Yeah I remember the 2 girls shot in Aston. A lot of gun crime in Birmingham is between rival gangs.
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How do you feel about guns?
- Thread starter lixluke
- Start date
TimeTraveler said:You are crazy! Aren't you the guy who always complains about black crime?
It's all in your fucked up mind.
TimeTraveler said:In the one situation where you had to face a criminal, you are telling us that the best response is to just let them commit crimes against you?
I prefer to lose 5 euro above losing my life. I'm strange like that.
thedevilsreject said:if someone pulled a gun on you, you wouldnt have time to reach for a gun before they popped a cap in your ass. i would much rather lose my mobile and buy it again the next month than be lying dead in the street, your mobile wont mean very much to you then will it
It's situational. The point is, if everyone has a gun, people won't pull them out unless they know they'll have to use it.
It would not stop gun violence, but if they take your life, chances are someone will take theirs just as easily.
All life is valueable, or all life is worthless, depending on who holds the gun and how much money is involved. I don't think it would be rational for someone to kill you over $5, but if it's $500,000 almost anyone would.
spuriousmonkey said:I prefer to lose 5 euro above losing my life. I'm strange like that.
Yes, but, Spurious, the major point that ye're missing is that it ain't YOUR choice!!! The criminal might just as easily kill you AND take your money.
You've placed an erroneous condition into your method of thinking and logical reasoning. That ain't nice of you, is it? Or is it just your way of deluding yourself?
What's interesting, however, is that fact that if you carried a weapon, you could STILL give the criminal your money and never even draw your weapon if you don't want to.
But regardless, what I find so strangely fascinating about this topic is the number of people who are totally and dead-set against anyone defending themselves?! I find that attitude terribly fascinating ...if somewhat strange, odd and weird. If you don't want to defend yourselves, that's just fine. But why are you so set on others following your foolish attitude?
Baron Max
spuriousmonkey said:It's all in your fucked up mind.
I prefer to lose 5 euro above losing my life. I'm strange like that.
What if you lose 5 euro's AND your life? Don't you see that if you have a gun you have a chance of keeping both your life and the 5 euros? I'm not saying you have to kill someone to defend 5 euros, but you should kill anyone who puts your life in danger. If someone comes at you with a knife and you have a gun, shoot it and ask questions later.
Yes you will go to prison, but you'll still be alive. The same rules apply in prison, if someone threatens you, and you are backed in a corner, you might have a situation where it's kill or be killed, and I think you know what to do in this situation.
It's best to just avoid these sorts of situations if you can, but at least if you have a gun or a knife, when or if you end up in these situations you'll have a better chance of winning. Having a gun in your face is not fun, having a knife pulled on you is not fun, but if you are the type of person who does not break when in these situations, if you have a gun you might still pull it out and take your chances, as a lot of people don't feel fear in the same way you might.
Look, no one wants to be killed, but you don't know what you'll do in certain situations. You might have that one moment where you can pull your gun out and shoot the guy, and you'll definately take a chance if you think you can.
I know it's not worth it to die over $5, and I understand that you value your life, as most people do, but you have some people who don't value their life, or your life, and who would willingly die trying to kill you if you pull a gun out on them. People can be damn irrational when under pressure or in fear.
Fear makes some people aggressive, more aggressive than they would usually be, as their first instinct might be to kill whatever they fear.
Baron Max said:Yes, but, Spurious, the major point that ye're missing is that it ain't YOUR choice!!! The criminal might just as easily kill you AND take your money.
You've placed an erroneous condition into your method of thinking and logical reasoning. That ain't nice of you, is it? Or is it just your way of deluding yourself?
What's interesting, however, is that fact that if you carried a weapon, you could STILL give the criminal your money and never even draw your weapon if you don't want to.
But regardless, what I find so strangely fascinating about this topic is the number of people who are totally and dead-set against anyone defending themselves?! I find that attitude terribly fascinating ...if somewhat strange, odd and weird. If you don't want to defend yourselves, that's just fine. But why are you so set on others following your foolish attitude?
Baron Max
I think you are right, it is interesting, it's almost like they want to look out for the criminals. Some of the same people who I'd consider racist and biggoted, or sexist, are saying we should protect the criminal?!
I thnik today, people are just less rational. It's always rational to defend yourself, but because most people don't defend themselves, they get bullied to death literally by the criminals. Criminals get the best weapons and tools, and then go around bullying people who are afraid to fight back, which only encourages the criminal to keep doing it.
