God does exist.

Oh Eris

whatsupyall,
1.) You claim God is a myth, well prove your claim, since u cant, then shut your hole.
All I, and many other atheists say is that there is no reason to believe in god becaust there is no real evidence for it. Prove that im wrong.
3.) You claim that atheist people are smarter than christian kind. Well prove it and show Universities (educational purpose) that are founded by Atheist. Show congress, republicans, democrats, presidents, world leaders that are atheist, SHOW ME ONE, SHOW ME, LIVING OR DEAD, SHOW ME ONE, and since u cant prove your claim, then shut your hole.
Well most universities are secular based so cant really be considered religious. And as for the comment about politicas are religous atheist dosent that just prove that atheist are smarter. ;)
One more thing, atheist people, the proof of yoour claim which is called "Super Luck" or "Supeer Chance" is NOT an intelligent thing to say, do better than that ok? I doubt it if u can, but try kids.
Given a near infinite time and near infinite space almost anything allowed by the laws of physics can and will happen.
And your "Freewill is a myth and we all abide by the law without our controll" calling it "simple laws of physics"
Atheism dosent require a lack of free will, where'd you dig up that piece of crap. However any religon with an omniscient god eliminates free will, because if god can see the future with 100% accuracy then nothing can happen to contradict his knowledge of the future. End result: No free will.

The real question is why did i bother responding to that pointless rant.
 
Re: Oh Eris

Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross
whatsupyall,

All I, and many other atheists say is that there is no reason to believe in god becaust there is no real evidence for it. Prove that im wrong.

Ill prove you wrong. There is reason to believe in God because THE MORAL VALUES, VIRTUES, THE RULES AND REGULATIONS, 10 COMMANDMENTS, etc. are religion Based. There are occuring miracles, healing through prayers, etc. even scientific evidence God exist, millions of eyewitnesses, etc. ALIVE AND DEAD, u dont call this real evidence? WELL THEN, THERE IS ALSO NO REAL EVIDENCE OF KING HENRY, SHAKESPEARE, AND QUEEN ELIZABETH, THEY ARE ALSO MYTHS.
FACT= THERE IS NO REASON TO BELIEVE IN ATHEISM, BECAUSE UNLIKE CHRISTIANITY, ATHEISM HAS NO EVIDENCE AT ALL!

Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross

Well most universities are secular based so cant really be considered religious. And as for the comment about politicas are religous atheist dosent that just prove that atheist are smarter. ;)

Thats your opinion, FACT IS IT IS FOUNDED BY CHRISTIANS, WHETHER THEY ARE CHRISTIAN STUDENTS OR NOT, FACT IS FACT. PERIOD! YUR OPINIONS DOESNT CHANGE REALITY OK?

Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross

Given a near infinite time and near infinite space almost anything allowed by the laws of physics can and will happen.

YES ANYTHING CAN BE POSSIBLE, AND HUMANS WILL BECOME 1 TRILLION MILES TALL AND WEIGH 50 TRILLION TONS SOME TIME IN THE FUTURE, KEEP WISHING DELUSIONAL GUY. PROVE YUR CLAIM OR SHUT YOUR HOLE. PERIOD.
Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross

Atheism dosent require a lack of free will, where'd you dig up that piece of crap. However any religon with an omniscient god eliminates free will, because if god can see the future with 100% accuracy then nothing can happen to contradict his knowledge of the future. End result: No free will..

How can God know all things 100%, even the future, for if that was the case, then there is no freewill and He is fully responsible for our actions...

"Freewill" is according to our actions "Knowledge" is according to God, from present to the future. We adhere to freewill because we have no clue of the event that is to come, so we live according to our judgment, this is called freewill. We will be talking doctrines of the faith, be mature and hold yourself back in saying "your hallucinating", ok?

Now before everything else in the doctrine of the faith, there were "spirits". Angels as what they call it, Lucifer being the head of the spirits. When God created Adam and Eve, they were designed to be obedient and serve Him. Now Lucifer's pride grew as God gave him more authority, he was kicked out of "heavens" the name of God's place, as punishment for HIS ACTIONS and his followers went with him. He became a wanderer everywhere not knowing where to go, Lucifer in an attempt to anger God then tried to decieve adam and eve into betraying God. Ever since then Lucifer found this to be effective idea in giving God pain, because He cannot directly defeat God, he found us to be a good tool for revenge, ever since then human suffering came into this world and God shared that with us, the devil started it all (please be mature for a while and stop saying "oh blaim it on the devil delusional guy", LOL).

Now did God knows all things before it happened? Yes He did, it is silly to say that the spirits of the devil can predict the future but God cant (This isnt really "prediciton" but pure knowledge). However His knowledge of it has nothing to do with its responsibility.

