Developing Telepathy

[Ophiolite]

would you mind if i ask what type of medium she was?

She didn't ascribe herself to any particular school. She was as nutty as a fruit cake, but her cold reading was absolutely phenomenal. I think she believed she was genuinely gifted with paranormal powers.

 

[ellion]

i did'nt mean a school there are different types of medium? you say you studied her for four years but you do not know what type of medium she was. i do not doubt your integrity i am just curious what type of medium and then how you studied that type of medium.

 

[Ophiolite]

Ellion
1. It is common English usage to ascribe different types of painting, of architecture, of psychology, and of mediumship to 'schools'. Not in the sense of a physical institution, but in the sense that their is a common set of beliefs or approach.
2. How are you classifying mediums? Define your types and I'll say which one(s) she fitted into.
3. This was all forty years ago. You will appreciate my recollections are not detailed. I would visit her with a small group of friends (their composition would vary). In conversation over the course of several hours, she would make predictions, hold conversations with spirits, recount her prior experiences with the supernatural, and deliver advice to and analysis of members of the group. I would make a note of her predictions (which probably had a negative correlation) and assess the accuracy of her interpretation of my friend's situations. My conclusion at the end of it all was that she had a great line of patter and was excellent at cold reading, but had no telepathic, clairvoyant or telekinetic skills whatsoever.

 

[ellion]

i do understand your usage of the term school and i would still say that type of medium does not fit this usage, i would imagine that anybody who has studied mediumship would be familiar with some of types of mediumship. more so if one medium has been studied so thoroughly as you profess then it would have been as plain as her gender what type of medium she was.

the types i am familiar with. clairaudience, clairvouyance, clairsentience and trance these are most common types. these are mental mediums, there is also physical mediumship involving furhter methods i am not famliar with at all.

 

[Happeh]

Human history has plenty of stories regarding gods, fairies, ghosts, elves, dragons ect. These must also be true then.

Perhaps you are selectively choosing what you decide is evidence?

Perhaps you are not intelligently thinking about what you are saying.

You mention those various beings as if they are unreal and I would be stupid to believe in them.

In my opinion, you don't think to good. Instead of poo pooing the idea of dragons, elves, ghosts, gods and fairies, why not use that huge intelligence to get to the bottom of what those things really are.

What do you mean they are like in the books and movies? Books and Movies are just imagination right? So what you think are ghosts, dragons, elves, gods and fairies are only one persons imagination transferred to the screen or page.

Now if you were really smart, like me, you would have thought about this subject for awhile. You would reach the conclusion, if you were smart like me, that dragons, fairies, elves, gods and ghosts are all words that describe human beings. Each word describes a human being with certain traits.

All those pictures and paintings and movies are wrong. There is no flying dragon. A dragon is a human being who displays specific physical characteristics. There are no elves that fly around on wings. Elf is a word that describes human beings with a specific physical traits.

Being intelligent is highly rewarding. You should try it sometime.

 

[Happeh]

You ask for reasonable discussion, yet you argue like a child.

Please discuss the problem with being a child and having a reasonable discussion? You act as if the two cannot occur simultaneously.

You call mythology and stories of humanity 'evidence?'

Sure. Mythology is based on something. All that needs to be done is figure out what the something was.

Grow up.

Did that.

Get an education.

Did that.

Then come back and have that reasoned discussion. Until now, you've failed to engage in any sort of discussion related to the topic.

But this is the trend with mystery-mongers and significance-junkies.

You are just frustrated becaue I continue to believe. Your attempts to kill my beliefs failed. Now you are pouting.

 

[Happeh]

All of human history has stories about werewolves, vampires, witches, wizards, ghosts, boogie men, prophecy, miracles, and telepathy.

My post to Shaman handles this.

In an age where science and communication is mainstream, real physical evidence (not just story books) should be available to back up the existence of the above in the past and in the present. No such evidence is available. There is not one individual or group of individuals whom can today step up and say I have evidence that telepathy exists.

Sure there are. For the reasons I posted, they don't do it.

Plus, in something I am sure will astonish you know-it-alls, people don't talk about the obvious.

Do you tell people the sky is blue every day, all day? Do you go into detail about how the color blue looks? No. Of course not. Everyone is intimately familiar with the sky. There is no reason to talk about it.