If someone can rob you, kill you and take your money, and they get away with it, they might try it again and again, with the result being more murder and robbery victims, until they rob that one person who pulls a gun out and shoots them. Now imagine this
Imagine if only the criminals were allowed to carry guns, imagine if only the criminals controlled all the weapons on earth, we'd all be fucked, we'd have criminals coming at us with uzis and rocket launchers, we'd have criminals wearing bullet proof vests and other equipment, while we'd be throwing rocks and using slingshots?!
Why don't we just give the criminals every weapon they can afford to buy, and then outlaw all the civilian weapons so we can have both the cops and criminals team up on us and either go to jail buying the weapon (become a criminal), or be bullied every day by kids with uzis and whatever other military grade weapons they can carry.
I say, fuck that, it's ridiculous. If anyone should have an uzi, it should be citizens. If anyone should have a rocket launcher, it should be one of us. When you make military weaponry, and you outlaw say the bullet proof vest, the rocket launcher, and everything else, the result is that criminals run around with bullet proof military grade vests, and armor piecing bullets, with rocket launchers, and I'm surprised they don't have tanks yet, but thats only because they are still too expensive and cannot be carried. I dont' want to imagine the possibility of criminals getting biological weapons, but I'm sure they could, if the terrorists can get them and terrorists are criminals, well I'm sure it's possible that it could filter through the criminal world, and that in my opinion is why there should be more guns.
I'm aware that in nature, when the wrong person gets a hold of a gun, karma usually bites them befoe they do too much harm. When the right person has a gun, they never have to use it, and never pull it out, and it's just something they have. When the wrong person has access to sophisticated weapons, the first thing they do is try and use it, and in some cases they resort to running around and shooting a random person just to test out their gun. Sometimes to get into a gang you have to kill a random selected person, so when someone pulls a weapon on you, you never know if they'll pull the trigger or not, and that feeling alone is enough to make the average person nervous enough to shoot them if they had a gun and a bullet proof vest, but because the criminal has the machine gun and vest, all you can do is shit your pants and pray.
Jaster Mereel said:I'm not for guns because I think people have some kind of inherent right to have them, I am for guns because I am an advocate of chaos. I like it when everyone has access to weapons.
Weapons bring peace. Just think of the situation with nuclear weapons, yes the arms race was bad, but we have not had any major wars with any nuclear countries. So now nuclear weaponry is associated with peace, and this is why countries all want to have the nuclear gun.
Now, if you are on the streets and you are the only one without a gun because you arent a criminal, you can expect to get bullied every day, until one day they decide it's time to kill you.
Baron Max said:Yes, but, Spurious, the major point that ye're missing is that it ain't YOUR choice!!! The criminal might just as easily kill you AND take your money.
You've placed an erroneous condition into your method of thinking and logical reasoning. That ain't nice of you, is it? Or is it just your way of deluding yourself?
What's interesting, however, is that fact that if you carried a weapon, you could STILL give the criminal your money and never even draw your weapon if you don't want to.
But regardless, what I find so strangely fascinating about this topic is the number of people who are totally and dead-set against anyone defending themselves?! I find that attitude terribly fascinating ...if somewhat strange, odd and weird. If you don't want to defend yourselves, that's just fine. But why are you so set on others following your foolish attitude?
Baron Max
They just don't take your money. They take anything you have on you. So I would lose 5 euros and a gun.
Hence your logic seems silly.
I was anti gun prior to 911 but then i figured that one day were gonna need our weapons to defend against a possible invasion. Shootins fun too, shotgun's are nice. But i waould never kill an animal, just dont have the heart for it.
I am allways carrying something when i go out, but that's just in case i get mugged.
I am allways carrying something when i go out, but that's just in case i get mugged.
Who is going to invade you?
Did you know that when the Soviet Union existed we would have a warning of several years before they could start invading western Europe. And there is was no ocean between the soviet union and the warschau pact countries.
Did you know that when the Soviet Union existed we would have a warning of several years before they could start invading western Europe. And there is was no ocean between the soviet union and the warschau pact countries.
Just that after 911 i found it harder to justify an unarmed population, i was at least for awhile typical anti-gun liberal.
For example today i walked past a gun shop, looked in the window and there was wall to wall weapons, serious firepower. And the funny thing is if you ever saw the Michael Douglas movie "Falling Down" there is a scene where he goes into a gun shop and the owner of the one i passed gave me the same impression as the guy in the movie, didn't look like him but close to that type LOL.
