Absurd things Christians say...

[SetiAlpha6]

Typical. You have read but not understood what plainly my quote said: Read it again.

So apparently, you think that God is actively lying to me and deceiving me to prevent me from accepting the "Way of Salvation" and from being "Saved".

And you also apparently, think that this is good and moral and agree with God that He should be doing this not only to me but to millions of others like me?

Is that correct?

 

[takethewarhome]

So apparently, you think that God is actively lying to me and deceiving me to prevent me from accepting the "Way of Salvation" and from being "Saved".

And you also apparently, think that this is good and moral and agree with God that He should be doing this not only to me but to millions of others like me?

Is that correct?

Adstar knows all about God. Has his phone number, even.

 

[jpappl]

Squirrel

That's the problem, the specifics are at odds with what we have learned is reality. ”

reality is not specific...

Reality is very specific in this case. It is what we know and have learned about how things work and are. Which again, is at odds with the creation claims in the bible.

i dont say the bible is the Word of god..i say it helps you learn what is..

I understand, but many do believe it is.

But you can't prove something doesn't exist. So I could just as easily say, there is an elephant that flys I saw him. ”

I saw him yesterday..he was pink...

That's him, lol.

“ What evidence keeps coming up that advances the creation story as valid ? ”

depends...some bible scholars say the 7 days is not actual days but could be years or even thousands of years...

Ok, so does that make sense to you. Each day would have to be billions of years, and if that was the case, then the bible would have to include major events like dinosaurs roaming the earth for hundreds of millions of years.

But of course it doesn't make sense because even if this is an interpretation, they still have the sun revolving around the earth. So no what ?

Appears that they are not finding anything new evidence.

“ More reasonable because your not advocating the bible as proof of god and again the stories of value or not are not claimed as evidence of god. ”

again evidence of god is a personal thing..the bible helps to find it..

But there is no evidence of god in the bible, so how can you find it. I respect others belief in god, but when someone claims a belief I question the justification for the belief. Typically, since the texts do not offer evidence, people are resigned to agree that it is just faith.

I don't understand why some feel that this is not adequate.

But the evidence in the bible which clearly spells out how we became and how things are is clearly false. Where does that leave someone who will also question the teachings and not just follow them ? ”

there it is..i am not advocating Mindlessly following god..this is where ppl get screwed up...they end up 'do as your told' not 'think for yourself' cause MAN leads them there not god..

Well then great, so you plan is to continue to find justification for the belief.

Just curious, what do you do with the information that doesn't fit ?

 

[jpappl]

Lmao. If everyone were born with a defect then it'd no longer be considered a defect.

Don't confuse us with sensible statements.

 

[Grim_Reaper]

Well if we are gods children and we have defects then is it not logical to conclude that God is infact defective too.

 

[Red Devil]

I am a B.A.A. Born Again Athiest.

Christian: But you cant be right?

Me: why not?

Christian: Because god says I am?


AAAGGGHHHH!!!!!!!!


Me: There cannot be a god because if he/she/it was omnipotent, he/she/it would never have started and caused so much suffering to so many for so long and the cruelty done to poor children is totally insane.

Christian: Its gods will and he gave us free will - BALLS!!!!!!!!

 

[NMSquirrel]

Squirrel
Reality is very specific in this case. It is what we know and have learned about how things work and are. Which again, is at odds with the creation claims in the bible.

reality is a term for everything that exists..everything is not specific..

Ok, so does that make sense to you. Each day would have to be billions of years, and if that was the case, then the bible would have to include major events like dinosaurs roaming the earth for hundreds of millions of years.

there is opinion that exists that say there is at least one dinosaur in the bible..(jury is still out for my opinion about that..)

But of course it doesn't make sense because even if this is an interpretation, they still have the sun revolving around the earth. So no what ?

ok.. where does it say that??

Appears that they are not finding anything new evidence.

finding evidence and having that evidence accepted is two different things..cant really say there isnt any new evidence if the evidence is presented then rejected..there is evidence..(not of all things in the bible btw but some)

But there is no evidence of god in the bible, so how can you find it. I respect others belief in god, but when someone claims a belief I question the justification for the belief. Typically, since the texts do not offer evidence, people are resigned to agree that it is just faith.

Well then great, so you plan is to continue to find justification for the belief.

Just curious, what do you do with the information that doesn't fit ?

IMHO recap..
I believe in god..
the bible is a guide to show us where to look for god..and to teach us how to get along with each other..
the bible was written by MAN not god..god had inspired those men to write those things,which give us the best clue to where to find god..but no man is perfect..we all make mistakes..even those in the bible (lets not discuss jesus)


there is old and new testament..
i often contemplate what an additional testament would look and sound like if it were written today..(ppl couldnt resist adding their own 'flavors' to the story..)

as far as information that doesnt fit..that works both ways....