That is one reason why the groups of people you so desperately need don't say anything. What is the point in discussing something as obvious as telepathy? Everyone will get bored and leave.

 

[Happeh]

Point 2: What I have consistently decried is your gullible, self-delusional, automatic acceptance of the reality of telepathy with nary a whiff of evidence.

You are a fool. That statement is a lie. You are saying that I cannot know about telepathy because you have seen no evidence. You are assuming I base what I say on no evidence. You are stupid.

Let me repeat that. You are stupid.

Can I say that again? You are stupid. You have no idea what I have or have not seen or experienced in my life. I tell you to your face that telepathy is real, then you tell me I have no evidence to support that. I have no evidence TO GIVE TO YOU is what you really mean.

Point 3: My current strong scepticism about the reality of telepathy is based upon the following -
a) A casual, but comprehensive study over a period of ten years of the popular works on telepathy.
b) An in depth review of J.B.Rhine's seminal parapschology work at Duke University.
c) Duplication of several of Rhine's experiments.
d) Informal study over a four year period of a medium, her predictions and techniques.

I am going over the top here. You are stupid. You are reading books to learn about telepathy? I thought telepathy was part of being a human being? Do books have telepathy to?

Me, being the fool I am apparently, I went looking for people, human beings, things that are alive, to talk to about telepathy. Maybe that is why I succeeded and you failed?

In short, Happy Daze, my scepticism is based upon a careful study of the literature, extensive experimental work, and observation of a self-proclaimed telepath. I doubt the same can be said of your unquestioning belief. Note that I began the study referred to above as a believer. The absence of evidence persuaded me that position was flawed.

Woah. Now I really do feel sorry for you. If you are so mentally confused you think reading a book is going to solve the riddle of whether living breathing things have telepathy, I don't think there is any hope for you.

 

[Ophiolite]

i do understand your usage of the term school and i would still say that type of medium does not fit this usage,

It is clear from your later post that it does not fit it in terms of how you are defining type.

i would imagine that anybody who has studied mediumship would be familiar with some of types of mediumship.

Of course I am. What I was not clear on was what particular classification system you were intent on employing. Please come straight out and call me a liar, why don't you. It appears to be where you are heading.

the types i am familiar with. clairaudience, clairvouyance, clairsentience and trance these are most common types. these are mental mediums, there is also physical mediumship involving further methods i am not famliar with at all.

I think I have made it clear from my previous post that she practiced clairvoyance and clairaudience. I don't recall her doing any psychometry, but it was a long time ago.
Please note that these are not types of medium, but activities practised by them. {Your original question is still best understood in terms of what 'school' a mdium belongs to. It may not have been what you meant, but it is what you were asking.}
She claimed to be able to materialise spirits, but refused (surprise, surprise) to demonstrate this.

 

[ellion]

your a liar

 

[Ophiolite]

You have no idea what I have or have not seen or experienced in my life. I tell you to your face that telepathy is real, then you tell me I have no evidence to support that.

No, I have told you, as have others here, that you have provided no evidence. Absolutely none. I have experience, first hand, more evidence for telepathy than you have deigned to present to us. Put up or shut up.

I am going over the top here.

With any luck you'll be cut down by any enemy machine gun.

You are stupid. You are reading books to learn about telepathy? I thought telepathy was part of being a human being? Do books have telepathy to?

Let me know when you complete your remedial comprehension classes, won't you. Read what I said you puerile dumb ass. Yes, I read books. But I also spent evenings over the course of four ****ing years with a medium who claimed to have telepathy. I spent hours trying to duplicate the experiments of J.B.Rhine. You don't even know who Rhine is, and yet you claim to know about telepathy. [Run off and google now.]
You can't read, you can't listen, and yet you laughingly expect to tap into other forms of communication, when you are incompetent in the standard ones.
Oh, Happy Day. When ignorance walked and stalked sciforums.

 

[Happeh]

Discoveries of this magnitude are not stopped by something as trivial as a language or cultural barrier. Scientific revolutions do not stop at national borders, but rather they spread across cultures, languages and different types of governments.

I agree with you. That is why I believe it is a "conspiracy" kind of thing. If you look around the world, you will find it is the technological countries that say there is no such thing as mental powers. All other world countries believe in superstition and mental powers.

