jpappl;
What do you mean by this?
jan.
What do you mean by this?
jan.
How did God come to be?
- Thread starter Norsefire
- Start date
Just because you cannot understand something, it does not mean that that thing is false. A colourblind person does not understand what you mean by green and red, but green and red still exist.
In religious terms, as a creature with a lifespan, you can have limited understanding of eternity. God would have perfect understanding of it.
Scifes,
Never said there wasn't. There is possibility and probability. We can claim a possibility about a lot of things that are very unlikely. There is a huge difference between possibility and probability.
Is it a possibility that an alien race will come down and meet us next week ?
Is it likely ?
Yes it can, it is a human creation. Whether there is a god or not is unknown and therefore is the favorite discussion of theists with atheists, because they know they always have a way out of the corner. The escape clause. WE CAN'T PROVE GOD DOESN'T EXIST.
No, I wish there was a great place to go like heaven when I die, but it's not reality, all of the religions are wrong because they are not right, something I would not expect if they are filled with the words of god(s). Nobody has the answer to what happens after death. Nobody.
Sorry but that is the reality, I know it sucks. As far as anyone knows we are here one time and that's all.
This is where religion comes from and why it came into existence, we are just smart enough to realize our own demise and can't imagine that we just end. So we created a way out for our sanity. Because most people are not strong enough mentally to accept their own end. It doesn't make it right, it just makes it popular.
You can imagine and delude yourself into believing something else, but it's just a belief it is not reality.
The burden is yours for you, that I can agree with.
It sounds in the above, that you are saying god is a possibility, not that you know. Before you claimed you knew. If your claiming it is a possibility, I can accept that. If your still trying to claim you know. Than prove it. Still waiting.
Yep. Like an eternity.
Well the fact that I have come to the conclusion I have does not mean I didn't try hard enough to seek god or to question the possibility. In fact I have come to my conclusion from weighing the possibilities and probabilities, the lack of evidence for and the evidence that contradicts everything that religions claim to present as evidence of god.
That is why I can accept someone who says they believe in god, but not any that have been presented by any religious doctrine. Simply because I can't prove that it is impossible for one to exist doesn't mean I have to accept the probability that one does.
As I said before, the best answer since there is no evidence for a god , is that there is not one. It's not the only answer however, there is a possibility, but there is not yet any evidence for me to support the idea.
How do you mislead yourself ?
Your parents are probably very nice people who mean well, you are probably as well.
But how much did either of you question the teachings of your religion as opposed to just accepting it considering the mountain of information and evidence to the contrary ?
Not sure what this means ?
Never said there wasn't. There is possibility and probability. We can claim a possibility about a lot of things that are very unlikely. There is a huge difference between possibility and probability.
Is it a possibility that an alien race will come down and meet us next week ?
Is it likely ?
Yes it can, it is a human creation. Whether there is a god or not is unknown and therefore is the favorite discussion of theists with atheists, because they know they always have a way out of the corner. The escape clause. WE CAN'T PROVE GOD DOESN'T EXIST.
No, I wish there was a great place to go like heaven when I die, but it's not reality, all of the religions are wrong because they are not right, something I would not expect if they are filled with the words of god(s). Nobody has the answer to what happens after death. Nobody.
Sorry but that is the reality, I know it sucks. As far as anyone knows we are here one time and that's all.
This is where religion comes from and why it came into existence, we are just smart enough to realize our own demise and can't imagine that we just end. So we created a way out for our sanity. Because most people are not strong enough mentally to accept their own end. It doesn't make it right, it just makes it popular.
You can imagine and delude yourself into believing something else, but it's just a belief it is not reality.
The burden is yours for you, that I can agree with.
It sounds in the above, that you are saying god is a possibility, not that you know. Before you claimed you knew. If your claiming it is a possibility, I can accept that. If your still trying to claim you know. Than prove it. Still waiting.
Yep. Like an eternity.
Well the fact that I have come to the conclusion I have does not mean I didn't try hard enough to seek god or to question the possibility. In fact I have come to my conclusion from weighing the possibilities and probabilities, the lack of evidence for and the evidence that contradicts everything that religions claim to present as evidence of god.
