How do you feel about guns?

[TimeTraveler]

But the point is that neighborhoods like that are not widespread all over the UK. Most UK citizens don't live or work in such areas and therefore don't need a gun to protect themselves. And they would probably avoid these areas anyway, I mean do you regulary go through dodgy areas?

What if you are born there? What if your family lives there? What if your girlfriend lives there? Your friend? Are you telling me that you are so snobby that you aovid entire neighborhoods?

And most everyone in the UK is going about their life doing just that with without needing a gun.

You just don't get it. Safety is an illusion, no one cares about you, at least not the vast majority. You can try and blame America for whatever, but the fact is, most people in this world don't care. If Europe is filled with so many caring people, why won't Europe go and stop genocide in Darfur? Why not go make trade deals with Africa, and cure AIDs? It's social darwinism, just like America, only America will admit to it.

Sure, some individual Europeans care, and some individual Americans care, but there is no collective force of caring people anywhere in the world. The world is not run on compassion, or on care, the world is run on fear and weapons. You know it just as well as I do.

 

[TimeTraveler]

Yet you still haven't explained how Iraqis widespread gun ownership hasn't helped them.

When we leave, Iraqi's will likely fight amongs themselves, select their leaders, and then use the guns to secure themselves. It takes decades to rebuild a country after a war, none of this is a surrpise. If there were no guns in Iraq the terrorists would have taken it over a long time ago, the only reason the terrorists can be controlled is because civilians have guns to hunt them down.

 

[Nickelodeon]

When we leave, Iraqi's will likely fight amongs themselves, select their leaders, and then use the guns to secure themselves. It takes decades to rebuild a country after a war, none of this is a surrpise. If there were no guns in Iraq the terrorists would have taken it over a long time ago, the only reason the terrorists can be controlled is because civilians have guns to hunt them down.

I'm talking before the war, before the current lawless mess. Iraqi gun ownership didnt protect them from Saddam.

Also the last time I looked the terrorists in Iraq have not been controlled.

 

[TimeTraveler]

I'm talking before the war, before the current lawless mess. Iraqi gun ownership didnt protect them from Saddam.

Also the last time I looked the terrorists in Iraq have not been controlled.

That's because Iraqi's needed Saddam, maybe they did not think Saddam was so bad, maybe Saddam had all the money. Just having guns is useless if you don't have a reason to use them. Saddam was very smart with how he ran the country. He was a dictator, but everyone feared him to such a level where even if they had all the guns, he psychologically had them destroyed.

Gun's aren't designed to protect you from dictators like Saddam, thats what militaries are for. Guns protect you from criminals and maintain order and stability. Gun's prevent society from becoming lawless.

 

[Nickelodeon]

Why not go make trade deals with Africa, and cure AIDs?

Bizzare! Europe cannot work alone to better a deal with Africa, it takes the g8

And I don't understand your statement about AIDS. You are saying there is no cure for AIDS because no-one cares about it?

Sometimes people do care, like the millions of £ that the UK public donated to the tsunami crisis.

 

[TimeTraveler]

The key difference I suppose in the American mentality, we have absolutely no trust for strangers. We only trust family.

 

[S.A.M.]

Are all Americans this paranoid?

 

[TimeTraveler]

Bizzare! Europe cannot work alone to better a deal with Africa, it takes the g8

And I don't understand your statement about AIDS. You are saying there is no cure for AIDS because no-one cares about it?

Sometimes people do care, like the millions of £ that the UK public donated to the tsunami crisis.

Yeah, but how much did the UK donate to the hurricane Katrina crisis, ? Was it even on TV in Europe?

Also, donating money is not really valueable anyway because it never gets recieved by the victims. Did Europe open their doors to the Katrina refugees, or survivors who might have wanted to move there? Nope. What about aiding in the reconstruction?

Now, I understand this might have been offered, the reconstruction, but it got mixed up in politics and economics to the point where it had nothing to do with the victims anymore.

You have a long way to go to prove Europe is a compassionate society. I know there are compassionate individuals in Europe just like there are compassionate individuals in America, I just don't think compassion as an economic force ever expresses itself and it only proves my point that the economy is run on fear and hate. It's like that everywhere, and this is why weapons sales are the most profitable of all industries.

 

[TimeTraveler]

Are all Americans this paranoid?

Yes, I'd say the ones who aren't rich are usually this paranoid. If you aren't rich in America, you have to be paranoid because no ones on your side. It's every man/woman/child for his or herself, so you cannot trust any outsider, family is essential here because these are usually the only group people trust, family is just your inner circle, it can include your friends, but it does not include people you work with, your co-workers are your competiton in most cases who compete with you for survival.

The role of the police is to protect public property, private property is protected by private citizens, such as private security firms, some of which are better armed and better trained than the police. So once again, your property rights are based on your ability to protect it, and we have police mainly to protect property rights.

Read John Locke, Thomas Hobbes, and JS Mill, you'll get an accurate glimpse of the philosophy behind America. Social Darwinism, survival of the fittest, every man,woman,child, for itself. So it's more like, protect yourself or die type of attitude, and the best way to protect yourself is to have enough money to do so. Money is self defense, a gun is self defense, an education is self defense, so yes most American's feel insecure right now, and this is due to a lot of reasons, but thats the current state.

We are very cynical, but thats what happens when you are in the richest most competitive country in the world.

 

[S.A.M.]