You can take the side that the west is more educated and knows better. Or you can take the side that the leaders in the west are lying to their people. People are born with power. If you don't have it, you are hosed. If you are a politician and your son is born with no power, your son is not going to be anybody. Someone from the "rabble", the public, who was born with power will be more qualified to take the job destined for your son.

Unless you lie to everyone and convince people there is no such thing as power. Then, even when they experience the signs of power, they won't know what it is. They won't know how to make it grow or put it to use. Your lies have successfully saved that plum political job for your powerless son.

You could and if you truly have tested your findings rigidly, it would stand up to peer review. Would you give me the title or the ISBN of your book? I understand that this would give away your identity (if you didn't publish under a pseudonym), but I assume you wouldn't have mentioned the existence of your book if you are not ready to give its title.

The book is not about telepathy. I just used it as an example of something that could not be accomplished without testing.

We are drifting off topic here, but perhaps it is better to speak of communicating, rather than talking. The act of exchanging information from one to another. Humans seem to differ with most other animals in the sheer complexity and amount of information which is exchanged.

For your benefit, what you see as drifiting off topic, I see as including all relevant material.

I completely agree that people can and will distort the truth, I just do not find evidence that this common place in scientific circles.

The Isrealis commissioned a genetic study to prove they are different from Arabs for their propaganda purposes. The study revealed that Jews and Palestinians were 99% DNA identical or some high percentage.

Because the scientific study did not give the answer the propaganda people wanted, the study was either withdrawn from publication, or never made it to publication. I have never heard a word since about how Palestinians and Jews are identical peoples.

Telepathy is only one ability that can be used to manipulate and read people. Well trained psychologists can be pretty good too in that regard, why are they not hunted down but rather paid for their expertise?

It is not the same. Manipulating a person and reading their secrets without permission are entirely different things.

First of all, it is not my experience that telepathy is accepted as a truth in other cultures. Secondly, if it were, does it not contradict your point that telepaths feverlishly hide their abilities to avoid being prosecuted?

This is getting to be too much for me. I feel like I am hand holding. People do not give away secrets to others unless they trust them. If you are a tourist with a pocketful of money, no one will talk to you. They want your money. If you are a foreign invader taking over the country, no one will talk to you. If you kidnap foreign peoples and use them as slaves in your country, why the heck would slaves tell kidnappers about reality?

I do not think you can say a whole country believes X or Y. Individuals, or groups of individuals, in a country may hold beliefs, but I think you'd find it hard to proof that a whole country supports telepathy. For the sake of argument though, let's assume that you are right and twenty whole countries believe in telepathy. Which countries would that be?

If you are going to talk like this, I will have to leave. You need to forget about details. If you are a scientist, I know that goes against everything you believe. This is not math or chemistry or physics. The numbers do not matter. It makes no difference if it is 20 countries or 15. It makes no difference if the entire population believes, or only 85% of the population believes.

It is that kind of thinking, that IMO, that is part of destroying the human race. There are things that only work on belief. If you can convince people never to believe, you have destroyed part of who and what they are.

Or maybe they misinterpret their experiences, who knows.

I usually say lying or incompetence.

Telepathy may exist, but certainly, considering the complete lack of evidence, the alternative seem far more likely. People indeed do lie, and are prone to accept flawed theories. Legends are by definition not the most accurate accounts of historical events, to put it mildly. So, for me to accept your beliefs, you have to give me reasons which are not merely consisting of legends and/or anecdotal accounts.

Sorry. You will be cynical forever. Telepathy is a subjective thing by nature. You cannot pull a piece of telepathy out of someone's head and say "here, here it is right here in front of your face.

You have to find someone who trusts you and will prove it to you. I can tell you that if you are mean or angry or hateful or deceitful or anything else bad, you are never going to find anyone. Remember. They can read you. Would you help a person who was cynical or was testing you so that he could point and laugh at you?

 

[Ophiolite]

your a liar

Please define the nature of my lie. Where am I lying. Which statements I have posted are untrue.

 

[Happeh]

Happeh, could you please suggest to us the area of the brain that may be involved in telepathy?

Why does it matter? Why do you care?

I will happily provide you with pictures and diagrams of the brain if you like, so that you can suggest the area involved.
If it isn't a specific region, and rather certain types of neurons, could you suggest them instead please?

If you can do that, perhaps you can suggest the part of the feet/legs that are involved in flying.

