Why women cannot be priests
- Thread starter Lawdog
- Start date
Lawdog said:
Unfortunately your knowledge of the Church of England is badly flawed. It is not ruled over by a supremely powerful person like the RC Church (which is blatantly anti-scriptural). The monarch is the titular head and Queen Elizabeth remains so and will continue to be so until she dies, when the next monarch will take on that role. The 'chief executive' is the Archbishop of Canterbury but he is 'primus inter pares' (first among equals). He does not have supreme power like the Pope. Decisions are actually made (as has been indicated elsewhere) by different levels of groups of clergy and lay people. These are known as synods and go from local level (Deanery Synod) up to a top level (General Synod). The lay people on these synods are elected by those on the electoral roll of the various Anglican parishes at their Annual Parish Meetings. There is thus quite a level of democracy in the Church of England which perhaps explains why, for all its faults, it seems to manage to be somewhat more connected to day to day reality than the Cardinals in Rome.
It also needs to be borne in mind that whilst the RC church claims as members anyone who has been baptised into it whether they have any belief or attendance at church or not, the membership of the Church of England is based on those who have signed themselves on to an electoral roll of a parish and therefore by definition at least regularly attend a church and in all likelihood have a strong belief (since there is no particular kudos or other reason to go to church in England unless you do). The membership is therefore likely to be more representative of the reality of personal belief.
The Church of England is a very broad church from 'high' (very close to Roman Catholicism) through to extreme liberal and highly evangelical. This is both a great strength but also of course a cause of what are often quite painful public disagreements between the various views. This is in my opinion much healthier, however, than within the Roman Catholic church where people are told what to believe and large numbers simply ignore that and live in a form of hypocritical acceptance of that belief when dealing with the priest whilst believing and doing something quite different in their personal lives.
In case I am accused of ignorant prejudice, I would point out that my first wife was Roman Catholic, as was all of her family and that I still have many Roman Catholics amongst my friends and acquaintances
It should also be noted that the Church of England is extremely careful about child protection and following the law of the land in that regard. Sadly that is in total contrast to the attempts to conceal child abuse within the UK Roman Catholic church which due to luck (or influence in very high places) has managed to escape the wholesale prosecution which would almost certainly have been the result in other organisations.
So Lawdog do not write the Church of England off too quickly. Our church has survived all attempts to destroy it over the years (including papal sponsored attempted invasions of our country) and today there are some wonderful evangelical healthy congregations growing in size every week in all parts of the England, where people are living out their lives for Jesus. This month I shall be at a Christian Conference organised by our church where thousands of people will take over the Kent County showground in Detling to worship and learn more about Christ. Yes we have our own problems to address but I suggest that you would be better looking to those within your own church first and if you must comment on another denomination at least find out some facts about it first!
regards,
Gordon.
Provita said:So you made it up? Or do you have a link? Next time someone says something, you can always ask for a link, and if the link seems bogus, say so. Thats part of debating... deciding whether the evidence used in the debate is reliable or bias or total shit
Oh, so the Monarch of England was not the head of the Anglican Church? Thats a new one. It didnt matter what any bishops council said, they were afraid of losing their heads as in the reign of Henry VIII. That was the unstated threat. Sure, they passed ecclesial rules and so forth, but everything had to be pleasing to the monarch, not to Christ. The Monarch, especally Elizabeth, was supreme authority at the time.
Thats the difference between you and I. You simply repeat what liberal professors have taught you or written in some "scholarly" book. I, on the otherhand, have learned to think critically and think for myself, using my broad knowledge of history to come to a sound understanding.
Lawdog said:Thats the difference between you and I. You simply repeat what liberal professors have taught you or written in some "scholarly" book. I, on the otherhand, have learned to think critically and think for myself, using my broad knowledge of history to come to a sound understanding.
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M*W: This made my day! Thanks for the laugh!
And you simply repeat what conservative priests taught you or wrote in some "scholarly" or "holy" or "historical ... etc." book. I, on the other hand, have learned to think critically for myself, using my broad knowledge of different religions and debates, to come to an understanding that is sound to me.
And I never said the Monarch of England was wasnt the head of the Anglican Church.
You said: "Answer: She had wisdom enough to know not to play around with sacred things too much."
What I am saying is: How do you know that is the answer? Do you any supporting evidence? What made you come to that conclusion?
And I never said the Monarch of England was wasnt the head of the Anglican Church.
You said: "Answer: She had wisdom enough to know not to play around with sacred things too much."