That is why I can accept someone who says they believe in god, but not any that have been presented by any religious doctrine. Simply because I can't prove that it is impossible for one to exist doesn't mean I have to accept the probability that one does.
As I said before, the best answer since there is no evidence for a god , is that there is not one. It's not the only answer however, there is a possibility, but there is not yet any evidence for me to support the idea.
How do you mislead yourself ?
Your parents are probably very nice people who mean well, you are probably as well.
But how much did either of you question the teachings of your religion as opposed to just accepting it considering the mountain of information and evidence to the contrary ?
Not sure what this means ?
My focus and my efforts are for my family and friends and others here on earth. Simple as that.
I focus my energies helping raise my family, helping my sisters and father take care of my mom who has dementia, volunteering with my kids to keep them involved in group social activities and keeping in touch with my good friends who all help each other out.
My goal is to provide a good life for my kids and hopefully help them along the way to make it easier for them to get ahead so they don't fall behind.
I want them to have choices in life so they can do what really makes them happy.
None of my efforts goes to encouraging or supporting a belief or worship in some unknown, unproven supernatural entity in the sky.
ok, no let's simulate that possibility..
what evidence would exist if such possibility were to be?
i only came across this escape rout day before yesterday..
do you repeat this to yourself often?
is this your coup out?
they're "wrong because they're not right"?all of them?do you even know all of them? what do you know of ANY of them?
"heaven is not reality"? you know how many books have written in the discription of heavan?
"nobody has the answer to what happens after death"?"nobody"? do you know how many religions claim to know that? did you examine them all? specialized in them all? do you know again how many books were written depicting exactly what will happen after death?
(and before anyone mention the number of novels written, rethink your "straw man")
if there was ever preaching to atheism, this would be it..no proof, no argument, no steps, just "it's this because i want it so"..
i'll say one thing for you, if you ever made your own reality, make it a happy one.
at least theists are living in a happy delusion, what good is friggin reality if it doesn't make your life better?
so didn't we do the right thing?
not only can the same be said to you, but what's the difference between the two?
reality?
reality is that the majority of humans are theists, does that make your belief closer to a delusion or a reality?
nope, you people thrive on the thought that you're in to a secret the rest of the world can't "handle", it's what gives athiesm it's sweetness as the trait exclusive to the "intellectuals" it's the cigarette that makes you a man..you can think? you should be an athiest..you're a scientist? then you should be an atheist too..
it's the sense of belonging to such a "prestigious" minority out of the stupid deluded majority of sheep which makes you stick together the most..
although i'm sure, and you can imagine it now, if the whole world becomes atheists, you would be the first reintroducing theisms to "save" it, and form a group of smart minority which knows what's best for the stupid majority and have to take it upon themselves to form a top secret agenda with details available only to those smart enough to understand them, to save the world..
whatever doesn't get me a warning and makes you happy.
and smarty, i don't need to prove i know, because that's unprovable..i know what i know..what i need to prove is for YOU..one doesn't need to go on a forum to prove he knows something, to himself.
you reached an unacceptable answer, so you haven't tried hard enough.
and no, your acceptable answer shouldn't be my acceptable answer, but at least YOU should think it's perfect, otherwise keep trying.."sucks" sounds like the opposite of perfect.
if you reach a perfect conclusion, and want to risk it spoiled, post it any time here.
pondering what's written in a book and wighting the possibilities isn't like opening it and reading..
the more knowledge you have, the least pondering you need.
the lack of evidence can be solved by research..evidence is obtained,, it doesn't look for you and it's rarely spoon fed to you. you need it from two aspects:
1-for.
