An approach to spirituality without God

That's absurd, everyone has troubles but few people respond by killing people. Many people kill because they think God told them too. I'm sure if I were being tortured, I would invent a perfect world of imagination, my happy place, so I wouldn't have to confront the reality of constant pain, but I realize it's a fantasy. Even if you rationalize the need for a fantasy, it's still a fantasy, and living in a fantasy world is not good for the progress of humanity.
 
to spidergoat:
I can tell, you have never been chronically bullied, abused and lonelly, nor you have lost someone you love very much. Escaping with your imagination or with drugs or alcohol is one of the firts things we tend to do, but is only good for a short while. Denial is another big one we tend to do when we suffer also short lived. After we exhaust all of these mechanisms of coping, finally reality gets us. Then we need something else, then is when all of these spiritual things became an option. It will be very hard for you to understand these concepts at this time.
 
yasmin said:
to earth:
In that case if someone is interfering with what us, we will not be completelly responsible for what we do and that would take away our responsibility. It is always easier to blame someone else for what we do. I prefer to believe that we are in control.
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When looking at the teachings of religion who is taking the blame? Humans are taking the blame for a mismanaging God that can't govern, yet supposedly in control.

You are correct, we are not to blame because of the interfering. Once one starts on that path, the one interfering is responsible.
 
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yasmin said:
to spidergoat:
I can tell, you have never been chronically bullied, abused and lonelly, nor you have lost someone you love very much. Escaping with your imagination or with drugs or alcohol is one of the firts things we tend to do, but is only good for a short while. Denial is another big one we tend to do when we suffer also short lived. After we exhaust all of these mechanisms of coping, finally reality gets us. Then we need something else, then is when all of these spiritual things became an option. It will be very hard for you to understand these concepts at this time.
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I have been interested in so-called spiritual questions, I think adverse experiences do influence one to ask deeper questions about the nature of reality, however, I have come to the conclusion that the highest spirituality requires nothing more than what you are born with, the body and the senses are perfect just as they are. The mind is where pain and depression come from. Spirituality only strengthens dependence on the mind, which is the source of suffering in the first place.
 
yasmin said:
to bishandi:
I like to read about these things and then take what makes sense to me. I have never heard of the Tairona Heritage. I will try to find info about that.
thanks!
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notice how you were not BORN bad; you are learning just like each does, has and can

the bad don't do the "look see" to evolve

as for the columbine analogy; the world aint see nutin yet!

ie.... think of 911 as a columbine scenario.
 
to earth
I do not like the idea of someone else giving me aggravation. Do you think the world is like a giant lab where we are being tested like guinea pigs by a superior intelligence?
 
to spidergoat:
I have heard that concept somewhere else, you may have a point. It is just hard to me to accept the idea of spiritualit development will happen with just contemplation or stillness of the senses,like in meditation ( I think this is what you are talking about). If emotions were not somehow usefull in the process, we will probably not have them. Do you know that the human brain is the only brain where the center of the emotions is connected to the tear system? I believe if we have been given a tool to deal with emotions: the capacity of "crying", then emotions must be an important part of our lives. Not to be suppressed or cancelled out, as I think is the theory of some gurus who promote meditation as the only way to achieve spiritual development.
 
yasmin said:
to earth
I do not like the idea of someone else giving me aggravation. Do you think the world is like a giant lab where we are being tested like guinea pigs by a superior intelligence?
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IMO, aliens would be using their nanoprobe/robot/computerized machines here and don't travel the stars themselves. Space isn't a comfortable place, its unsafe. Aliens would be limited to the things they could do unless they invade and that hasn't happened.

I don't know that we can think of ourselves as guinea pigs in a lab, its pretty clear we evolved here with all the other species.

I do think interfering/tampering has been going on by aliens and people in the past have died earlier than they should have because of it. Those deaths have happened at the hands of other humans because of religious zealousness. I think aliens are behind religion, can't prove it. When thinking about military tactics, religion would be a distraction.
 
I'm not a fan of meditation, although I did it in the past. I'm not suggesting an absence of emotion, there is nothing you can do about having an emotion, but I think talk of spirituality is not grounded in anything real. The mind is the problem, not emotion but thought. Even the Tao Te Ching points this out, "can you empty your mind of thoughts and return to the original oneness?". I would go farther and say that trying to empty your mind is also a thought. Maybe if we stop thinking that living is synonymous with thought, that will help. There is no such thing as spiritual development. There is nowhere to go, nothing that needs to be achieved.
 
There is no 'reason for the rhyme'.

I used to hope for that, something more than the big happenstance that the universe is, but I don't anymore.

People live, people die. And then it's over....

Why do we suffer?
We have brains and we have feelings.