YOU ARE RIGHT, GOD IS RESPONSIBLE FOR DESIGNING BEINGS WITH JUDGMENT AND FREEWILL, FROM SPIRITS WE CALL "ANGELS" TO HUMANS. WHAT IS THE RESULT OF THIS GOD'S DESIGN? GOOD WORKS AND AT THE SAME TIME BAD WORKS. BUT GOD DIDNT ACT ON THOSE ACTIONS, WE DID, HE ONLY CREATED FREEWILL AND JUDGMENT AND FROM THERE WE TOOK OVER, EVEN THOUGH EVERY ACTIONS IN THE FUTURE GOD KNOWS. GIFTS CAN BE ABUSED OR USED PROPERLY, HALF AND HALF CHANCE. THERE IS INDEED GOOD THINGS THAT COMES OUT OF OUR FREEWILL AND THE ANGEL'S, BUT THERES ALSO BAD ONES, BUT DID GOD DO ALL THESE? NO! BUT WHO DESIGNED THE FREEWILL AND JUDGMENT WHICH RESULTED IN GOOD AND BAD DEEDS? GOD DID...PERIOD..WHO ARE YOU TO QUESTION HIM OF HIS DECISIONS? DID YOU WANT GOD TO CREATE ROBOTS AND LOVE HIM BECAUSE THEY HAVE NO CHOICE? SO WHAT IF GOD WANTS TO CREATE BEINGS WITH JUDGMENT WHO LOVES HIM UNCONDITIONALLY BY CHOICE AND NOT BY FORCE, WHO ARE YOU TO TELL HIM WHAT TO DO. YOU CAN EITHER REJECT HIM OR LOVE HIM, HE DOESNT WANT YOU TO REJECT HIM FOR THAT IS NOT WHAT YOU ARE DESIGNED FOR, HE WANTS YOU TO LOVE HIM FOR THAT IS THE REASON WHY YOU AND THE ANGELS ARE DESIGNED FOR. YOU HAVE “KNOWLEDGE” MISTAKEN FOR “DOING IT”, JUST BECAUSE I KNOW MAURICE GREENE CAN RUN UP TO 27 MILES PER HOUR, IT DOESN’T MEAN IM RUNNING 27 MILES PER HOUR. PERIOD.

Yes, if I planted a seed (AND LETS JUST SAY I CREATED THE SEED AS WELL), I have full responsibility of its survival and existence. If I didn’t put enough water, it will die. If I planted it near caterpillar dwellers, it will get chewed and die. If I planted it indoors where there is no sunlight, it will also die (some plants). I have knowledge and survival of the plant’s existence, now or in the future, I know how much bigger it gets (by witnessing grown plants like it), I know what kind of fertilizer to use (not just anything) and I know how much amount of water to pour on it, I’m sole responsible for its survival.
There’s a HUGE difference between a plant and humans. PLANTS DON’T GET UP AND SAY “I DON’T WANT YOUR WATER”, PLANTS DON’T GET UP AND SAY “I DON’T NEED YOU”, PLANTS DON’T HAVE JUDGMENTS LIKE WE DO, plants donot commit suicide because his girlfriend dumped him, dogs don’t grab a knife and stabbed themselves because their life sucks. God is like it to humans, he created us and know everything in the future, even though we have freewill and judgment, he still knows what u r going to choose, BUT JUST BECAUSE HE KNOWS, IT Doesn’t MEAN HE DID IT, TO REMIND YUR PATHETIC RETARDED BRAIN, JUST BECAUSE I KNOW CHEETAS CAN RUN UP TO 60 MPH, IT Doesn’t MEAN IM RUNNING OR MAKING IT RUN 60 MPH. Yes I watered the plant and yes I am necessary for its survival, as God is necessary for human survival “He didn’t give the sun to shine just for the believers, but for the unbelievers as well”. However, plant doesn’t have FREEWILL AND JUDGMENT. WE DO, GOD CREATED OUR JUDGMENTS WHICH RESULTED IN BAD AND GOOD DEEDS WHICH HE KNOWS, BUT WHICH WE DID, GET IT? I KNOW MY NEPHEW WHEN REALLY HUNGRY WILL EAT THE CAKES THAT ARE DESIGNED FOR VISITORS, THE VISITORS DIDN’T HAVE THE CHANCE TO EAT IT BECAUSE MY NEPHEW DID, SO DOES IT MEAN I MADE MY NEPHEW EAT IT? NO! MY NEPHEW HAS THE CHOICE OF EATING IT, OR NOT EATING IT. U MIGHT THINK IM EVIL FOR PUTTING THE CAKES THERE TO BEGIN WITH, BUT TOO BAD IT WASN’T FOR HIM, IT WAS FOR THE VISITORS. GOD DESIGNED HELL FOR THE DEVIL, NOT FOR US, IF U WENT TO HELL BECAUSE U WANT TO, THEN TOO BAD THAT’S YOUR DECISION….


OHH I JUST STRUCK YUR EGO DOWN, THATS GOTTA HURT.
 
