Ah so you think that if everyone had guns and were expert in using them, everyone would be better off? What will the criminals do? Simply dissappear?Baron Max said:
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How do you feel about guns?
- Thread starter lixluke
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a.) i dont try and force my opinion on othersBaron Max said:
b.) it was a badly worded statement, i meant i couldnt kill someone in cold blood
Baron Max: how many of those murders are gang-related, ie killings of people who are likely to be armed?
Do me a favour and look up the figures. I can't be bothered since, ultimately, I don't care how many of you morons slaughter each other. I live in a country where guns, and hence gun crime, are rare. See the connection there?
Do me a favour and look up the figures. I can't be bothered since, ultimately, I don't care how many of you morons slaughter each other. I live in a country where guns, and hence gun crime, are rare. See the connection there?
redarmy11 said:
That is complete bullshit. I've never killed anyone, but if I'm afraid enough and armed I'll do anything to protect myself. I think you over-estimate the criminal, as most in the military have never killed anyone, and the killer instinct actually is not common, but it's also not required for self defense. If you think only naturally born killers can kill you are out of your freakin mind.
If you are afraid of something, you'll shoot it, if a wild dog came running at you, you'd shoot it, and the more afraid you are the quicker you'll shoot and the more deadly your aim will be. It has nothing to do with being a criminal or having a killer instinct. If what you are saying is true, the cops would be running from criminals in shootouts instead of chasing them.
Even among crminals, most criminals aren't killers, they have guns, they shoot guns, and they use guns to bully, but most have never actually killed anyone, as despite what you may think, most criminals actually do feel guilty. I'll give you this, the criminals who don't feel guilty are psychopaths or sociopaths, but psychopaths or sociopaths usually choose whichever side has the best weapons and most money. You simply hire them, because it's in their best interest to be free agents.
The point is, you are afraid of the criminal, you don't want to admit it, but you are scared, and in the wrong way, you are scared in the "I better run away, they are stone cold killers!" sorta way, and not in the "I better arm myself and be ready to shoot first." sorta way.
Criminals will always exist because people like you keep encouraging them with this, this, scared behavior. I'm not saying you have to become a stone cold killer, but stop seeing the criminals as a bunch of crazy psychopaths or serial killers, because the majority of criminals arent even like that.
Nickelodeon said:
Most criminals and gang members are not good shots and have as little experience as you do. You act like criminals go around training in the inner cities on how to snipe people and shit.
redarmy11 said:Baron Max: how many of those murders are gang-related, ie killings of people who are likely to be armed?
Do me a favour and look up the figures. I can't be bothered since, ultimately, I don't care how many of you morons slaughter each other. I live in a country where guns, and hence gun crime, are rare. See the connection there?
Gang related? Oh geez. First almost every killing is gang related, some sorta mafia, or group of guys is usually behind almost every rational murder. I'll say it again, guns are not the most popular means of killing, guns are the old school thug way of killing, usually not the way sophisticated gangs or organized crime operates, as the organized criminals will poison you, overdose you on drugs, or strangle you and grind your body up into sausage and sell it.
So if it's organized crime, no body = no crime. If it's a young thug, then it's usually a gun fight and neither you or the young thug has an advantage because despite what you think, most young thugs have never killed anyone and simply are hiding behind their gun, if you pull your gun out and you don't hesitate, they'll be dead. I'm not saying this will work most of the time, but you have a 50/50 chance.
thedevilsreject said:
Actually yes you can. You might not want to but if the situation was right yes you could. If someone threatened you or your family, you'd kill them in cold blood. Fear and love are the two biggest motivators for violence, these emotions can make almost anyone violent if they have enough fear and enough love.
If you mean you cannot ever kill an innocent person, I couldnt do that either, I'd feel guilty killing any person, but sometimes you have to weigh your feelings and decide what you'd rather feel, would you rather feel the feeling of losing loved ones, or would you rather feel the guilt of having killed someone, when you weigh it out, the choice becomes clear.
I guess the public in th UK simply have a different mentality when it comes to owning guns.
Although I've noticed since an earlier post that gun ownership in the US is around 25%, less than I realised.
Although I've noticed since an earlier post that gun ownership in the US is around 25%, less than I realised.
Huh? What are you smoking MB?Baron Max said:
Edit: :m: ?
Nickelodeon said:
Your criminals don't have a different mentality ....they're starting to use guns at an alarming rate, aren't they? So pretty soon you, too, will have to start worrying about your own safety and that of your family. What then, Nick?