To me it is just not right if the goverment is the only entity with gun's, but also U.S will allways have legalized guns.
I dont know what it is like in Europe but there are states where people walk around with side arm's right out in the open...too funny.
For example today i walked past a gun shop, looked in the window and there was wall to wall weapons, serious firepower. And the funny thing is if you ever saw the Michael Douglas movie "Falling Down" there is a scene where he goes into a gun shop and the owner of the one i passed gave me the same impression as the guy in the movie, didn't look like him but close to that type LOL.
To me it is just not right if the goverment is the only entity with gun's, but also U.S will allways have legalized guns.
I dont know what it is like in Europe but there are states where people walk around with side arm's right out in the open...too funny.
This is a factor that most gun advocates just don't consider. Most gun-owners have never killed another living creature, much less another human being. Most therefore wouldn't stand a chance in a face-off against a seasoned criminal. Hesitate and you're dead. The irony is that if you hadn't drawn that weapon you would probably have lived.John99 said:But i waould never kill an animal, just dont have the heart for it.
Too bad.
Which begs the question, are guns really that much of a leveller?redarmy11 said:This is a factor that most gun advocates just don't consider. Most gun-owners have never killed another living creature, much less another human being. Most therefore wouldn't stand a chance in a face-off against a seasoned criminal. Hesitate and you're dead. The irony is that if you hadn't drawn that weapon you would probably have lived.
On a side note, how many Americans actually own guns?
redarmy11 said:The irony is that if you hadn't drawn that weapon you would probably have lived.
So what of all of those people who are murdered every single day in the US? Are you saying or implying that the murderer made a mistake and though the victim was going for his gun???? ..LOL!!
Did you know that there's a little over one murder each day in New York City? And what do you think of all the other cities in the nation? Do you really think that each one of those murders was caused by the victim trying to pull out his gun? and wouldn't have been shot otherwise? ...LOL!
Baron Max
John99 said:To me it is just not right if the goverment is the only entity with gun's, but also U.S will allways have legalized guns.
The US citizens will always have guns ONLY if they keep fighting for their rights ....since so fuckin' many people want to take away those rights!
If they take away the right to own a gun, what's next? What other rights will they step on? What other things will they take away?
John99 said:...there are states where people walk around with side arm's right out in the open...too funny.
There are no states that I know of where citizens can walk around with guns strapped to the hips unconcealed. If you know of one, please list it for us to see and check.
Baron Max
Nickelodeon said:Which begs the question, are guns really that much of a leveller?
ONLY in the hands of people who know how to use it. Admittedly, some people think they can use a gun to scare others into not attacking them, but they're usually sadly mistaken!!
If one is not ready and able to defend himself, then he should just lie down and cry and whine and beg the criminal for mercy ....perhaps the tears will make the guy laugh and let you live ...while he takes all of your money and credit cards and valuables. Is that the way you want to live? In fear?
Baron Max
So if I had a gun, the criminal would just give up and go away? Or try and shoot me before I shoot them? I assume they have more experiance with a gun than me - I've only fired a weapon a few times (at stationary objects etc). Maybe I should target practice more often?Baron Max said:If one is not ready and able to defend himself, then he should just lie down and cry and whine and beg the criminal for mercy ....perhaps the tears will make the guy laugh and let you live ...while he takes all of your money and credit cards and valuables. Is that the way you want to live? In fear?
i can shoot a gun well, have killed animals but i know that if it came down to it i wouldnt be able to kill another human
Nickelodeon said:So if I had a gun, the criminal would just give up and go away? Or try and shoot me before I shoot them? I assume they have more experiance with a gun than me - I've only fired a weapon a few times (at stationary objects etc). Maybe I should target practice more often?
Interesting that you've answered all of your own questions in the very same post as you asked them.
Baron Max
thedevilsreject said:i can shoot a gun well, have killed animals but i know that if it came down to it i wouldnt be able to kill another human
Well, then that's fine that you recognize that limitation in yourself. But just because you feel that way, should you try to force others to follow that same ideal and not try to defend themselves?
I would also caution you that, while you THINK you couldn't shoot someone, if the life of your wife or parents or your child were in danger, my guess is that you'd find the courage to protect them. If not, I wonder what that says about you as a human being?
Baron Max