Why Priest Can't Marry?

A glimpse

If priest are permitted to marry will homosexual marriages be legalize? A practice, the R.C.C. verbally condems? Who are you fooling? Nevetheless, the self proclaimed "one true church" should know that God has not forbid marriage but homosexuality.
 
Why priests cannot wed

I am not advocating homosexuality and I don't know where that came into the picture. I was offering the reason why priests cannot be wed. I was hoping to expound on this later due to time constraints but this miscommunication compels me to explain. Though marriage is a holy and wonderful thing priests do not partake in it for a number of reasons. 1) A priest partakes in a different kind of marriage; one to the church. The priest is committed, as in a marriage, to Holy Orders, or marring the Church. This act of taking Christ on as the bridegroom and submitting ones life to His service and that of the Church's is just as strong if not stronger than a marriage to a person. 2) Sacrifice; the giving up of the possibility of family and sex to better serve the Church. Marriage is just one of the many things that a priest chooses to sacrifice for God. 3) Also, in not having a family the priest can devote 100% of his time to the ministry of his parish. To try to address the miscommunication of homosexuality, just because a priest does not marry and remains chaste does not mean he is or will become homosexual; a man does not need sex to remain heterosexual. Furthermore, and I don't know if you thought about this at all, being chaste and not getting married does not make a child molester.
~Paradox
 
** Remain chaste? This is the problem, it is commanded that, "It is better to marry than to BURN. If one can not contain themself, meanwhile homsexuality & child molestation is a darker spiritual issue which doesn't belong at the pulpit.
Here in lies the truth, God and the R.C.C. are two seprate entities with two different agendas. And the priest adhere to the Pontiff and his desire's are represented through them. This is also true for those who worship God.
 
Peace -- Lady I don't know where you have gotten you "truth" form but it is most certainly a different source than mine.
First of all, I don't understand you're first part of your response "which doesn't belong?". Of course the molestation does not belong. But if you are saying that chastity, homosexuality and molestation are related, they are NOT. To be chaste, even if homosexual, one must abstain from sexual action (i.e. molestation). Therefore, it would stand true to logic that, through deductive reasoning, a chaste person could not be a molester.
As for the second part of you're response, "two separate agendas and two separate entities", it is totally absurd. The Church and Christ are one, regardless of human error. This being true, the pontiff and all his priests would, in turn, serve Christ with His same agenda. Just because humans are imperfect does not mean they cannot server something that is with out failure. -- Peace
 
** For clarification purpose's I know that chasity is abstaining from fleshly lust of any sort and that such a choice is not a commandment of God. Yet the Pope makes it a rule that priest can't possibly marry and serve God at the same time.(agenda?)Nevertheless, I am a bit confused, you said with certanity that molesters don't belong at the pulpit but what about homosexuals?



As for the second part of you're response, "two separate agendas and two separate entities", it is totally absurd. The Church and Christ are one, regardless of human error. This being true, the pontiff and all his priests would, in turn, serve Christ with His same agenda.


**Do you honestly believe the R.C.C. is in the postion to judge the world? The Bible said He'll Judge the world by Jesus Christ, and Jesus Christ is the Word.



**** See my earlier post on excerpts written by William Marrion Branham
 
Originally posted by Lady
** For clarification purpose's I know that chasity is abstaining from fleshly lust of any sort and that such a choice is not a commandment of God. Yet the Pope makes it a rule that priest can't possibly marry and serve God at the same time.(agenda?)Nevertheless, I am a bit confused, you said with certanity that molesters don't belong at the pulpit but what about homosexuals?



As for the second part of you're response, "two separate agendas and two separate entities", it is totally absurd. The Church and Christ are one, regardless of human error. This being true, the pontiff and all his priests would, in turn, serve Christ with His same agenda.


**Do you honestly believe the R.C.C. is in the postion to judge the world? The Bible said He'll Judge the world by Jesus Christ, and Jesus Christ is the Word.



**** See my earlier post on excerpts written by William Marrion Branham
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Peace -- I'm sorry Lady, but I believe that you are not correct. The pope does make it a mandatory thing that priests do not wed but that is not to say that they cannot be wed and serve God at the same time. the pope never said that anyways. In this, there would be no hidden agenda as you implied.