Baron Max
No. Gun crime is still extremely rare, mainly confined to organised gangs, mainly drug-related, and has virtually no impact on the ordinary citizen. I've yet to see a real gun, much less see one pointed at me, or witness one used in a crime. I don't see this changing in the near future.Baron Max said:
Are they? UK police don't even routinely carry firearms. Also how come 60-70% of Americans don't own a gun? Dont they agree with you? Or are they risk-takers.Baron Max said:
Have you ever killed anyone? Ever shot someone in self-defence? I assume you haven't. In which case, on what do you base these convictions? The advantage that armed criminals have over the ordinary citizen is: they don't fear the consequences of their actions. By this I'm referring not only to the act of killing someone but also to the fear of the consequences of this, ie a lengthy jail sentence that may follow. It's true that many criminals feel guilty after the fact; what they lack is the foresight to see what their actions may lead to, and a fear of the consequences. Many display a nonchalanant attitude towards the prospect of, say, 15 years in jail (until it becomes a reality, that is). This is enough to give them a significant psychological advantage in any armed face-off - enough time to kill you and be damned.TimeTraveler said:
Cops are trained professionals. Thy can hardly be compared to ordinary citizens.TimeTraveler said:
I don't fear criminals or crime. I've got the common sense to realise that crime is rare, serious crime rarer still and, in the UK, gun crime virtually non-existent. I'm extremely grateful for the fact and give thanks every day that I don't live in a country where every braindead halfwit is running round with a pistol tucked into his socks. I look at the countries where they are, and I laugh and I laugh and I laugh.TimeTraveler said:
redarmy11 said:
Oh, you don't know many criminals, do you?! They're scared as hell of being caught and imprisoned ....why the fuck do you think they only come out at night when it's harder to recognize anyone?
And lest you make the mistake again, ...most criminals have never shot anyone either, so both of you are in the same situation ...one might shoot, or might not. But don't think that criminals are somehow so much differnt to regular ol' people!!!
redarmy11 said:
Geez, you've got that completely ass-backwards! Most criminals know what they're doing is wrong, is illegal ....why do you think they sneak around in the fuckin' dark so much?! But also most criminals, when caught, will express remorse for their actions ....only the most pathological criminals won't, and there are few of those walkin' around.
redarmy11 said:
Bragging to their buddies, that's all. But most of them are scared to death of getting caught ...why do you think they run and hide so quickly?!
redarmy11 said:
You've pulled all of the shit right out of your ass and you expect people to believe it??? Geez, you must think we all crawled off the cabbage wagon just this morning!
You obviously don't know shit about criminals or about killing, yet you type up a bunch of words as if you're a fuckin' expert on criminal minds.
Listen, it's simple ....if you don't want to protect yourself or your family, then don't do it. But don't try to take the high-ground for those of us who are willing to protect those that we love and hold dear. You don't have to carry a gun, but don't try to deny me that right ....as guaranteed in the Constitution of the United States of America!
Baron Max
redarmy11 said:
From the wording of that question, that you don't realize that everyone, even the most hardened killers, had to have killed someone for the first time at one time or another. He didn't know then, that first time, did he? Of course not.
You amaze me with your foolishness!
Baron Max
Baron Max said:
Some years ago, I happened across a local police department exhibit in an Oregon mall. I asked one of the police officers why it was possible to get a permit to carry guns, but not knives. The police, technically, are more afraid of knives than guns; for all the National Rifle Association's bluster about the Second Amendment, they're only interested in firearms, and don't seem to care much about the fact that I can't legally carry my weapon of choice in communities where those who prefer guns can. More directly, knives are already controlled. A baseball bat, which can be used as a bludgeoning weapon (e.g. a club) is not designed to kill people. It would seem rather quite odd to regulate the sale of baseball bats, tire irons, billiard cues, &c. A gun is designed to kill; that is its original purpose. How should we go about regulating, say, large rocks that you can crush someone's skull with? And would that have saved some children in Texas whose mother killed them because God told her to?
So what, then, does that first portion of the Second Amendment mean? You know, the part that contains the phrase, "well-regulated militia"?
What forms of regulation are acceptable?
To my experience, gun owners are the most frightened people of all. Everyone and everything seems to be a threat. The entire rationale for owning a gun is to prevent crime or stave off a tyrannical government. I can't imagine living in such fear. Or maybe I can, to a degree, but no, I can't imagine being a quivering paranoiac with a gun.
What rights are those, again?
And by the way, given that one of the argumentative points frequently invoked by the gun lobby--even former NRA president Charlton Heston used this one--is that the government needs to be held in check by armed force. Well, here's the thing: when are the "patriotic" gun owners going to take back the First Amendment? Oh, right. It's harder to kill someone with words than it is with a gun, so the NRA crowd isn't interested. In the meantime, broadcasters face ridiculous penalties for content deemed obscene. Sure, I think it's a bad idea to show Deep Throat or Debbie Does Dallas instead of Saturday morning cartoons, but it shouldn't be illegal. Where are the patriots? Obviously, the rest of their rights aren't important; just the one that they believe entitles them to unlimited lethal force. Great priorities.
I can't intentionally kill an animal such as for hunting, but if one was charging at me, I wouldn't hesitate, unless it was one of my own animals, heh. Nor would I hesitate against a human. I actually like animals more than I do humans, only because most humans know right from wrong.
Alaska (without license), Vermont (without license), Arizona (without license), Virginia (without license), Utah (with license), Georgia (with license), and I think Montana as well.
Criminals would now be outnumbered. Good luck robbing a bank with a room full of people with guns.
An armed society is a polite society.