Ill prove you wrong. There is reason to believe in God because THE MORAL VALUES, VIRTUES, THE RULES AND REGULATIONS, 10 COMMANDMENTS, etc. are religion Based.
Yes, many are based on religon but many of them are also based on common sense to make sure the species survive. The oldest recorded system of law, Hamurabi's code was secular not religions.
There are occuring miracles, healing through prayers, etc. even scientific evidence God exist, millions of eyewitnesses, etc. ALIVE AND DEAD, u dont call this real evidence?
Give me a few credible examples and i might take this arguement seriusly. And ive alwys liked the "healing miricles" becuse i imagine the vast majority of people with some sort of fatal illness pray to god got to be saved but most die. Because few get over their disease in a not fully understood way it must be god must have saved them, and decided to let the millions of others die. If that kind of god is real he is a bastard i want nothing to do with.
YES ANYTHING CAN BE POSSIBLE, AND HUMANS WILL BECOME 1 TRILLION MILES TALL AND WEIGH 50 TRILLION TONS SOME TIME IN THE FUTURE
No becuase its not permitted by the laws of physics. Anything like you descibe culd not possibly survive.
KEEP WISHING DELUSIONAL GUY. PROVE YUR CLAIM OR SHUT YOUR HOLE. PERIOD.
I could say the same to you :D

As for the whole free will thing: Your wrong. If you assume that god knows the future with 100% certainty there is no possble way for free sill to exist simply because for god to know everthing that was going to happen in the future the universe has to be completely deterministic. In a deterministic universe the initial conditions are the only thing that matters. If god created the universe he controlled all the initial conditions. We think we have free will but if a god of that nature exits then its just an illusion.
OHH I JUST STRUCK YUR EGO DOWN, THATS GOTTA HURT.
Actually its people like you that make me thank Eris that im not a christian.
 
Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross
Yes, many are based on religon but many of them are also based on common sense to make sure the species survive. The oldest recorded system of law, Hamurabi's code was secular not religions.

http://www.terrace.qld.edu.au/academic/lote/french/paris8/tsld003.htm

Hamurabi's code? HAHAHAHA, WHAT A SCAM AND A LIE, ATHEISM MADE IT UP, for 2 yrs of education of my faith, and I got a class on philosphy of Religion, I HAVE A TEACHER OF RELIGION OF PHILOSOPHY FOR OVER 30 YRS, I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF THAT, AND I WILL ASK HIM TOMMORROW.. I have checked every possible webpages for it, and it shows me pictures of statues, no rules, or written laws. I have heard of the oldest religion THAT DIED called "Zoroatism" something like that, but it doesnt have the moral values, or 10 commandments. I know hinduism has A SMALL PART, TINY PART OF THE RULES.



Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross

No becuase its not permitted by the laws of physics. Anything like you descibe culd not possibly survive.

SO THEN DESCRIBE TO ME WHAT DOES THE LAW OF PHYSICS APPROVE AND WHAT IS NOT APPROVE. YOU SAY THE LAWS OF PHYSICS CAN CREATE LIFE FORMS, NOW PROVE YOUR CLAIM, IF U CANNOT PROVE YOUR CLAIM, THEN WHAT IS THE POINT OF LAWS OF PHYSICS? OTHERWISE MIGHT AS WELL CLAIM HUMAN RACE CAN BECOME 1 TRILLION MILES TALL, FOR YOU CANNOT PROVE WHAT THE LAWS OF PHYSICS APPROVE AND WHAT NOT. YES U HAVE OBSERVED THE SPEED OF LIGHT, TORQUE, LIGHTNING, EARTHQUAKE, GRAVITY, ETC. BUT PROVE YOUR CLAIM, OTHERWISE SHUT YUR HOLE...

Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross

Give me a few credible examples and i might take this arguement seriusly. And ive alwys liked the "healing miricles" becuse i imagine the vast majority of people with some sort of fatal illness pray to god got to be saved but most die. Because few get over their disease in a not fully understood way it must be god must have saved them, and decided to let the millions of others die. If that kind of god is real he is a bastard i want nothing to do with

As for the whole free will thing: Your wrong. If you assume that god knows the future with 100% certainty there is no possble way for free sill to exist simply because for god to know everthing that was going to happen in the future the universe has to be completely deterministic. In a deterministic universe the initial conditions are the only thing that matters. If god created the universe he controlled all the initial conditions. We think we have free will but if a god of that nature exits then its just an illusion.

Actually its people like you that make me thank Eris that im not a christian.

once again we need some brain check...listen..


KNOWING SOMETHING DOESNT MEAN DOING IT...

KNOWING SOMETHING DOESNT MEAN DOING IT...

KNOWING SOMETHING DOESNT MEAN DOING IT...Now give yurself 5 minutes to absorb that in your brain...

If theres any question u have, then that will be "Why then did God created the devil and hell if he knows some of us will choose to go there".

Thats the only question as a christian we should trouble. BUT ONLY THE IGNORANTS TROUBLE WITH THAT.

There is more to it that just God created that, U GUYS TAKE THINGS OUT OF CONTEXT, YES GOD CREATED HELL, ANGELS, DEVIL, ETC. BUT GOD ALSO CREATED HEAVEN, FORGIVENESS, REPENTANCE, AND SENT JESUS TO DIUE FOR YOUR SINS, THERE IS MUCH MORE OPTONS OF YOU DOING GOOD TRHAN DOING EVIL. IN FACT GOD GAVE YOU SO MUCH, SO MUCH TIME TO THINK ABOUT YOUR SINS AND REPENT, HE SENT PROPHETS, ETC.