To address the child molester vs. homosexual issue. I say that homosexuals, though homosexuality is a sin, should not be ban from the priest hood. If heterosexuals can be chaste so can homosexuals. Just because they have a differing sexual preference does not make them uncontrollable sexual predators. They are, from what I have gathered from some gay people I know, no more sex-crazed than you or I. This does not hold true though for child molesters or any molesters for that matter. Homosexuality is not a psychological disorder/disease as pedophilia is. The homosexual men can be and usually are mentally mature where as the molesters are not even mentally stable to say the least. The question should not be "should gays or molesters be priests?", but rather "should mentally unstable men be priests?" Because a mentally stable man can maintain chastity, neutralizing himself as a threat, no mater what his sexual preference, but one never knows or can predict about the mentally unstable persons actions (i.e. Child Molesters).

To further address the idea that the Catholic Church and Christ are one is to say, the Catholic Church IS the universal Church, and if you want to read into it as far as to say that "it is the world" than so be it. The Church and Christ are one because Christ is with the Church and to be totally with Christ is to be Christ and/or Christ like. I don't know what more to say about this. I don't want to keep going back and forth, saying the same things about the same topic so if it is alright with you we can "agree to disagree" on this matter and continue our discussion on the homosexuals and the molesters. -- Peace
 
Originally posted by Paradox_VII
Peace -- I'm sorry Lady, but I believe that you are not correct. The pope does make it a mandatory thing that priests do not wed but that is not to say that they cannot be wed and serve God at the same time. the pope never said that anyways. In this, there would be no hidden agenda as you implied.


** Then priest can marry?

To address the child molester vs. homosexual issue. I say that homosexuals, though homosexuality is a sin, should not be ban from the priest hood.

** Doesn't sound like you really believe homosexuality is a sin. What is your religion?



Homosexuality is not a psychological disorder/disease as pedophilia is. The homosexual men can be and usually are mentally mature where as the molesters are not even mentally stable to say the least. The question should not be "should gays or molesters be priests?", but rather "should mentally unstable men be priests?" Because a mentally stable man can maintain chastity, neutralizing himself as a threat, no mater what his sexual preference, but one never knows or can predict about the mentally unstable persons actions (i.e. Child Molesters).


** Quick reminder most of the priest sodomizing your children were homosexual. A penitentiary for the small ones, nevertheless, the Vatican put them in your conventicles not Christ.




To further address the idea that the Catholic Church and Christ are one is to say, the Catholic Church IS the universal Church, and if you want to read into it as far as to say that "it is the world" than so be it. The Church and Christ are one because Christ is with the Church and to be totally with Christ is to be Christ and/or Christ like.


** Totally with Christ, if only.




I don't know what more to say about this. I don't want to keep going back and forth, saying the same things about the same topic so if it is alright with you we can "agree to disagree" on this matter and continue our discussion on the homosexuals and the molesters. -- Peace
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**COLOR]Homosexuality You can't bless what God has cursed.[/
 
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Peace -- God does not curse people, He curses homosexuality and the acts there of. To ordain a priest is to bless the person, not something God has cursed. -- Peace
 
I've noticed by looking at the threads, people keep bringing up old questions that were at the beggining and answered there. People keep saying stuff like "why can't priests marry? that's wrong" and whatsupyall mentioned in one of the earliar threads that there are other things one can do (like going into different ministry type deals that are basically the same thing but you can marry). The priests made a commitment not to get married by becoming a priest, If they truly wanted to get married or not, is there decision, not anyone elses.

I enjoy reading debates. People who are trying to prove the existance of God (note that the g is capitoloized, meaning the christian god), debate with poeple trying to prove God doesn't exist. The main thing isn't just "having it proved that God exists and then accept him". It is what the decision means, for example, if one accepts God aand believes in him and everything like that, that person believes that he/she has a purpose here on earth, that the earth willl be destroyed and therefore isn't what they should seek after and conform to and other stuff. Whereas, if one disbelieves in God, whats the point?? that person may believe in something else, but from what this quthor has noticed, most (if not all> exception= Biblical Christianity) worldviews/religion/belief/whatever has evolution as a theory of where mankind came from. Evolution basically leaves people to wonder, "hmm, I don't have a purpose and am just a random act of molecules doing stuff. I guess it woldn't matter if I broke this window because i basicaly don't exist in the thought that my thoughts are just random things created by chemicals and junk in my head and i am not anything more than a creature sitting here pointless". (although different thing might be picked out and picked on, the basic message is the same= one has a limited amount of time here on earth (exception that I know of= reincarnation) and does whatever he or she chooses to do and then turns into dirt and ceases to exist.