Yes, I'd say the ones who aren't rich are usually this paranoid. If you aren't rich in America, you have to be paranoid because no ones on your side. It's every man/woman/child for his or herself, so you cannot trust any outsider, family is essential here because these are usually the only ones people trust, family is just your inner circle, it can include your friends, but it does not include people you work with, your co-workers are your competiton in most cases who compete with you for survival.

The role of the police is to protect public property, private property is protected by private citizens, such as private security firms, some of which are better armed and better trained than the police. So once again, your property rights are based on your ability to protect it, and we have police mainly to protect property rights.

Read John Locke, Thomas Hobbes, and JS Mill, you'll get an accurate glimpse of the philosophy behind America. Social Darwinism, survival of the fittest, every man,woman,child, for itself. So it's more like, protect yourself or die type of attitude, and the best way to protect yourself is to have enough money to do so. Money is self defense, a gun is self defense, an education is self defense, so yes most American's feel insecure right now, and this is due to a lot of reasons, but thats the current state.

That is terrible.

I'm a woman. I've travelled alone, all by myself in India, in the Middle East, all over the US. I've never felt the need for a gun. I take basic precautions to ensure my safety but I've never felt the necessity to look over my shoulder in every dark alley.

This paranoia is amazing and incredibly ridiculous to me.

 

[Nickelodeon]

Yeah, but how much did the UK donate to the hurricane Katrina crisis, ? Was it even on TV in Europe?

Of course it was on TV in Europe, we are not as oblivious to the World as the US is.

Also, donating money is not really valueable anyway because it never gets recieved by the victims.

This is an issue of how well/efficently it is spent, not the sentiment of giving.

Did Europe open their doors to the Katrina refugees, or survivors who might have wanted to move there? Nope. What about aiding in the reconstruction?

Katrina happened in the worlds richest nation, I think most Euopeans expected America to have enough money and resources to deal with the situation. Apparently thats not the case.

 

[Nickelodeon]

The role of the police is to protect public property, private property is protected by private citizens.

So why doesn't everyone in the US have a gun?

 

[thedevilsreject]

The civilian population in the UK for the most part dont have any guns to take away. America is different because you have a gun culture where gun ownership is normal. Gun ownership in the UK is rare, and I have never known anyone who actualy owns a gun.

the vast majority people i know who have guns like me have air rifles, a few have shotguns but they use them for hunting game not for self defense, people in the UK dont need to have them

 

[Baron Max]

That is terrible. I'm a woman. I've travelled alone, all by myself in India, in the Middle East, all over the US. I've never felt the need for a gun. I take basic precautions to ensure my safety but I've never felt the necessity to look over my shoulder in every dark alley.

This paranoia is amazing and incredibly ridiculous to me.

Sam, don't you think that every single victim probably felt the same way as you feel now? But notice that I said ....every VICTIM?!

Sam, I think to call it paranoia is wrong .....all one has to do is read the newspapers or watch the newscasts. There are crimes all over the city where you live, yet you don't seem to see it ..why not?

But I still think you're not viewing this in the proper perspective. I think if YOU wish to walk around unprepared, that's your choice. But I think that a person that's prepared to protect themselves and their families is just being realistic and cautious, not paranoid.

Just remember, Sam, almost every single VICTIM has said things like, "Oh, god, I knew things like that happened ....but I didn't think it would ever happen to ME!"

Baron Max

 

[Baron Max]

So why doesn't everyone in the US have a gun?

Because most of them have the mistaken idea that the police will protect them! The police can do nothing until the attack is over, is done, and you're lying dead on the ground. Only then can the police do anything. But does that help you? ...lying there dead on the ground? Nope.

Why would anyone not wish to protect themselves? It makes no sense to think otherwise, does it? The method of protection might vary, but shouldn't everyone on Earth have that basic idea of protecting themselves?

Baron Max

 

[Baron Max]

...not for self defense, people in the UK dont need to have them

They don't need them? Is that to say that no citizen of the UK has ever been attacked or raped or killed? If there has ever been such things happen to ordinary citizens, then they, too, need self-protection. How can you see it otherwise? Or is it that you're willing to take that gamble with your own life as the bet? If so, ain't that pretty sad?

Baron Max

 

[Nickelodeon]

Is that to say that no citizen of the UK has ever been attacked or raped or killed?

So I guess those crimes must have stopped in the US.

 

[Baron Max]

So I guess those crimes must have stopped in the US.

That post makes virtually no sense in response to my post, Nick. How do you get from my post to your response .....and it make any fuckin' sense????

Nick, you sure don't make a lot of sense with a lot of your posts and responses. Is that because you're really just talkin' to yourself?

Baron Max

 

[Nickelodeon]

Are people with guns are no longer victims of crime?

 

[S.A.M.]

Sam, don't you think that every single victim probably felt the same way as you feel now? But notice that I said ....every VICTIM?!

Sam, I think to call it paranoia is wrong .....all one has to do is read the newspapers or watch the newscasts. There are crimes all over the city where you live, yet you don't seem to see it ..why not?

But I still think you're not viewing this in the proper perspective. I think if YOU wish to walk around unprepared, that's your choice. But I think that a person that's prepared to protect themselves and their families is just being realistic and cautious, not paranoid.

Just remember, Sam, almost every single VICTIM has said things like, "Oh, god, I knew things like that happened ....but I didn't think it would ever happen to ME!"

Baron Max

Ridiculous. Most people die in road accidents.