I'm not sure I fully understand your answer.
Can you put it in this format:
Blessed are those who have not seen:
1) X
2) Y
yet still believed:
1) X
2) Y
How is faith in God attained?
- Thread starter nds1
- Start date
I'm not sure I fully understand your answer.
Can you put it in this format:
Blessed are those who have not seen:
1) X
2) Y
yet still believed:
1) X
2) Y
Did Jesus make his own conscious decision to come down to earth? Did he have to make a personal decision, separate from that of God, The Father, to come down to earth?
I'm guessing Isaac had to make a personal decision similar to Jesus's.
Also, when Jesus returns, he will be "king," if I remember Revelation correctly. So if he is king, then where does God, The Father, come into play? We know that they both are two separate beings. I'm guessing God will be an advisor to Jesus of some sort and the Holy Spirit will go into retirement since their are no more humans to "go into."
Why does Revelation speak of "nations" in the new earth. There will still be separate nations still? What is your view on this?
Q1: If Jesus did not perform any miracles and just gave the message, how much do you think Christianity would have spread?
Q2: Why do you think Jesus performed hundreds of miracles, or any miracles at all for that matter?
Adstar said:
The Hindus believe in the same message Jesus gave. Yet they don't acknowledge Jesus as the "savior of all men." In fact, they don't even acknowledge him as one of the top 25 "avatars" (incarnations) of earth's entire history. Hindus don't get baptized in water in the name of Jesus.
So they have faith in the message, not the man. Is there a problem with that?
Jesus and the Father are one so their will is the same. The Fathers will was for Jesus to come and Jesus will was for Jesus to come and the Holy Spirits will was for Jesus to come.
Each persons decision wether it be Isaac's our our own is our decision.
Jesus will rule the World for 1000 years after that time the final satanic rebellion will occur and the final judgement will take place. Then the New Jerusalem will come down from heaven to earth and The Father and the Word will be in the New Jerusalem and will dwell on the new earth with men. So both the Lamb (Jesus) and the Father will be with us for eternity.
Well the term nation or nations does not always refer to politically defined parcels of land. A nation can also refer to a peoples a race, or people with a common heritage or ancestry. Turkey is a nation state but it is not exclusively populated by turks, there are kurds, and smaller numbers of Greeks and Arminians (well the ones the muslim turks did not exterminate in the early 1900'ds but that’s another story) The Jews where a nation of people who did not have any political nation for many centuries.
So maybe the book of revelation is referring to peoples rather than political units when it refers to nations. Then again maybe God will grant each and every nation of people a homeland on earth after the final judgement? I do not know.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
I do not know. But many followers have come to embrace the Messiah Jesus not having seen any miracles whatsoever. I have no seen any miracles,
To get peoples attention. So that he could give them the Message. The Message is not the miracles you know. Even in Jesus day there where those who saw the miracles but did not believe the Message. The scribes who blasphemed the Holy Spirit by declaring that Jesus performed His miracles by the power of Beelzebub the ruler of the demons sure didn't believe Jesus.
Hindus believe the same Message????
Come on nds1 you have got to be joking.... You have even spent long fruitless hours trying to show the hindus in here that the Message of Christianity is different to hinduisim. But now you declare that they are the same.... No way mate, never.For hundus the perfect state is attained through personal effort over many reincarnations. But for Christianity perfection is never attained through personal effort but by believing Jesus who will make us perfect by the power of God.
So hindus seek to strive to obtain perfection
Christians seek to be made perfect by God
Very different indeed.
I was baptised when i was a baby in a catholic church but i count that as absolutely nothing in relation to my eternal salvation through the Messiah Jesus. Since becoming a Christian i have never been baptised in water.
Yes because the message they believe is wrong. It is wrong to believe in something that is false correct? Reincarnation does not happen, no human can obtain perfection, its all a deceptive lie that attracts people because they proudly want to be self justified in eternity. Jesus justifies us because we believe in His Justification.
And again i believe in the Message of Jesus. I believe Jesus. Jesus is His Message, Jesus is the Word of God.