Why would one want to spend their time here on earth telling people that believe otherwise that they don't have a purpose here on earth?


I can see it now, NON_BELIEVER (in God): Hey buddy, do ou believe that God exists and has made you for a purpose? BELIEVER: Yah, Why? NON_BELIEVER: well, I just wanted you to know God doesn't exist and you don't really serve a purpose here on earth. BELIEVER: yeah,,, now I can wander around pointlessly and destroy stuff having no eternal consequences (just remember: Jesus Christ shed his blood to take away your sin), thank you for telling me! I'm so happy.


lol, that'd be funny, maybe.

Then there is the time old deal of "Christians suck, priets molest kids, Christianity mustnot be good if that happens"

Here is the same old answer that has been used to answer that question for over 2000 years. "an individual chooses what they believe, if an individual chose to be Cathloic (not to pick on catholics, I just wanted and example) he or she may not be a Christian, and even if someone was a Christian and was someone considered to be Godly like one of the saints or something, that person could make the decision to do whatever they wanted at any point in there lives, for instance, if a Christian man decides to kick his dog and it dies and he goes to jail, that doesn't make "Christians" evil in any way shape or form.


Now, I could go and proclaim that I'm A christian and have a wonderful relationship wiith Christ and stuff and then decide to rape someone, that just means that "I" as an individual didn't stand strong aainst such desires and gave into my lustful ways. That doesn't mean that "God" is responsible for my actions, so to say that Christians have molested people, shot them, stabbed them, heck, even one of Jesus' diciples that was with him cut off a guys ear, and are therefore bad, is just not right. I could saythat stuff about any religion if I wanted to and it would be true if everyone was connected by some brain device that is used to control people.


If someone wanted to look into Christianity, and started with a religion like methodist-ism or whatever, that person would come across a lot of strange stuff and notice holes in it, however, Christianity is the beleif in Christ,not the belief that you have to do this and that (In my own personal oppinion, I think Methodists tried to patch Christianity in with evolution because they* (*the people that formed it) thought that evolution would destroy the thought of Christianity and there fore had to change it to make it fit) and follow this law and that law and be perfect and make atonement for your own sins. Being a Christian is simply believing that God exists and having a personal relationship with him. Several people have grown up in the church enviroment and have been very active in the church and have invited Jesus into their lives but don't talk to God, (prayer is way to talk to God but it is not the only way to tsalk to God) they don't have a friendship with him, they think that God is just up there watcing earth and eating popcorn and drinking pop and not talking to people. God is awesome, he wants to talk with you and hang out with you and help you out in every aspect of your life.

I have heard it said by someone who seemed to know about God (that is different than kowing God) that God loves everyone who believes in him. and implied that he doesnt love people if they don't trust in him,,, that isn't true (the last part), God is not willing taht anyone should go to hell, but they have to make the decision to come to him. God is active in everyones lives in some way shape or form, and loves everyone. It is not the healthy that need a doctor, but the sick. God helps out everyone.

if someone believed in something,like, maybe, hmm, Lets use Atheism for example. Then that person doesn't think they really have a purpose other than what they want to do before they die and then that's the end of life.

If that is so, then why don't they spend at least 6 months seeking after God, I don't mean going to church and reading the bible. Although that stuff is important. What I'm refering to is, asking God to reveal himself to you and talk to him and ask him questions and study the the bible (um, yah, I know, "contodiction" but It may just be a controdiction to the way I'm explaining it and not to the Christian faith,, ha take that people looking for stuff to pounce on) and going to a church that allows you to worship anyway you want, (most churches have rules that you have to follow and certain stuff you have to do and jumping around and crying out to God would not be permitted) or better yet. Just worship at home, Just plug in a c,d, of musi dubbed (worchip" and sing it from your heart. If one really spent 3 months seeking after God and praying that God would do stuff, God would move in that persons life and transform that person and stuff, don't think it works? try it, I dare you.

One big thing is that when one worships, that person isn't just singing a song. That's not what God has desired, he searches much depper within. Worship is when your thanking God and telling how great he is mainly the latter. Then also, worship isn't confined to that, God wants us to live our lives worshipping him. He delights in good, for instance, If I opened the door for someone at the grocery store, thats an act of worship because I'm honoring God throgh my actions.

Something I would like to point out so's that it gives people less to pick on and clears some stuff up, God wnats us to follow the law, he tells us to. It says in the bible that it was put there for a reason and that people are supposed to follow it.


