End of Ice Age

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Mines a tale that cant be told,
My freedom I hold dear;
How years ago in days of old
When magic filled the air,
Twas in the darkest depths of mordor
I met a girl so fair,
But gollum, and the evil one crept up
And slipped away with her.

I hear the horses thunder
Down in the valley blow,
Im waiting for the angels of avalon,
Waiting for the eastern glow.
The apples of the valley hold,
The seas of happiness,
The ground is rich from tender care,
Repay, do not forget......

Interesting tales fiction or not.
Sometimes a story doesn't have to be an actual event to teach a lesson.

Gilgamesh in the land of the living so out of place....
Sweating,and tired among those who have never been.
That has a ring of something more than fiction to me.

The days of old were more than the "stone age" historians would have us believe.
If in fact they have hidden evidence of this.,
The question you should be asking yourself is.... "why?"
 
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In those cities referenced by IAC that are submerged off the Indian coast, they are in relatively shallow waters, not hundreds of feet below the surface. Their demise can be attributed to gradual subsidence of the land (via plate tectonics, or sudden earthquake tectonics, etc.), coupled with a possible slight rise ( a few feet) in sea level circa several millenia ago.

It is also possible, indeed probable, that the melting of the Ice Age glaciers was not a steady process, but occurred in cycles of melt, followed by periods of stabilization. We certainly see the evaporation of that great inland lake that existed during the Ice Ages when the Western North America was much wetter and rainier, Lake Bonneville (now the Great Salt Lake and the Bonneville Salt Flats as its remnant) having occurred in various stages, leaving numerous well-researched and named 'benches' along the mountain ranges surrounding that basin, as the lake got progessively lower and lower as the region became drier and drier as the Ice Ages were ending.

It is believed that the great bulk of the melt began circa 18,000 years ago, and ended 12,000 years ago, raising the oceans some 350 feet above their former levels, but leaving them about 50 feet lower than currently, with a 2,000 year period of relative sea-level stability in between. This is believed to have been followed by an additional melt raising the sea level an aditional 50 feet circa 10,000 years ago (and breaching the Dardanelle's barrier and flooding the Black Sea depression at that time, and likely giving rise to the Noah story and similar stories from that region).

It is possible that that last 50 feet rise in sea level was also in cycles, with perhaps the last 10 feet or so circa 3,000 to 4,000 years ago, though I do not have good data on that currently. We do know that the current sea level has been relatively stable for the last 3,000 years, though it might be a few feet higher today than it was 3,000 years ago. I personally have not seen more than an inch in change in half a century at shorelines I regularly visit, which agrees with most records I've read.

The fact that the numbers 5, 6, 10, 12, 60, 360, etc. show up in our mathematical systems are indicative of how useful they were. It is also known that people were spreading knowledge from culture to culture many millenia ago, and taking the best from each culture. Hence, we now use 360 degrees, with 60 minutes to a degree, and 60 seconds to a minute, just as was used anciently in Mesopotamia and Egypt (and likely elsewhere). Of course, most people have switched to the decimal system for the minutes and seconds. Whether that system originated 10,000 years ago, or 5,000 years ago, is not recorded in writings of which I am aware. Perhaps if we discover undersea 'megaliths' from 10,000 years ago, we might get a better handle on the mathematics of those earlier human times.

It is believed that the melt down is still ongoing, even though we are currently in a relatively stable era. We know that in times past, the sea level has been roughly 400 feet higher than currently, as we can see the benches (marine terraces) as much as 400 feet higher along the slopes of the shorelines of the continents where the beaches once existed millions of years ago. I personally have examined many such examples from low-flying private aircraft, and they are quite obvious natural features comparable to the benches of the Great Salt Lake basin. Should "global warming" be ongoing, then perhaps in a few millenia the ocean levels will be at their historical past levels. Time will tell.
 
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Evidence of cross-specie fertility between orcs and humans:

uruk-hai.GIF


Does this suggest a common ancestor?
 