Did you know committing a crime with a baseball bat or any blunt object is a felony? Even using one in self-defense can be, worse than a gun. Carry any baton-type object requires a permit to use, and baseball bats are included under that. It's a felony to use a baton-type weapon without a permit whereas carrying a gun without a permit is only a misdemeanor. Go figure.
Looks like you need to learn what a militia is. Look at your laws in regards to militia. In most, if not all, states, there are two classes of militia, an organized and unorganized one. Organized is the national guard or any tie-in branch, and unorganized militia are average joe ones made up of the people that aren't connected with any government branch, hence everyone, even the common folk (over 17 that's eligable to join an organized/unorganized militia), fall under that category of the 2nd ammendment.
- N
P.S. You have a double post, Tiassa.
tiassa said:
I never understood the knife thing, except maybe a that it is too quiet.
Well every ableboddied man between 15 and 50 is part of the militia, however the reading of the rest makes it perfectly clear that ANY arms control laws are beyonf the power of the government. It does not say militia in the second part it says people.
Hi Baron, me again.
I'm not going to waste much time on this as you're clearly just another typical, blinkered, trigger-happy, American idiot who can't see the wood for the trees. So this is just for my amusement. I probably won't bother replying to whatever garbage you type in reponse, I just want to clear up a couple of points.
I'm intimately associated with a number of people who, shall we say, treat the law with contempt. Note that word intimately. Look it up if you're not sure what it means. My knowledge of the criminal mind doesn't come from books, or from my head, or (as you insinuate) from my arse, but from the best source possible: direct, practical experience.
I don't know any killers, you're quite right about that, but do know quite a few drunks, drug users, drug-dealers, thieves, fraudsters, and there are more than a few violent psychopaths that I'm keen to stay clear of. This is because I live in a community where it pays to know which people and places to avoid if you want to stay healthy and injury-free. A distant family member recently had his toes half-severed with a machete and I've no desire to suffer a similar fate, so I do what's necessary in the place where I live: I keep my nose clean and my eyes and ears wide-open. This is a winning strategy which means that crime virtually never impacts on my life, and serious crime much less so.
But anyway. My surroundings have allowed me to observe again and again, at extremely close quarters, the lack of foresight and disregard for consequences that I mentioned - points which you failed miserably to address. Nevertheless, I'll address the nonsensical assumptions you provided in place of a reasoned response.
Just because some criminals operate after dark doesn't mean they're scared, you moron. It means they've come to the rational conclusion that the after-midnight hours give them the best chance of succeeding in whatever nefarious activity they're engaged in. Neither do they run away from the police because they're scared, you idiot. They do it because they don't want to go to jail. That doesn't mean they're scared of going to jail, you cretin. It means that they'd rather stay free and rob your house while you're in bed.
Happy shootin', arsehole.
I'm not going to waste much time on this as you're clearly just another typical, blinkered, trigger-happy, American idiot who can't see the wood for the trees. So this is just for my amusement. I probably won't bother replying to whatever garbage you type in reponse, I just want to clear up a couple of points.
John Wayne said:
Wrong on both counts. Never assume - it makes an ass out of u and me. Well... out of you, anyway.John Wayne said:
I'm intimately associated with a number of people who, shall we say, treat the law with contempt. Note that word intimately. Look it up if you're not sure what it means. My knowledge of the criminal mind doesn't come from books, or from my head, or (as you insinuate) from my arse, but from the best source possible: direct, practical experience.
I don't know any killers, you're quite right about that, but do know quite a few drunks, drug users, drug-dealers, thieves, fraudsters, and there are more than a few violent psychopaths that I'm keen to stay clear of. This is because I live in a community where it pays to know which people and places to avoid if you want to stay healthy and injury-free. A distant family member recently had his toes half-severed with a machete and I've no desire to suffer a similar fate, so I do what's necessary in the place where I live: I keep my nose clean and my eyes and ears wide-open. This is a winning strategy which means that crime virtually never impacts on my life, and serious crime much less so.
But anyway. My surroundings have allowed me to observe again and again, at extremely close quarters, the lack of foresight and disregard for consequences that I mentioned - points which you failed miserably to address. Nevertheless, I'll address the nonsensical assumptions you provided in place of a reasoned response.
Just because some criminals operate after dark doesn't mean they're scared, you moron. It means they've come to the rational conclusion that the after-midnight hours give them the best chance of succeeding in whatever nefarious activity they're engaged in. Neither do they run away from the police because they're scared, you idiot. They do it because they don't want to go to jail. That doesn't mean they're scared of going to jail, you cretin. It means that they'd rather stay free and rob your house while you're in bed.
They're not, but do differ from most people in one important sense: they fear the law and it's penalties less than the average citizen. The psychological advantage this gives is the reason why, in a shootout, you're likely to be the one who ends up dead. When you are, why not come back as a ghost, apologise, and tell me how wrong you were?John Wayne said:
I wouldn't try to deny you it, that would be pointless. You idiotic Americans have made your bed, and now you'll all have to die in it. I'm quite happy to sit back in a virtually gun-free society and watch with increasing amusement as you morons blow each other to kingdom come.John Wayne said:
Happy shootin', arsehole.