2-against.
you are overfed 2..go look a bit for1..
you have to accept the possibility.
a bedwin once said" camel shit is evidence of a camel, a trail is evidence of walking, a sky so great, and a ground so wondrous, isn't that evidence of an all knowing?"
but no, that doesn't qualify as evidence to you people, if it doesn't come out of a math book then it's bullshit..sometimes i feel like talking to calculators and robots, only fed the simplest of commands..putting all the burden on us to simplify them to them.
and so, no mister, god exists, and proof exists..actually proof doesn't exist..it's part of every input sense humans have..you have to shut it off not to see it..you don't even need to look for it.
but if that doesn't suit you, then i'm not ready to feed a baby who spits in my face..evidence exist..human kind have found it..better scientists than you..but again, if you don't like it..look for one which you like..
but for you to delude yourself with an ugly delusion, avoiding the sweet truth, and tell me that truth is an illusion, and put your ugly delusion instead of the sweet truth..then i don't know what to say..
all people other than atheists are stupid..
that is a logical conclusion of your statement..
by leading yourself in a road which you admit is wron afterwards.
thank you.
i can say the same about you.
that's the point of what i said..
i did it a lot.
if you think religion should be avoided in discussion, point it out to the admins of this site..they're the ones in charge.. removing the religion subforum doesn't sound like a very bad idea.
I like fiction too.
Because acknowledging reality will make our life better. Delusion has caused much harm to humanity over the years. I don't believe that religious delusion really makes people happy anyway, it's a huge guilt trip.
Now you are just talking out of your ass. This is the last crappy argument of a desperate person.
fiction you like isn't believed by the majority of humans..O'king of the world who every one cares for what he likes.
that's your delusion..you'd better be at least happy with it..that's what matters the most.
glad i wasn't talking out of my ass the whole time..you know, all the bits you omitted and chose to reply to this which came out of my ass..and i though you liked good arguments.
Scifes,
Well apparently to you the fact that we are here is evidence. It's not. And you keep asking me to provide the evidence of your claim. I can't, I don't have any.
And I am sure you will use it often.
Written in books by people who were even more ignorant than we are today.
You want to accept the ideas of people who were completely in the dark, where death was common at much earlier ages and who were trying to make sense of these deaths and to find purpose for their lives.
They are wrong because if they were the words of god(s) they would not be filled with so much nonsense, and everything we have found since would have corresponded to their words EXACTLY. They haven't and they are full of a bunch of crap written by people who didn't know how anything in nature worked. They made their best guesses for their time and they were wrong, of course.
This is also a comment on all religions and not the idea of a god.
I am content with the lack of my existence, I don't have to like it and I choose not to be delusional about it.
It does make it better because I know I am not lying to myself.
No, it's created a lot of weak minded individuals so afraid of they lack of existence they delude themselves. I don't blame people thousands of years ago when the lack of knowledge left them with little else and it made sense, but I do blame people today.
You talk about never opening books. Jesus.
No I expect us when we grow up to become adults and not revert back to being children because we can't envision our own lack of existence.
There is a time to stop believing in fairy tales and santa clause.
I don't believe all theists are stupid. Not at all.
Like I said before, and I agree, the burden is yours for you. But claim to know and present it here then it is acceptable for me to ask for the evidence. Is it not ?
Still waiting by the way.
Remember I said that you would tell me that I am not trying hard enough or that I just need to open my eyes.
Well. There it is.
Yep. Precisely.
For or against, against or for. How do you know which I have been overfed, or if I have been overfed. Your making a big assumption just because of my position. In fact your making the assumption solely on my position.
I have accepted it. The question I have for you is have you accepted the possibility that there is no god. Hmm ?
Again, there is probability and possibility and accepting the possibility doesn't require me to assume that it is a probabilty. If the possibility is 1 in a trillion. Those are very good odds are they.
No to the first part.
And as I said before, the fact that we are here, alive in this amazing universe is not evidence of a supernatural being as the creator of the universe.
But I knew you would drag that out since it's the same old last ditch effort, God is everything, that should cover it.
Do you believe in dinosaurs ?
Never said that. Theists choose to believe, I don't.
So what are you doing with the mountain of information and evidence that contradicts your religion ? How do you justify it, do you not believe or accept the discoveries that contradict the teachings or do you accept both ?
Never said it should be removed, I was talking about personal friends not this forum. My friends who are theists and I don't discuss it at least not very often.
Well apparently to you the fact that we are here is evidence. It's not. And you keep asking me to provide the evidence of your claim. I can't, I don't have any.