What I am saying is: How do you know that is the answer? Do you any supporting evidence? What made you come to that conclusion?
I became Catholic because of the study of history that I pursued, under the direction of secular and protestant scholars, not Catholic ones or priests.
Though they were not famous for inventing novel theories about Jesus or the stone age, the scholars who taught me at least had sense enough to know their material well.
about Elizabeth: its a speculation of course, based on her very wise character, but it makes sense, and unless you can prove to me otherwise, I will hold to it.
Though they were not famous for inventing novel theories about Jesus or the stone age, the scholars who taught me at least had sense enough to know their material well.
about Elizabeth: its a speculation of course, based on her very wise character, but it makes sense, and unless you can prove to me otherwise, I will hold to it.
Lawdog said:
The Church of England is a subject you know nothing about that is very apparent. It is also clear you are a bigot and a hypocrit - dont ask for examples - just read through your previous posts.
What amazes me is so many people are replying to your senseless arguments - personally, I'd like you to return from under the rock you came from.
The Doctrine Of The Church On The Exclusion Of Women From Priestly Ordination May Not Be Blamed On Discrimination. 'Rather It Arises From Christ's Own Intention Regarding The Priesthood. The Bishop Should Prove His Pastoral Ability And Leadership Qualities By Resolutely Refusing Any Support To Those People - Whether Individuals Or Groups - Who Defend The Priestly Ordination Of Women, Whether They Do So In The Name Of Progress, Of Human Rights, Compassion Or For Whatever Reason It May Be.
Creeping Death said:
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M*W: Puh-leese! Women's rights have been stuck up the asses of men since time immemorial. Males have no "compassion." Get with the program!
I don't get why women can't be priest. I don't think what your saying makes much sense Lawdog. = / I mostly can't believe that we still don't have alter girls. Wheres the harm in that?!?
I'm not really going to go on about this since I have no desire to be a priest and I think that the Catholic Church has been doing fine.
I'm not really going to go on about this since I have no desire to be a priest and I think that the Catholic Church has been doing fine.
Medicine Woman said:
That's funny and all but I can't agree with you on that. I know a lot of compassionate men.
hug-a-tree said:That's funny and all but I can't agree with you on that. I know a lot of compassionate men.
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M*W: Hear me now, believe me later! Show me just one!
well, men are defending women's rights as we speak. and a lot of gay men can be compassionate. Havnt you learned never to generalize people MW? generalizing someone negatively isnt too smart, i say rather than starting to attack men on this issue, we should go back to the RCC and lapdog ... err... lawdog, sry
Medicine Woman said:
That doesn't sound like a very compassionate attitude.
hug-a-tree said:
Because all the homos that make up 99% of the ranks of the priesthood don't WANT alter girls. They want their boys.
hug-a-tree said:That's funny and all but I can't agree with you on that. I know a lot of compassionate men.
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M*W: Well, where are they?
Giambattista said:Because all the homos that make up 99% of the ranks of the priesthood don't WANT alter girls. They want their boys.
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M*W: Compassionate attitude??? You've got to be kidding!!!
I figured Doggyboy would appreciate that observation.
LA LA LA!!!
LA LA LA!!!
Compassionate is an adj. meaning showing compassion...
compassion:
A noun
1 compassion, pity
the humane quality of understanding the suffering of others and wanting to do something about it
2 compassion, compassionateness
a deep awareness of and sympathy for another's suffering
Last time I checked, MW, there are men who feel sorry for other's suffering and want it to stop. Maybe you are just looking in the wrong area. A small area (small in comparison to the world) of men doesnt represent the gender. Now can we go back to the priesthood topic? If you want to keep talking about men and compassion, make a new topic on one of the other forums and send me the link and I will gladly join in the discussion.
Thanks for the good laugh
compassion:
A noun
1 compassion, pity
the humane quality of understanding the suffering of others and wanting to do something about it
2 compassion, compassionateness
a deep awareness of and sympathy for another's suffering
Last time I checked, MW, there are men who feel sorry for other's suffering and want it to stop. Maybe you are just looking in the wrong area. A small area (small in comparison to the world) of men doesnt represent the gender. Now can we go back to the priesthood topic? If you want to keep talking about men and compassion, make a new topic on one of the other forums and send me the link and I will gladly join in the discussion.
Giambattista said:Because all the homos that make up 99% of the ranks of the priesthood don't WANT alter girls. They want their boys.
Thanks for the good laugh