 

[NMSquirrel]

and the cruelty done to poor children is totally insane.
Christian: Its gods will and he gave us free will - BALLS!!!!!!!!

dont think its gods will to harm little children..must be the other guy...

 

[jpappl]

“ Originally Posted by jpappl
Squirrel
Reality is very specific in this case. It is what we know and have learned about how things work and are. Which again, is at odds with the creation claims in the bible. ”

reality is a term for everything that exists..everything is not specific..

Reality is everything that we know exists.

“ Ok, so does that make sense to you. Each day would have to be billions of years, and if that was the case, then the bible would have to include major events like dinosaurs roaming the earth for hundreds of millions of years. ”

there is opinion that exists that say there is at least one dinosaur in the bible..(jury is still out for my opinion about that..)

Well the creation story is a tangled web, there should be quite a bit more detail.

“ But of course it doesn't make sense because even if this is an interpretation, they still have the sun revolving around the earth. So no what ? ”

ok.. where does it say that??

Here is a link.

http://www.godvsthebible.com/node/9

Again, ignorance of the day is not an excuse when dealing with the supposed words of god.

Appears that they are not finding anything new evidence. ”

finding evidence and having that evidence accepted is two different things..cant really say there isnt any new evidence if the evidence is presented then rejected..there is evidence..(not of all things in the bible btw but some)

Well the evidence has to stand up to some kind of scrutiny. If I told you large pink elephants fly, and I showed you a blurry image of one would you accept it without question. Of course not.

IMHO recap..
I believe in god..

Understood.

the bible is a guide to show us where to look for god..and to teach us how to get along with each other..

Supposed to be, I agree.

the bible was written by MAN not god

Agree

god had inspired those men to write those things

Don't agree, no evidence to back up this claim, more evidence to disregard the claim. Such errors in the book should not occur if god inspired. So if you claim the book is not the word of god but god inspired your just laying all of the blame/errors in the book on man.

Would god allow for such an error which would cast doubt on the reader. Makes no sense. Does it ?

there is old and new testament..
i often contemplate what an additional testament would look and sound like if it were written today..(ppl couldnt resist adding their own 'flavors' to the story..)

as far as information that doesnt fit..that works both ways....

In the old testament, slavery was acceptable. In the new testament I think think are treated a little better. The problem is that science is a world that is encoraged to change with new and better information. The religious texts are finite in what they can offer and those are in many ways valuable, but they are not mean't to be taken literally and yet people do.

They are the words of men and provide no real justification for the belief of god as an entity described in their texts.

 

[Red Devil]

dont think its gods will to harm little children..must be the other guy...

ah, but this 'god' gave him/her that will knowing full well the consequence.

 

[Adstar]

So apparently, you think that God is actively lying to me and deceiving me to prevent me from accepting the "Way of Salvation" and from being "Saved".

And you also apparently, think that this is good and moral and agree with God that He should be doing this not only to me but to millions of others like me?

Is that correct?

Is it not true that you once where Christian?

Did you not say your dad claimed to have been healed? By the God of Abraham?

Did you not once believe but then rejected Jesus?

And a correction. What i am talking about Here. This particular issue, Is not part of the Core beliefs that one must believe to be saved. The core beliefs are pretty simple even most athiests have got a fair idea what it is.

Jesus does not block anyone from the simple faith that saves. But once that faith is rejected, Then yeah he can harden ones mind to block one from Salvation. Think of what God did to pharaoh once He reputedly rejected the will of God.

You make it sound like you have never had the option. Or God blocks people from ever having the option. Maybe a calvanist might agree with you but calvanisim is not a true reflection of the will of God.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Adstar]

Originally Posted by Adstar
These people HAVE ALREADY REJECTED THE NOTION OF BEING SAVED. THEY HAVE ASSESSED THE WILL OF GOD AND THE WAY GOD HAS MADE FOR THEM TO HAVE SALVATION AND THEY HAVE REJECTED IT AS EITHER FOOLISH OR EVIL OR A LIE.

Where is it?

You mean where is it in scripture?

2 Thessalonians 2
9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Clear as day. What God will do and why He will do it.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

Bleah.

If God exists, then it must be quite beyond our limited understanding, thus anyone who says "God would/wouldn't do X" is deluded. Unless you are God, you don't know.

Xians need to realize that if God is as great as they say it is, then God may have desired to make kindling in the form of non-believers, and to leave people alone.