All Praise The Ancient Of Days
Adstar said:
I think you misunderstood me. I never said the Hindus believed that Jesus was who you believe he is, I said that they believed the same message that Jesus gave.
What's the message that Jesus gave?
According to you, it's:
Salvation through agreement with God and reliance on God. Rather than salvation by achieving the will of God, an imposable task for faulty humans.
And Photizo added: Love God and your neighbor.
The Hindus don't teach to agree with or rely on God? LOL.
The Hindus don't teach to love god and your neighbor? LOL.
As far as achieving the will of God, the Hindus teach that if you truly agree with the will of God and rely on God, and if you truly love God and your neighbor, then you will actually do God's will instead of just desiring to do God's will. Both Hindus and Christians don't believe you have to live a 100% sinless life in order to reach "heaven". You just must reach a certain level of faith and understanding.
As far as beliefs of reality, especially in terms of the authority and power of Jesus, Hindus and Christians are way off. They are extremely different in terms of beliefs of how reality really is.
But as far as the Message of how to live life and what state of mind to be in, they are generally one and the same.
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If you hold your breath long enough you can get a vision of God.
It’s the same thing that happens to religious minds. Their tiny brains are so starved for oxygen that they see what they prefer to see, everywhere and in everything and they believe whomever tells them first what they desperately want to believe is fact.
It’s the same thing that happens to religious minds. Their tiny brains are so starved for oxygen that they see what they prefer to see, everywhere and in everything and they believe whomever tells them first what they desperately want to believe is fact.
It doesn't happen overnight. People don't simply "convert," conversion is a lifelong process with many steps.
In most cases, you have two big steps: the "rational" step, where the person becomes intellectually convinced that the only way to make sense of the world is through a personal God. And then you have what I would call the "mystical" step, where intellectual belief seeps into the rest of the soul and becomes a more profound faith, a true loving relationship with God.
But as I said, this is a very schematic desciption. It differs with everyone, and it is often a very complex, very beautiful journey.
In most cases, you have two big steps: the "rational" step, where the person becomes intellectually convinced that the only way to make sense of the world is through a personal God. And then you have what I would call the "mystical" step, where intellectual belief seeps into the rest of the soul and becomes a more profound faith, a true loving relationship with God.
But as I said, this is a very schematic desciption. It differs with everyone, and it is often a very complex, very beautiful journey.
Don't you mean, "irrational?" Having an intellect and using it does not bring people in line with the non-existent.
Don't you mean that the person withdraws from reality to pursue thoroughly their god fantasy in favor of an intellect?
John 1:45-49
45 Philip found Nathanael and said to him, "We have found Him of whom Moses in the law, and also the prophets, wrote--Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph." 46 And Nathanael said to him, "Can anything good come out of Nazareth?" Philip said to him, "Come and see." 47 Jesus saw Nathanael coming toward Him, and said of him, "Behold, an Israelite indeed, in whom is no deceit!" 48 Nathanael said to Him, "How do You know me?" Jesus answered and said to him, "Before Philip called you, when you were under the fig tree, I saw you." 49 Nathanael answered and said to Him, "Rabbi, You are the Son of God! You are the King of Israel!"
In this case, the miracle convinced this man Nathanael that Jesus was the Son of God, not just some prophet. The miracle led him to believe that Jesus was the Son of God.
John 2:18-22
18 So the Jews answered and said to Him, "What sign do You show to us, since You do these things?" 19 Jesus answered and said to them, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." 20 Then the Jews said, "It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?" 21 But He was speaking of the temple of His body. 22 Therefore, when He had risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this to them; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had said.
NKJV
In this case, Jesus' miracle prophesy proved the validity of his message, or word, to the disciples. It also proved that he was who the old testament said he was, which is the Son of God, the Christ. They needed for Jesus' prophesy to come true so that this miracle could prove to them that Jesus' word was the truth, and that he was who the Scripture (Old Testament) said he was.