And I am sure you will use it often.
Written in books by people who were even more ignorant than we are today.
You want to accept the ideas of people who were completely in the dark, where death was common at much earlier ages and who were trying to make sense of these deaths and to find purpose for their lives.
They are wrong because if they were the words of god(s) they would not be filled with so much nonsense, and everything we have found since would have corresponded to their words EXACTLY. They haven't and they are full of a bunch of crap written by people who didn't know how anything in nature worked. They made their best guesses for their time and they were wrong, of course.
This is also a comment on all religions and not the idea of a god.
I am content with the lack of my existence, I don't have to like it and I choose not to be delusional about it.
It does make it better because I know I am not lying to myself.
No, it's created a lot of weak minded individuals so afraid of they lack of existence they delude themselves. I don't blame people thousands of years ago when the lack of knowledge left them with little else and it made sense, but I do blame people today.
You talk about never opening books. Jesus.
No I expect us when we grow up to become adults and not revert back to being children because we can't envision our own lack of existence.
There is a time to stop believing in fairy tales and santa clause.
I don't believe all theists are stupid. Not at all.
Like I said before, and I agree, the burden is yours for you. But claim to know and present it here then it is acceptable for me to ask for the evidence. Is it not ?
Still waiting by the way.
Remember I said that you would tell me that I am not trying hard enough or that I just need to open my eyes.
Well. There it is.
Yep. Precisely.
For or against, against or for. How do you know which I have been overfed, or if I have been overfed. Your making a big assumption just because of my position. In fact your making the assumption solely on my position.
I have accepted it. The question I have for you is have you accepted the possibility that there is no god. Hmm ?
Again, there is probability and possibility and accepting the possibility doesn't require me to assume that it is a probabilty. If the possibility is 1 in a trillion. Those are very good odds are they.
No to the first part.
And as I said before, the fact that we are here, alive in this amazing universe is not evidence of a supernatural being as the creator of the universe.
But I knew you would drag that out since it's the same old last ditch effort, God is everything, that should cover it.
Do you believe in dinosaurs ?
Never said that. Theists choose to believe, I don't.
So what are you doing with the mountain of information and evidence that contradicts your religion ? How do you justify it, do you not believe or accept the discoveries that contradict the teachings or do you accept both ?
Never said it should be removed, I was talking about personal friends not this forum. My friends who are theists and I don't discuss it at least not very often.
Yes, it is possible. AFAIK, no Earthian can determine how likely it is.
I wonder why it doesn't work both ways. Do people have great difficulty accepting that they did not exist until very recently?
Why even bother living, then? Aren't you better off dead if you can't handle reality? Living a delusion is a waste of a life.
Reality doesn't make your life better, YOU DO!
*sigh*
Here you are; http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_1861614462/God.html
Now can you answer the freakin question?
jan.
*sigh*
Here you are; http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_1861614462/God.html
Now can you answer the freakin question?
jan.
From the link:
"supreme being: the being believed in monotheistic religions such as Judaism, Islam, and Christianity to be the all-powerful all-knowing creator of the universe, worshiped as the only god"
So Jan, why aren't you Muslim or Jew?
He prefers to be sane.
Here I have to disagree. "God" as the term is used and conceptualized by theists, is categorically impossible, as well as incoherent and inconsistent, and therefore doesn't exist.
We can however determine that it is extremely unlikely that any life form would ever visit due to the issues involved in terms of energy, fragility of life forms, the time it takes to get anywhere and the hazards involved. For example, currently with unobtanium drive technology, it would take 40,000 years to get to the next start system and back. That's 40,000 years of direct exposure to the hazards of space without the protection of a biosphere - being fried to a crackly crunch by radiation - pulverized by micro or even the occational macro meteor - with only the resources on board.
Only artificial inorganic probes have any hope of possibly traversing those distances and times, but it would take an extremely stable and far sighted society to contemplate it since the data wouldn't be available for tens of thousands of years and the actual knowledge gained would be fairly trival for the most part unless one hit the jackpot and found inhabited planets.