IN FACT THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS EVIL, NOTHING IS EVIL. WE MAKE THINGS EVIL. SOFA OR TV IS NOT EVIL, THE LOVE OF SOFA AND TV IS EVIL AND IDOLATRY. WE MAKE THINGS EVIL BY DISOBEYING GOD, IF GOD TOLD U NOT TO CROSS THE STREET ALONE BECAUSE U MIGHT GET RUN OVER, BUT U DID IT ANYWAYS AND DIED, IT DOESNT MAN THE STREET IS EVIL OR THE CAR THAT RUN HIM OVER IS EVIL, IT BECOMES EVIL BECAUSSE WE MADE IT EVIL. EVEN IF GOD CREATED THE CAR, THE STREET, THE SIDEWALK, ETC. BUT WE MAKE DECISIONS FOR OURSELVES. GET IT?

AGAIN, ABOUT THE LAWS OF PHYSICS, IN OTHER WORDS, ABOUT THE LIGHTNING EARTHQUAKE AND TORNADO CREATING LIFE FORMS,I NEED PROOF OF THAT AND MAYBE I WILL TAKE IT SERIOUSLY OK? OTHERWISE SHUT YUR HOLE....
 
Hamurabi's code? HAHAHAHA, WHAT A SCAM AND A LIE, ATHEISM MADE IT UP, for 2 yrs of education of my faith, and I got a class on philosphy of Religion, I HAVE A TEACHER OF RELIGION OF PHILOSOPHY FOR OVER 30 YRS, I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF THAT, AND I WILL ASK HIM TOMMORROW
So whats more likely: All archeologists are wrong, or you just havent heard of it?
I have checked every possible webpages for it, and it shows me pictures of statues, no rules, or written laws.
It must be carved on the statues because here's a translation of it: http://www3.sympatico.ca/aal/private/ham-text.html

Seems you missed at leat one webpage ;)
I have heard of the oldest religion THAT DIED called "Zoroatism" something like that, but it doesnt have the moral values, or 10 commandments. I know hinduism has A SMALL PART, TINY PART OF THE RULES.
Why are you so big on the 10 commandments? It only has 3 laws with any practical value: dont kill, dont steal, dont lie and these are pretty much universal. If the 10 commandmets was the only source of them those laws would only have been in a very small part of the world. 99% of the planet got along fine without christian law for thousands of years deal with it.
SO THEN DESCRIBE TO ME WHAT DOES THE LAW OF PHYSICS APPROVE AND WHAT IS NOT APPROVE. YOU SAY THE LAWS OF PHYSICS CAN CREATE LIFE FORMS, NOW PROVE YOUR CLAIM, IF U CANNOT PROVE YOUR CLAIM, THEN WHAT IS THE POINT OF LAWS OF PHYSICS? OTHERWISE MIGHT AS WELL CLAIM HUMAN RACE CAN BECOME 1 TRILLION MILES TALL, FOR YOU CANNOT PROVE WHAT THE LAWS OF PHYSICS APPROVE AND WHAT NOT. YES U HAVE OBSERVED THE SPEED OF LIGHT, TORQUE, LIGHTNING, EARTHQUAKE, GRAVITY, ETC. BUT PROVE YOUR CLAIM, OTHERWISE SHUT YUR HOLE...
The laws of physcis are far from complete. Im not sure how exactly life could have come from a non living source but physcis does not for bit it. I can still disprove your absurd claim if you want me too. ;)
KNOWING SOMETHING DOESNT MEAN DOING IT...Now give yurself 5 minutes to absorb that in your brain...
True, but knowing that if i take a certain course of action will lead to a definite set of results is doing it. That is exactly what your god did at the beinning of the universe if you're right.

Give yourself a little time think about that. Don't hurt yourself. :rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross
So whats more likely: All archeologists are wrong, or you just havent heard of it?

WOW, thats interesting. Hey now, this NON PRACTICED RELIGION, IF IT WERE A RELIGION, IS IMPRESSIVE, MAYBE THIS ARE THE ANCESTORS OF THE JUDEU CHRISTIAN, after all this religion is dead.

Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross

Why are you so big on the 10 commandments? It only has 3 laws with any practical value: dont kill, dont steal, dont lie and these are pretty much universal. If the 10 commandmets was the only source of them those laws would only have been in a very small part of the world. 99% of the planet got along fine without christian law for thousands of years deal with it.

WELL FOR MILLIONS OF YEARS WE WERE ALL ANIMALS UNTIL FEW THOUSANDS YEARS AGO WE EVOLVE INTO A INTELLIGENT BEING WITH FREEWILL AND JUDGMENT, (GOD "FORMED" MAN OUT OF THE EARTH) NOW SOME OF US ARE KILLING THE OZONE LAYER AND WITH NUCLEAR WEAPONS AND ALL, THE EARTH MIGHT NOT LAST 1 THOUSAND MORE YEARS SCIENTIFICALLY SPEAKING.
Originally posted by Neutrino_Albatross

The laws of physcis are far from complete. Im not sure how exactly life could have come from a non living source but physcis does not for bit it. I can still disprove your absurd claim if you want me too. ;)

GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR LAWS OF PHYSICS THINGY, MAYBE ONE DAY U CAN PROVE YOUR CLAIM, LOL, GOOD LUCK. AND YOUR RIGHT, GOD CREATED JUDGMENT AND FREEWILL, SO YOU ARE FREE TO LOVE HIM AND GO TO HEAVEN, AND FREE TO REJECT HIM AND ACCEPT THE DEVIL THEN GO TO HELL.
BY THE WAY GOD DIDNT CREATE THE DEVIL, THE DEVIL CREATED HIMSELF, GOD ONLY CREATED THE JUDGMENT AND FREEWILL.