IceAgeCivilizations, I am still interested in learning where you stand regarding the fact that dendrochronology shows no sudden climate shift between 3000 and 4000 years ago, that pollen in lake sediments shows the prevalence of deciduous trees in North America from 10,000 years ago, and that humans inhabited the far north of the British Isles 5000 years ago.

Also, continent-wide flood deposits were mentioned on your website. A reference would be great.

I beg you not to respond with such a facile answer as 'Google it for yourself' it this time.
 
Tree rings reflect wet periods, not years.

And your other stuff there is predicated upon c14 dates, which are notoriously off, particularly back when there was much more volcanism.
 
Wet periods ARE the seasons, which reflect years. Same with Ice cores which show seasonal melting.
 
The Vedas describe the sea level rise, to cover their old cities, at the time of Kings Ravenna and Nediyon, when they were navigating the oceans and building megalithic buildings, circa 1500 B.C., Walter thinks that all was happening at 10000 B.C., poor Walter.

Hey Walter, from where do you think the ancient Babylonians and Egyptians got there base six numbering system which you cite, do you think it came from counting the five fingers on their hands?
 
Trees still show distinct rings, even in dry years. It's just that the growth in dry years is less.
 
Rings are annual features. Early wood consists of large cells, late wood of small cells. The thickness of any given ring depends on the climatic conditions during that year - not just moisture, but temperature too. But even if moisture was the only factor reflected, do you not suppose that such a sudden swing in the climate might show up in this way?
 
And your other stuff there is predicated upon c14 dates
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That's true.

which are notoriously off
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But I disagree with this.

particularly back when there was much more volcanism.
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And I was not aware at all of this. What volcanism are you referring to, in particular? How was the volcanism dated? Has it affected C14-derived dates globally?
 
Roman said:
Evidence of cross-specie fertility between orcs and humans:
Does this suggest a common ancestor?
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Most of the giant "human" for lack of a better word, skeletons that have been discovered all over North America in the last hundred years and disappeared when delivered to the Smithonian....had double rows of dentition.

IceAgeCivilizations said:
Hey Walter, from where do you think the ancient Babylonians and Egyptians got their base six numbering system which you cite, do you think it came from counting the five fingers on their hands?
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The true giants may have had six fingers.
The bible records some that way.

However, your nay-sayers do have a ridicules pat answer for this.
They explain a method of counting using the nuckles on five fingered hands.

My money's on the six fingers though...Ice.
 
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IceAgeCivilizations said:
Sure, volcanism produced CO2 which diluted the C14 in the atmosphere.
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It sounds plausible (I don't know enough about such things to speak definitively), but I wonder how long the imbalance would persist and whether it would be significant. More importantly, I'd like to know what volcanism specifically you're referring to.

More talk tomorrow.
 
IAC:

I have no idea where the base 12 system came from, but it shows up in many places. We count to twelve, Germans count to Zwoelf, and then we switch to the teens (thirteen, dreizehn). 12 signs of the Zodiac. One dozen (Duzend?) Clearly, our roots did not stop at counting to ten, but stopped at counting to twelve, then switching to another system (teens, then after twenty, regularized to base ten).

The Visitor's suggestion does not sound plausible. However, six fingered people are not an unheard of phenomenon, and perhaps a large, six-fingered man ruled a tribe of people and had his say with them.

So, what is your simple suggestion for the origin of a base-twelve system (and half of that, i.e. 6), coupled with a based ten system (e.g. 6 X 10 = 60 X 6 = 360).

That fact that it makes arithmetic easy is one plausible explanation.
 
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IceAgeCivilizations said:
When, before 10000 B.C.? Think again.
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Maybe...just maybe, could anyone here fathom the idea that the world's been flooded completely under and destroyed "more than once".

And maybe then also, Plato's version of multiple times....and the Bible using the phrase "I won't do it again" ...."anymore"..."with water, next time it'll be fire".....may be trying to tell you something nobody here seems to want to hear.

So maybe, this explains the various times accounted for the destruction of Atlantis, and Noah's flood.

Just throwing that out there folks.....for the thousandth time.
Have at it.
 
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