And spirituality without religion or God? Isn't a parody of itself?
 
to Bishadi:
Only primitive souls can kill other human beings, and coward primitive souls can kill innocent people. Confronted with the same suffering, an evolved soul would learn spiritual strenght, forgiveness and would try to protect others from the same suffering. A primitive soul, on the other hand, would seek revenge, promote hatred and therefore worsening the suffering as it happended with the Columbine kids or the guy that killed those women at the gym.

These people suffered, yet they were too primitive (just like animals) not evolved enough to deal with their pain. Besides, they were cowards; instead of attacking their own attackers they downloaded thier anger against innocents, who were unprepared for the attack therefore they behaved just like those who hurt them initially.

Even though they had suffered abuse from others, they failed to learn that is not right to attack innocent people. We are not animals we are humans and we should behave as such.
 
to takethewarhome:
So you do not think there is any spiritual value on suffering? We are here for no specific reason we are born to reproduce and die. All of our deeds are irrelevant. If we are good, bad, evil, saints does not make any difference, we will just dissapear when we die.
In that case, to end the suffering in the world we should all be braindead or its equivalent: numb our brain with substances to ease the pain?
So why do you want to "take the war home"?
 
to earth
I still think that concept is a very comfortable one. I can imagine people saying " I am not guilty of killing those people, I did it because alliens inrterfered with my mind!" How convenient!!!

If you can convince everybody that our actions are controlled by someone else then we could still do anything we want even stealing, killing, lying, after all is not our fault! Someone could come and kill you and say "it was the alliens who interfered with my mind and made me do it, I am not guilty!" Can you see any flaw in this line of thinking?
 
yasmin said:
After the death of my father, almost 30 years ago, I started questioning the reasons why do we have to lose our loved ones. Why death has to exist?


My paranormal experiences have showed me that the real “us” is not our body; our consciousness is in a place separated from our bodies. Our bodies may be half death or unconscious but “we” are aware, we can hear, see, feel happiness, and be in more than one place at a time if we want to. These experiences allowed me to accept the concept of reincarnation. It makes sense to me that our spirit comes back again and again to the school of life so it can continue evolving.
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It would appear that the death of your father has made some lasting impressions that are making you insane.
 
to spidergoat
So for you, we are here to vegetate, not for a specific reason just awaiting for death to arrive. Well, I cannot tell if you are right or wrong, if that concept is good enough for you, keeps you happy and balanced and does not led you to hurt anyone; I am all right.

I had that concept many years ago, but at one point I needed to find more meaning once my life became an endless nightmare. Same with organized religions I was catholic for many years until, it did not suit my circumstances anymore.
 
yasmin said:
to earth
I do not like the idea of someone else giving me aggravation. Do you think the world is like a giant lab where we are being tested like guinea pigs by a superior intelligence?
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Your brain is in control of everything....:D .
 
yasmin said:
to Bishadi:
Only primitive souls can kill other human beings, and coward primitive souls can kill innocent people.
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if the soul of mind (learned ideas/memories) and the compassion of consciousness are considered of the same; i can see that point of view

but compassion is universal and mind is learned

culturally a mind can be damaged; no matter the person, by the learned capabilities or oppression of knowledge.

What this shares is that knowledge, ideas and wish to kill, is all learned rather than of birth.

A Pope has caused murder and many a begger can forgive/Love; each baby was/had their first meal from one nipple at a time. The knowledge; to comprehend choice; was learned. (from another)

Confronted with the same suffering, an evolved soul would learn spiritual strenght, forgiveness and would try to protect others from the same suffering.
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such many require the death of the deceptive (teaching) (and the people who choose thereof to corrupt intentionally)

There are stories of even God 'flooding' the earth to clean up, the people of 'self'. (in compassion for life as a whole)

Then look at the eart today; does it appear 'self' has imposed much with the 'invisible hand' (adam smith 1776).

A primitive soul, on the other hand, would seek revenge, promote hatred and therefore worsening the suffering as it happended with the Columbine kids or the guy that killed those women at the gym.
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revenge is of 'self'

911 was not

the children can see more as the elders, see less

Some maintain blinders with the guise of "peace" but fail to see the 'needs' of the children they are to nurture. (the children will exceed the old as a fact of nature)

These people suffered, yet they were too primitive (just like animals) not evolved enough to deal with their pain. Besides, they were cowards; instead of attacking their own attackers they downloaded thier anger against innocents, who were unprepared for the attack therefore they behaved just like those who hurt them initially.
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oppression, suppression enables the instinctive regression (back to the oldest of choices; hate)

Identifying the cause is more important than labeling the outcome.

Even though they had suffered abuse from others, they failed to learn that is not right to attack innocent people. We are not animals we are humans and we should behave as such.
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when the lion rampages the village; do you save yourself or fend for the community?

people of compassion will react when knowing their brethren are being abused

the cure is enabling the 'truth' and let it live as just like in natures evidence; the good will live; the bad will fail to extinction
 
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