AND YES YOU ARE RIGHT, I WILL BE GLAD TO HEAR YOU "PROVE ME WRONG" I AM WAITING....:)
 
WOW, thats interesting. Hey now, this NON PRACTICED RELIGION, IF IT WERE A RELIGION, IS IMPRESSIVE, MAYBE THIS ARE THE ANCESTORS OF THE JUDEU CHRISTIAN, after all this religion is dead.
Um... so what dead religion are you taking about exactly? I dont think i mentioned one.
WELL FOR MILLIONS OF YEARS WE WERE ALL ANIMALS UNTIL FEW THOUSANDS YEARS AGO WE EVOLVE INTO A INTELLIGENT BEING WITH FREEWILL AND JUDGMENT, (GOD "FORMED" MAN OUT OF THE EARTH) NOW SOME OF US ARE KILLING THE OZONE LAYER AND WITH NUCLEAR WEAPONS AND ALL, THE EARTH MIGHT NOT LAST 1 THOUSAND MORE YEARS SCIENTIFICALLY SPEAKING.
WOW, another pointless and irrelevent statement.
GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR LAWS OF PHYSICS THINGY, MAYBE ONE DAY U CAN PROVE YOUR CLAIM, LOL, GOOD LUCK.
Only in my first semester, give me a few years :)
AND YOUR RIGHT, GOD CREATED JUDGMENT AND FREEWILL, SO YOU ARE FREE TO LOVE HIM AND GO TO HEAVEN, AND FREE TO REJECT HIM AND ACCEPT THE DEVIL THEN GO TO HELL.
*sigh* Ive already explained twice. If an omnicient god exists than the entire future must be unchangeable otherwise his knowledge of it would be wrong which supposedly cant happen. If god controlled all the initial conditions he set the only path the future can take.
BY THE WAY GOD DIDNT CREATE THE DEVIL, THE DEVIL CREATED HIMSELF, GOD ONLY CREATED THE JUDGMENT AND FREEWILL
Thats odd, i always heard that god created the devil as an angel but he rebeled and went to hell. How can anything create itself?
AND YES YOU ARE RIGHT, I WILL BE GLAD TO HEAR YOU "PROVE ME WRONG" I AM WAITING....
Easy, a trillion mile long living thing couldnt exist becase the maximum speen anything can travel is the speed of light (3*10^8m/s) it would take thousands years for anything to travel across the body. But i suppose that dosent really matter because anything weighing trillions of tons would collapse into a black hole anyway. Hows that?

*edit*
Hang on, I was just reading one of your earlier posts and i think you said that god is not omniscient. If that is the case there is no problem with free will, and you are the only christian ive ever met who thinks that.
 
I have checked every possible webpages for it, and it shows me pictures of statues, no rules, or written laws.

Well, here's another web site:
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/hamcode.html

and another:
http://www.csd.k12.wi.us/HAMMURAB.HTM

in fact, I turned up 10 pages of google search results. Might want to look harder next time.


GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR LAWS OF PHYSICS THINGY, MAYBE ONE DAY U CAN PROVE YOUR CLAIM, LOL, GOOD LUCK.

Same to you ;)


http://www.terrace.qld.edu.au/acade...is8/tsld003.htm
Umm, what did that link prove?
 
Does God Exist?

Who said the Code of Hammurabi was secular?:confused:
From what I have read there is a whole lot of religious motivation behind it. Or was that a typical lie?

Just because God created doesn't mean he can't change his mind about a LOT of stuff. He will not go back on His promises, but He definitely won't be coming back to earth until the earth is ready for him he might decide to come tomorrow and change his mind to next week. Why not? Only he knows the time when he is coming back.

Because God created and knows what's next doesn't mean he does it. God created the devil. Now but he didn't make him want to become equal with him. In the Bible, which assumes God's existence, man has free will, that is t he only way he would have done what God didn't want him to do.Why can't God create an 'autonomous' universe if I may?

He creates it to operate within a set of principles which we are beginning to discover through physics and other sciences.
Ever hear of Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle? - if not look it up. A corollary of this is that physical life is possible. If the degree of quantum uncertainty was any greater or smaller physical life would be impossible. The speed of light has not been constant over the evolutionary period of the universe. So anything is possible in physics. In the string theory and quantum mechanics you can turn a sphere inside out without separating any parts of it if you were able to perceve 4 or 5 dimensions [percieve meaning seeing the beginning and end of it - we can't see the beginning or end of time - we see time as it is - as opposed to say an element of three dimensional space]. - The point - in physics anything is possible. So what if an organism collapses into a black hole? Who says there isn't life within a black hole? In physics anything is possible.

Anyways I need to reload and take the safety off. I'm out.

