Abdul-Wahhab, who emphasized a different approach to return of Islam by emphasizing resistance to biddat (innovation). They are still Sunni.

All other divisions like Bahi, Ahmadiya (Qadiani), Yazidi, Ibadi, Nation of Islam are all deemed as not Muslim because they do not believe in the one true Allah (swt) and do not accept the Holy Prophet Muhammad (s) as the last messenger of Allah (swt)

Peace.

 

[Ritri5432]

Different Islamic groups have different ways of interpreting shariah, but they interprete the Quran the exact same way. .

Let's put it this way, it's extremely easy to interpret the Quran to murdering and hating the innocent non-Muslims, it all depends who teaches you, that's why the first thing the west has to do in fighting IslamoFascism is, arrest radical clerics (like poison-mosque Imam, racist: Abu Hamza) that their hands are the dirty ones from the global Islamic Jihad massacres on the Millions from the Sudan through own brothers & sisters in Algeria, Iraq, through dead Israeli babbies, through most cruel use of own "palestinian" kids as bombs as shields, through massacres in NY, London, Madrid, etc. through "moderate" Arab Muslim brutal regimes' crimes, through Pakistani (and other) Muslims upon Indians, through massacres in Bali etc.

 

[Muslim]

Let's put it this way, it's extremely easy to interpret the Quran to murdering and hating the innocent non-Muslims, it all depends who teaches you, that's why the first thing the west has to do in fighting IslamoFascism is, arrest radical clerics (like poison-mosque Imam, racist: Abu Hamza) that their hands are the dirty ones from the global Islamic Jihad massacres on the Millions from the Sudan through own brothers & sisters in Algeria, Iraq, through dead Israeli babbies, through most cruel use of own "palestinian" kids as bombs as shields, through massacres in NY, London, Madrid, etc. through "moderate" Arab Muslim brutal regimes' crimes, through Pakistani (and other) Muslims upon Indians, through massacres in Bali etc.

Crimes in Pakistan which ones? I live in Pakistan never heard of this before...

 

[Ritri5432]

MAFKARNA again!
Try the BLOODY bombings in India or in Kashmir, by Islamists 'every so often' , "enlightened" "truthful" RADICAL "peaceful-holy" MUSLIM!
Or maybe you want to talk about the 15,000,000 (!!!) Hindu victims (so they claim) by Radical Muslims in recent history?