You think you are funny. You are........sad. You are cutting yourself off from what you could be so you can get the small reward of laughing at me. The tradeoff is your loss.

 

[ellion]

ophiolite: of course your going to deny you are lying thats what liars do.

 

[Crunchy Cat]

My post to Shaman handles this.

The Shaman post responds to something similar and by far does not handle anything.

Sure there are. For the reasons I posted, they don't do it.

Fear of violence and govt. control? Assuming this were true... there is always a segment of any fearful population whom is fearless and they are strangely nowhere to be found. Unless telepaths are the exception and are universally cowards...

Plus, in something I am sure will astonish you know-it-alls, people don't talk about the obvious.

Do you tell people the sky is blue every day, all day? Do you go into detail about how the color blue looks? No. Of course not. Everyone is intimately familiar with the sky. There is no reason to talk about it.

That is one reason why the groups of people you so desperately need don't say anything. What is the point in discussing something as obvious as telepathy? Everyone will get bored and leave.

People talk about what's interesting (obvious or not). Lucid dreams and hypnogogic hallucination would be great examples. They are VERY obvious and they are very interesting; hence, people like to talk about them. If telepathy wasn't interesting then the 1000+ posts on this forum surrounding it wouldn't exist.

I made an offer a while back to provide evidence for telepathy, provided several names of people whom I interacted with (some in person) in a very positive manner to test for 'PSI' ability. Even Quantum Quack provided a link to a seperate thread demonstrating the point. All this information has been conveniently ignored to date.

Skinwalker made a few keen predictions that have repeatedly come true regarding your responses and the bottom line is that there is plenty of evidence to support you are delusional and practice cognitive dissonance to support the delusion.

 

[shaman_]

Perhaps you are not intelligently thinking about what you are saying.

In my opinion, you don't think to good.

Instead of poo pooing the idea of dragons, elves, ghosts, gods and fairies, why not use that huge intelligence to get to the bottom of what those things really are.

What do you mean they are like in the books and movies? Books and Movies are just imagination right? So what you think are ghosts, dragons, elves, gods and fairies are only one persons imagination transferred to the screen or page.

Now if you were really smart, like me, you would have thought about this subject for awhile. You would reach the conclusion, if you were smart like me, that dragons, fairies, elves, gods and ghosts are all words that describe human beings. Each word describes a human being with certain traits.

All those pictures and paintings and movies are wrong. There is no flying dragon. A dragon is a human being who displays specific physical characteristics. There are no elves that fly around on wings. Elf is a word that describes human beings with a specific physical traits.

Being intelligent is highly rewarding. You should try it sometime.

Actually I have thought about the origins of those things before. For example I believe that the myth of dragons probably came from ancient people finding dinosaur bones. However this is not the least bit relevant to the subject so please do not waste my time with it.

Either you missed the point regarding evidence or you ignored it.

You are saying that because there are stories of mind reading that is all the evidence you need right?

Now if you were really smart, like me,

I just quoted this because it is funny.

 

[shaman_]

me)))))are you claiming it birthed itself? that it is some amorphous abstract entity not in relation to the human mindset which developed it...what hwhat?

Don't be ridiculous. It is a process that has been refined over the years by many people.

me)))if we didn't you lot jest keeps on--like a broken record: 'wheres zee vidence? wheres ze evidence...???'

Yes because there is no evidence therefore you are trying to blame science or get science to lower its standards. Not going to happen.

The fact that you believe in so much without evidence should show you something.

me))))))i sound deluded to you cause you dont understand. period. i am trying to explain to you a mechanicalized mindset which is the legacy of materialistic science. Not only for its devotees, but for tose indoctrinated in its ways--from school onwards

I know what you are trying to do but you are not the least bit convincing when you don't really know what you are talking about.

me)))i know enoug to know that 'SCIENCE@ doesn't HAVE to mean your interpretation of it. te condescension form te so-called science advocates here is due to your narrow VIEWof science, not any misunderstanding on my part

No. The condescension you feel is because you do not have a basic understanding of science yet you are telling people on a science board what is wrong with it.

me)))errr becase mscience cant MEASURE them...? so it disregards them, asit does with MEANING. scientific positivism DEPENDS on sci method for its understanding of life. it becomes its measuring stick. anything that dontmeasureup is not real no mo....TILL it IS measured. get me drift. that is the limbo i sees you in. a place i find quite chilly and lifeless and souless

Ah because science cannot currently measure a particular emotion you see it as a cold and horrible institution. It is not a religion or a way of life duendy, it is a process for explaining the universe around us. It has been a very successful one at that. I have explained this to you many times. You are just trying to see science as evil which ever way you can.

me)))))))'used' ...huh, you mean abused, raped, shit on. duuude, you haven't got a clue what the west has done to people it felt were under them. yer very very very very naive, and you insult the countless Indigenous peoples who have been crushed, by your ignore-ance of the reasons.and have you not heard of 'knowledge ispower'..????