Lata
 
Who said the Code of Hammurabi was secular?
None of the laws are religious based so i think that makes it secular. Technicly though i just found out that Hamurabi said that it was given to him by one of their gods, but that was probaly just to get the people to pay attention to it.
 
this proves God is ALL KNOWING

All right, let me give it a shot Albatross.

(Since everyone else uses all caps, I will too)
IF GOD IS ALL KNOWING AND ALL POWERFUL, THERE CAN NOT BE FREE WILL. HERE IS WHY:

GOD KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE GOING TO DO. IF HE DOESN'T, THEN HE IS NOT ALL KNOWING. SO SINCE HE KNOWS EVERYTHING, HE KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT ACTIONS YOU WILL TAKE IN THE FUTURE. THAT MEANS EVERY ACTION YOU TAKE ISN'T YOUR CHOICE, BECUASE HE KNOWS WHAT YOU WILL DO BEFORE YOU DO - THUS, YOUR ACTIONS ARE PREDETERMINED - THEREFOR, NO FREEWILL BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T CHOSE THE ACTION, HE DID.

DID I MISS ANYTHING ALBATROSS?
 
ALSO, DO YOU THINK GOD CREATD EVERYTHING? IF NOT, HE ISN'T ALL POWERFUL, AND IF SO, EVIL IS PART OF EVERYTHING.
 
To shred thine proclamation or not to shred thine proclamation!

First God created everything to be good, in Genesis, it is written "And God saw that it was good"

Nope. Let's say god created earth, to be good. As I recall, in all our observations of forming worlds, they've had quite tortured surfaces, of volcanoes and choking gasses. They, like ancient earth, are barren and lifeless and dead. We can learn from alternate observations.

Evrything was good, and then God formed man out of the earth (whether it took millions of years, it doesnt matter).

God formed man, eh? So you're one of those backward anti-darwinists, aren't you? I mean, come on. Look at what you're saying. Just look at it. You're nuts. Bonkers. A quote unquote dumbass.

Everything was created first, trees, plants, animals, and lastly Adam and Eve.

So no bacteria? No prokaryotes? Where did that fit into god's infinite wisdom?

GOD IS NOT A LIAR AND THE BIBLE IS NOT SELF CONTRADICTORY, IT ON LY IS BECAUSE U TAKE THINGS OUT OF CONTEXT

Take things out of context? Couldn't god have prevented the serpent from getting at Adam, then Eve? Maybe he was jealous of humans, wanted them to suffer instead of live happily in heaven, so he created the serpent and tricked eve into screwing up. The rest, to you, is history. To me it is badly written fantasy that has been taken too seriously.

Look at it. Look at it again. If you hadn't been raised on this religion, and you weren't told that the bible, was, well the bible, and you read it, would you believe it? Have faith in "god's" existence? If you say yes, then you LIE!!

In summary, this proves God is ALL KNOWING, AND GOD IS ALL GOOD. U just need a brain and a good judgment to understand truths (wisdom).

Well, if this is true, I guess there are exceptions to possessing good brains and wisdom, for those that believe the archaic rituals of the old age. Like yourself, for example:cool:
 
P.S

You support Bush, you live in the south, and you have a southern accent, don't you?
 
whatsup,

I dont htink you really understand the concept of determinism do you? For god to know the future it must be predecided, a deterministic universe. In a deterministc universe the only thing that matters is the initial configuration. God was in control of all initial conditions. The initial conditions that god set-up is the only thing that influences the world.

If you accept the existance of an omnicesnt god you have to accept a complete lack of free will and a clockwork universe controlled by god.
GOD IS NOT A LIAR AND THE BIBLE IS NOT SELF CONTRADICTORY, IT ON LY IS BECAUSE U TAKE THINGS OUT OF CONTEXT.
If you belive that take a look at this site: http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com
Face it the bible was written by humans.
Again God is all good, he did not create EVIL
Thats not what he says.
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
-God in Isaiah 45:7 (KJV)
There is also what they call "PLACEBO", when peoples cancer are healed, christians and non christians alike (although majority of those who testified having healed r mostly christians) WHICH BY THE WAY IS A SCIENTIFIC FACT IT OCCURS, BUT SCIENTIFICALLY CANNOT BE EXPLAINED, IT REMAINS A MYSTERY.
Ya i think i mentioned this earlier but ive always found this arguement hilarious when you compare the thousands who pray for their cancer to be cured compared ti the handfull that actually are cured. Why would god intervene for a small number of people and let the rest die horribly? How does he decide who is worthy to survive? The god you describe is an ass.
Its more likely just a natural happening that we havent figured out yet.

And just on a side note, A stupid idea in all caps dosent get more intelligent just bigger.

Hail Eris!
 
I edited this, because i was in ahurry earlier, let me explain God being all good and all knowing once again.

God is all good.