Atheists need to realize that faith is not something which can be proven or shared, and that questioning believers tends to simply make them more intractable.

How pointless. It's like the right hand telling the left hand that it's wrong, and vice-versa.

 

[SetiAlpha6]

Is it not true that you once where Christian?

Did you not say your dad claimed to have been healed? By the God of Abraham?

Did you not once believe but then rejected Jesus?

And a correction. What i am talking about Here. This particular issue, Is not part of the Core beliefs that one must believe to be saved. The core beliefs are pretty simple even most athiests have got a fair idea what it is.

Jesus does not block anyone from the simple faith that saves. But once that faith is rejected, Then yeah he can harden ones mind to block one from Salvation. Think of what God did to pharaoh once He reputedly rejected the will of God.

You make it sound like you have never had the option. Or God blocks people from ever having the option. Maybe a calvanist might agree with you but calvanisim is not a true reflection of the will of God.

So, yes, you really do think that God is actively lying to me and deceiving me and preventing me from accepting the "Way of Salvation" and from being "Saved" or as the text says, "that they all may be condemned".

And, yes, you really do think that this is good and moral and agree with God that He should be doing this not only to me but to millions of others like me?

WOW!

If I may ask, how do you square this with all of the scriptures that clearly state that God cannot lie or deceive anyone? Because I cannot make sense of this at all. Again please, how do you make sense out of it?

And how can you square this with the fact that lying and deception is wrong and is a sin according to the Bible? How do you make sense out of that as well?

Can God perform any "sin" without it still being sinfull and wrong or does the fact that He is doing it make it right no matter what He does? If He rapes a woman, for example, does that make rape right or "righteous" for Him?

Or another question might be, does He live by His own teachings and commands? Does He practice what He preaches? What do you think?

Sorry if I am not being clear.

 

[Orleander]

...All Praise The Ancient Of Days

It may not be absurd, but it is annoying.

 

[takethewarhome]

It may not be absurd, but it is annoying.

Oh yeah.

 

[NMSquirrel]

Here is a link.
http://www.godvsthebible.com/node/9

went to that link..found some verses they claim is evidence for your comment..read them..looked in my bible..again i say that it was MAN not god that wrote or said those things..

Again, ignorance of the day is not an excuse when dealing with the supposed words of god.

there is that phrase again..'words of god'
this is a Literal view of the bible..

of what i can recall.. there are only two instinces in the bible of where it said god actually wrote one is the ten commandments and the other was when david saw the writing on the wall...those can be considered 'words of god'..

Such errors in the book should not occur if god inspired.

have you ever tried to communicate something you barely understood??

So if you claim the book is not the word of god but god inspired your just laying all of the blame/errors in the book on man.

correct

Would god allow for such an error which would cast doubt on the reader. Makes no sense. Does it ?

I think maybe hes trying to teach us what faith is...

The religious texts are finite in what they can offer and those are in many ways valuable, but they are not mean't to be taken literally and yet people do.

i dont agree with the finite part..but the rest i do..

They are the words of men and provide no real justification for the belief of god as an entity described in their texts.

communication is the justification, they had communicated a sense of who/what god is supposed to be..sure they have had experiances with god..but they are still humans and as such are susceptible to their own humanity..i am 95% sure that each of them added their own 'flavor' to the mix..

also there is an element of he needs to teach us one thing before we can understand another...so maybe what is in the bible is what ppl needed to learn...( this is where i ponder a third testament..)

 

[NMSquirrel]

ah, but this 'god' gave him/her that will knowing full well the consequence.

we still make our own choices..

 

[NMSquirrel]

Is it not true that you once where Christian?
Jesus does not block anyone from the simple faith that saves. But once that faith is rejected, Then yeah he can harden ones mind to block one from Salvation.

you really think jesus died on the cross just to turn his back on us??
he knows we screw up..he wants us to be with him..and he has ALREADY forgiven us..salvation is already guarenteed (again he died for it)..you dont have to jump through some religions hoops to feel worthy.

 

[NMSquirrel]

These people HAVE ALREADY REJECTED THE NOTION OF BEING SAVED. THEY HAVE ASSESSED THE WILL OF GOD AND THE WAY GOD HAS MADE FOR THEM TO HAVE SALVATION AND THEY HAVE REJECTED IT AS EITHER FOOLISH OR EVIL OR A LIE

2 Thessalonians 2
9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders,

satan is trying to act like god

10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish,

deception says someone taught them wrong and they listened..

because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

because they were not taught right so they were not equiped to recieve

11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie,

they get set in their ways and refuse to learn the right way cause their way is more fun

12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.