45 Philip found Nathanael and said to him, "We have found Him of whom Moses in the law, and also the prophets, wrote--Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph." 46 And Nathanael said to him, "Can anything good come out of Nazareth?" Philip said to him, "Come and see." 47 Jesus saw Nathanael coming toward Him, and said of him, "Behold, an Israelite indeed, in whom is no deceit!" 48 Nathanael said to Him, "How do You know me?" Jesus answered and said to him, "Before Philip called you, when you were under the fig tree, I saw you." 49 Nathanael answered and said to Him, "Rabbi, You are the Son of God! You are the King of Israel!"
In this case, the miracle convinced this man Nathanael that Jesus was the Son of God, not just some prophet. The miracle led him to believe that Jesus was the Son of God.
John 2:18-22
18 So the Jews answered and said to Him, "What sign do You show to us, since You do these things?" 19 Jesus answered and said to them, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." 20 Then the Jews said, "It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?" 21 But He was speaking of the temple of His body. 22 Therefore, when He had risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this to them; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had said.
NKJV
In this case, Jesus' miracle prophesy proved the validity of his message, or word, to the disciples. It also proved that he was who the old testament said he was, which is the Son of God, the Christ. They needed for Jesus' prophesy to come true so that this miracle could prove to them that Jesus' word was the truth, and that he was who the Scripture (Old Testament) said he was.
kerux
Registered Senior Member
If you believe in the authenticity of the words of God in the Bible
You could be a faithful one, if the God of heavens will call you to the fellowship of His Son Jesus Christ. Search for the truth.
You could be a faithful one, if the God of heavens will call you to the fellowship of His Son Jesus Christ. Search for the truth.
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Please don't come here to preach. Participate and discuss. But don't proselytize.
LiveInFaith
Registered Senior Member
Big question.
For once, it is said brainwashed.
What brain is washed ?
Where is faith? in brain? conscience?
There must be some potency in human so faith grows.
Is it mutually exclusive with ratio? or just invertedly comparative? or could be growing linearly?
first you need to become an atheist and find that there really is no God
than you need to understand that God can exist if you want it to exist
Belief in God will make you more powerful because it is image of ideal creature that does good, you will have to belief it exists and others will believe in it too and that alone will make you powerful in soul.
The only question is: do you want God to exist? Or do you feel that you can become a God of your own?
Something does not 'exist' merely because you want it to. I understand what you're trying to say; "it is real to your brain", but that's worthless in the grand scheme of things.
I fail to see how believing in a god will make you 'more powerful'. You still die, get diseases and visit the toilet just like everyone else. You might have slightly more self confidence given that if you get run over by a car you believe you'll live again, but that does not mean you become "more powerful".
go see what Islam jihad people do for Allah, kill themselves, is that not power of will? It is. Of course directed in a wrong way. Believing in a God will make him as real as anything else because all it is in this world is what we see, if the belief is strong enough God can exist in our minds, it will somehow help our souls survive being outside a body.
I mentioned 'confidence' and do not deny that belief provides that confidence. Confidence and "more powerful" and two different things. The fact is, confident or not, you'll still kick the bucket and still need to shit.
Provide evidence for the claim that a 'soul' exists.
confidence makes one powerful.
Soul? I want it to exist and I believe in it, I for example have seen future events twice that happened exactly how I saw it, I also felt the death of my grandmother in my dream when noone told me and I was 5000 miles from her and didnt speak her with her...in fact I wasnt thinking about her, but saw...a dream about a death within family. I also felt the death of my grandfather the year before my grandma died...and than once again noone told me for about 4 months that my grandpa has died. I definitely feel connection between me and my relatives and it is because our souls are the same. Unfortunately I cannot control this ability, it comes to me only when something real important happens.
Not really, no. It makes a person more able to approach a task, (if you're confident the girl likes you you're more likely to ask her out), but you're still just as vulnerable of getting a slap in the face as anyone else, confident or not.
This could just as easily, (also without any actual evidence), be the temporary convergence of multiple alternate realities, (kinda like an eclipse). Or perhaps you were given these visions by an invisible flying banana named Juan Pablo the Third. I think by now the importance of evidence should be understood.