First God created everything to be good, in Genesis, it is written "And God saw that it was good". Evrything was good, and then God formed man out of the earth (whether it took millions of years, it doesnt matter). Everything was created first, trees, plants, animals, and lastly Adam and Eve.
Now Adam and Eve are formed with freewill and high intelligence with judgment, not formed as robots who lives by instinct intelligence. God gave them "freewill", what is the result of this freewill? Good and evil deeds, not just evil, but good as well.
And if you say "If God is all good, then why dont he stop the guy from raping a young girl instead of allowing it"{.
Now if God is all good, then it means he is honest and true to His words. He gave u freewill, now if God stops u from doing good or doing evil, then he is taking that freewill back and breaking his promise. GOD IS NOT A LIAR AND THE BIBLE IS NOT SELF CONTRADICTORY, IT ON LY IS BECAUSE U TAKE THINGS OUT OF CONTEXT. He gave you freewill, and to stop you from doing what you want to do means you are not free, God might have as well created you as robots or plants if thats what you want.
People always make a parable saying "Well if u hand over a gun to a kid, you are solely responisble for the kid commiting murder" and use that analogy about God, atheist always take things out of context. The truth is yes that father may have a gun in his house, but he also have safetylocks, he also provide forgiveness, repentance, other options such as a starving neighbor or a crippled man u can spend time with to help out.. So it is your choice whether to look for the safety lock and get a gun and kill someone or u can help yur starving neighors.
Again God is all good, he did not create EVIL, HE CREATED FREEWILL AND JUDGMENT, now that Judgment was used BY US to do evil, just as any gifts can b abused and used improperly. The parable of father and son is true, the father does have responsibility for the brainless child, but we are not a child but are adults and should know what right froom wrong, WE ARE NOT A RETARD, and a father who gives a gun to a child but not a bread is evil, thats not Jesus. The bible says "As your fathers were so will u be", we have freewill. It is true that we pay consequences for our parents fault because we are free. Take pornographic for example, someone started playboy,, then from there hustler then video porns, etc. Or weapons, etc. BUT DID GOD DO THESE? NO! DID GOD CREATE WOMAN TO BE USED AND ABUSED? NO, WHO DID? WE DID...People are so immature that they dont want to take responibility for their actions but instead blaim others, society, or even God.
GOD DIDNT CREATE EVIL ALONE (ill explain later), EVEN IN GENESIS GOD SAYS "AND IT WAS GOOD". We created evil, our judgment is evil, our independence is evil. Take sofa for example, sofa is not evil, but the love and obsession of sofa is evil, it is a sin called "idolatry" you are idlozing a material thing. "Where there is no law there is no sin" this explains why people who never heard of the gospel are spared (because their ignorance made them duMB), and kids who doesnt have enough intelligence for good judgment. Again God didnt create the devil in itself (ill exlain later), he created angels to serve him with freewill, now lucifer the name of an angel betrayed God, because of that he is "evil" but God didnt made him that way, Lucifer's judgment made himself "evil". So in a way, God is responsible for evil, but God didnt create evil, Get it? Just as you had sex with prostitution because u want to, but society allowed u to do that (unless there is a law which says u shouldnt) in allowing so, the society became responisble, so in a way u can say society made me have sex with prostitutes because it allowed you to do so, though its your act but society is responsible as well.

God is so good, THAT HE GAVE SOLUTIONS TO EVERY PROBLEMS WE GIVE OURSELVES. God gave repentance, God sent Jesus in atonement for your sins. God gave the church. God gave the prophets, God is good, GOD DID NOT HAVE TO DO THIS, BUT HE DID BECAUSE HE LOVES YOU. BUT THEN AGAIN IT IS FOR YOU TO ACCEPT OR REJECT, YOU HAVE TO ACCEPT IT FIRST, YOUR FREE, GOD CANNOT TAKE THAT AWAY FROM YOU.
Now you might say "What then is the point of praying for healing if God cannot take our freewill away?".
Thats why when people are healed from their sickness, if blind ppeople can see, it is not God healing them directly without their permision, IT IS THEIR FAITH THAT HEALED THEM. When there was a woman who was bleeding for many years, she said to herself "If only I can touch his cloak, then i would be healed", she pushed her way in the crowd by hundreds, and finally touched Jesus, jesus then said "Who touched me?" apostles said "Lord why do u ask, there are many ppl here touching u" Jesus then said "I feel my power left me" and the woman cried out "It was me my Lord!!" Jesus then said "WOMAN, YOUR FAITH HAS HEALED YOU".
God is everywhere, energy is everywhere, just as air is everywhere, u just have to have lungs to breathe & take air within you, just as you just have to have faith to take God within you.
Jesus said "If you have faith as small as a mustard seed, yoou can tell the mountain to move there and there and it will go".
When a roman pagan (like non christian today) approached Jesus, he said "Lord I am not worthy to have u under my roof, for i have soldiers under my commmand, etc." in short he was asking Jesus to heal his sick daughter (or servant cant rremember) and Jesus then said to the apostles "TRULY I HAVE NOT SEEN A MAN WHO HAVE GREATER FAITH THAN HE IN JERUSALEM", then he said to the roman pagan "GO ON HOME, YOUR FAITH HAS HEALED YOUR DAUGHTER".
So this tells us u dont have to be a christian to have faith but u can be pagan as well.
There are even scientific evidence on faith. There are investigations of paranormal where individual if they use the power of their mind, they can bend metals, spoons, and forks. There are even people who can eat nails, razor sharp metals, glassesand not get hurt. There are people in thailand who can walk on fire for 2 minutes, unlike pathetic skeptics trying to prove them wrong by demo, they can only walk on fire in about 20 seconds.
There is also what they call "PLACEBO", when peoples cancer are healed, christians and non christians alike (although majority of those who testified having healed r mostly christians) WHICH BY THE WAY IS A SCIENTIFIC FACT IT OCCURS, BUT SCIENTIFICALLY CANNOT BE EXPLAINED, IT REMAINS A MYSTERY.