I am well aware of the treatment indigenous people have received duendy.

What on earth does this horrible treatment have to to do with science? Please tell me.

You really do sound confused sometimes...

me)))no thanks!.......whose idea isit for this controlled fukin setting. alright for certain examinatins it is propabably alright. but it is when it is applied to stuff you already admit you cannot measure it gets absurd, .....it is two completely different languages. hence impasse

When did I say telepathy could not be measured. If someone could actually demonstrate it then perhaps we could measure it.

How should we see if someone has telepathy then duendy? Ask them and if they say 'yes' we change all the science books. ?

talkin wid yu is like talking with someone without any savvy about the state of things. tireing

Because I am not gullible?

 

[duendy]

Perhaps you are not intelligently thinking about what you are saying.

You mention those various beings as if they are unreal and I would be stupid to believe in them.

In my opinion, you don't think to good. Instead of poo pooing the idea of dragons, elves, ghosts, gods and fairies, why not use that huge intelligence to get to the bottom of what those things really are.

mmWhat do you mean they are like in the books and movies? Books and Movies are just imagination right? So what you think are ghosts, dragons, elves, gods and fairies are only one persons imagination transferred to the screen or page.

Now if you were really smart, like me, you would have thought about this subject for awhile. You would reach the conclusion, if you were smart like me, that dragons, fairies, elves, gods and ghosts are all words that describe human beings. Each word describes a human being with certain traits.

All those pictures and paintings and movies are wrong. There is no flying dragon. A dragon is a human being who displays specific physical characteristics. There are no elves that fly around on wings. Elf is a word that describes human beings with a specific physical traits.

Being intelligent is highly rewarding. You should try it sometime.

yor partly right. yes, mythical characters, gods, are metaphors for humans, ahnimals and plants etc...BUT, don't stop thee.
i have actually experienced seeing elves, andhave seen and interacted with entities incuding faerylike entities...i also know Indigenous peoples have also

people from all walks of pife have reported experience of seeing and/or feeling presence of 'ghosts'....

the @DRAGON' in myth is very important to understand, mainly cause he patriarchy uses this term to demonize the spisirtual/magical aspects of deeper Nature. hence we have stories of the mALE UPSTART solar-heros battling, subdueing nd killing 'Dragon's'....'Dragon/Serpent' represnts Earth, and universal energies of the GODDESS, and our ecstatic awarenes and relationship with tis profound energy which THREATENS AUTHORity of the patriarchy wit its 'God'......andlater materialistic science/which is right NOW lads and lassies

 

[SkinWalker]

Please discuss the problem with being a child and having a reasonable discussion? You act as if the two cannot occur simultaneously.

There's no problem at all unless the child is attempting to use the classic child-like arguing strategy of exchanging 'zingers' at his opponent.

Sure. Mythology is based on something. All that needs to be done is figure out what the something was.

So it must be paranormal feats of telepathy, eh? It couldn't just be the inability of prehistoric/preliterate people to understand causes of things like floods, drought, death, etc. and the need to pass on their cultural norms to through oral traditions? The myth of a minotaur doesn't imply that a beast must have existed which was half-man, half-bull.

You are just frustrated becaue I continue to believe. Your attempts to kill my beliefs failed. Now you are pouting.

By all means, believe what you will. Particularly if it works for you. But those that make wild claims of the paranormal should expect to be challenged. There simply is no demonstrable way to 'develop telepathy.' That is the point I've made over and over and if you can falsify that statement I challenge you to do so. But simply saying, "yes, you can," is consistent with that "childish" style of argument that I pointed out already.

Of course there is ESP and telepathy. Of course it can be developed. There is lots of literature about how to do it.

Demonstrate it. Show us. Cite the literature. Put up or shut up.