Again to remind your aligator brain, God didnt create you to be good, He didnt create you to be evil as well, BUT HE CREATED YOU TO BE FREE. WHETHER YOU BECOME GOOD, OR YOU BECOME BAD, THATS ON YOU..THOUGH GOD DOES WANT YOU TO BE GOOD. IF YOU BECOME GOOD, GOD KNOWS THAT ALREADY, IF YOU BECOME BAD, GOD KNOWS THAT AS WELL, BUT THAT IS ALL ON YOU! NOT ON GOD! AGAIN GOD CREATED FREEWILL, AND FROM FREEWILL COMES FORTH EVIL AND GOOD, NOT JUST EVIL ALONE, BUT GOOD AS WELL. SO DONT SAY "GOD CREATED EVIL" GET THIS STRAIGHT AND DONT TAKE THINGS OUT OF CONTEXT, THE PROPER WAY TO SAY IT IS "GOD CREATED GOOD AND EVIL" AND YOU CHOOSE YUR DESTINY...

GOD IS ALL KNOWING. THE BIBLE SAYS "I KNOW YOU BEFORE YOU CAME TO BE". We are written in the book of life, God already knows before you were born whether you go to heaven or not.. Your days are counted and your life is already known. Just as if I plant a seed, I know in the future it will bear fruit, but if planted on soil with no moisture, it will not bear fruit, not that Im a psychic but its pure knowledge.
God is all knowing, it is silly to claim psychics can predict the future (spirits of the dead) but God cant.

Wheres my proof that God is all knowing?

In the old testament Jesus was even prophesied. But since u dont believe the bible as historical, then lets leave that out. Jesus prophesied the 12 apostles to multiply and that ALL THE CORNERS OF THE EARTH WILL HEAR OF HIS NAME. Now look today, there is not one country I know that have no christian that lives in it, even Korea or china have christians!! How then did the bible know of these? Super luck? or chance?

In the bok of Genesis, it is written in the law of Moses ""That whoever touches a dead corpse or anything unclean must wash their hands before meals" later on this became a tradition. If we followed by this rules, 100 of yrs later, the great plagues of europe will not have occured, Moses discovered germs before Pasteur did. How then did the bible know of these? Super luck? or chance? :)

In the book of Genesis, God also spoke to Abraham "Abraham, look at the stars, see if you can count them".
Now Greeks attempted to name stars, in fact when I was younger, I tried counting stars at night, I estimated that there are about maybe over 1,000 stars out there. But now science PROVED THAT STARS ARE INCALCULABLE THROUGH GIANT TELESCOPES! FOR SPACE HAVE NO LIMITS!! How then did the bible know of these? Super luck? or chance?
In the book of Genesis, it was written "In the beggining, there was waters above the waters, and reflections above reflections, etc." Now science once again proved this to be a fact through the giant telescope considering there are chunks after chunks of water in space! They have no telescopes then, How then did the bible know of these? Super luck? or chance? :)



In summary, bottom line is God is ALL KNOWING AND ALL GOOD. U just need a brain and a good judgment to understand truths (wisdom).
SO WHAT CAN WE DO SINCE GOD CANNOT STOP YOU AND I FROOM D0ING EVIL? WHAT CAN WE DO TO HELP EACH OTHER OUT?
HAVE FAITH....
 
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note: about the bible being contradictory POST IT HERE AND ILL PROVE YOU ALL WRONG SO EVERYONE CAN SEE. THE BIBLE IS NOT CONTRADICTORY, YOU THINK SO? THEN POST EACH ONE OF THEM HERE AND PROVE U WRONG, AND ILL EMBARRASS YOUR PATHETIC BRAIN...
 
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First of all i dont want to read the same post twice so im not going to. If you have any new points in it post the seperatly.
note: about the bible being contradictory POST IT HERE AND ILL PROVE YOU ALL WRONG SO EVERYONE CAN SEE. THE BIBLE IS NOT CONTRADICTORY, YOU THINK SO? THEN POST EACH ONE OF THEM HERE AND PROVE U WRONG, AND ILL EMBARRASS YOUR PATHETIC BRAIN...
Cant post all of them, way to many. But ill post a few, if you want more just look through the website i gave you:
"Thou shalt not kill."
or
Ex.32:27
"Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side ... and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbor."
Num.15:35
"And the Lord said unto Moses, The man [who was found picking up sticks on the sabbath] shall be surely put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones."
1 Sam.15:2-3
"Thus saith the Lord of hosts ... go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare him not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass."

link to is god merciful contradictions way too long to post here: http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/contra/merciful.html

1 Cor.13:7
"Believeth all things
or
Pr.14:15
"The simple believeth every word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going."
1 Th.5:21
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good."

The site has over 900 contradiction on it and im not going to post them all, so go look for yourself.
 
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