Thanks
 
whatsupyall made two points early in the post which I must point out the fallacy of.

First, whatsupyall states that an RC man who wants to serve God and start a family can be a deacon and still celebrate the mass. Actually, while they can do darn near everything else (except hear confessions) they can't actually do the whole changing-the-cracker-into-His-flesh thing. That is reserved to priests.

Second, when someone pointed out that Byzantine Catholic priests can marry, whatsupyall begins blustering that they're not "really" under the pope, don't listen to him, the Orthodox split off in 1054 etc. But the Byzantine Catholics are *NOT the same as the Orthodox. They are churches that *WERE Orthodox and were *REUNITED to Rome recognising the papal primacy. In return for their loyalty they were allowed to keep alot of Orthodox customs (married priests, two-kind communion, liturgy in the vernacular, etc.) Its kind of like whats happening with the "Anglican Use" Catholics down in the states. These are Episcopalian converts who are allowed to use the Book of Common Prayer for Mass, and whose priests are allowed to keep their wives after they convert and are reordained. *BUT THEY ARE LOYAL TO THE VATICAN!

Secondly, Lady needs to lay off the Protestant propaganda. The RCC was the only kind of Christianity around for the first millenium after Christ, and all of the apostles belonged to it.
 
I am also curious as to how everyone is so certain about homosexuality being sinful. Although I am a Catholic Christian, I think that a gay marriage is just as sacramental as a hetero one. I find not justification in the Bible for judging my brethren in Christ, whether they be gay or straight.
 
Homosexuality is not a sin--it's only the desire to sin--but the acts associated with it are. (To believe homosexual acts are sin requires belief that it's God plan for some people to marry and some to enter the religious life. Because of Adam's first sin, however, people are naturally compelled to sin. Calling sins "sin" is different from judging someone. )
 
okinrus: Homosexuality is not a sin--it's only the desire to sin--but the acts associated with it are.
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M*W: Humans were created with human needs. For starters, we need air, water, food and sex, plus the need to build a nest, socialize, etc., etc.., so I fail to see where the bodies we were given could lead us into sin. If god didn't intend for us to have sex, whatever kind of sex we naturally desired, we wouldn't have been born with orifices. I've already given a medical explanation regarding the mother's fluctuating hormonal state during pregnancy which may influence the child's sexuality. Homosexuality is no different in child born with Type I diabetes or cretinism or any other glandular malfunction which can be treated with post-partum hormonal supplements. It's just that we don't know at birth what the child's sexuality will become. However, I am confident that science will create a test to determine this, too. Genetic tests are already available to determine the sex of the child at birth compared to the body of the child. I'm sure we've all seen the stories of a female child growing up in a male's body and vice versa, and the surgeries they go through to give them the right plumbing and hormone replacement. Besides, I thought it was the spirit that mattered and not the plumbing. How low can you christians go?

(To believe homosexual acts are sin requires belief that it's God plan for some people to marry and some to enter the religious life. Because of Adam's first sin, however, people are naturally compelled to sin. Calling sins "sin" is different from judging someone. )[/QUOTE]
 
Lady said:
The Bible doesn't say priest can't married so why is this a hang up for the Vatican? Sincerely, I don't undestand why the Vatican condems that which is blessed by God. No, marriage won't solve all the problems of the R.C.C, but perhaps it could have stopped alot of kids from being victimizied. So if you understand Catholicism please inform me why priest can't marry? I'm Christian but not Catholic, please explain the exact position of the Pope what he hopes to accomplish and the text used. In particular, when it comes to issues of marriage, what reason makes the Pope right and God wrong on any issue.
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There are many reasons why Priests should not marry. Firstly, the original Bishops thought that their Office could be passed down to their children as a kind of family property. The Pope wished to retain the power to appoint his Bishops and so it was simply a good political expedient to forbid Priests to marry... no marriage, no children.

Then there is the Ascetic and Spiritual reasons. Marriage, women and children make a man inextricably secular and worldly. A man who has women and family to think about cannot give himself entirely to the service of God and Humanity.

Being a Priest is more than just a job. It should be thought of as a Spiritual Avocation -- a Calling. If a man wants God, then fine, he can become a Priest. But is a man just wants to have sex, then he should be turned out to the World... he has no Calling.

Also, this business that God somehow likes people to have sex. I believe it comes from either paul or from hebrew tribal traditions. Every Saint who has ever lived has expressed at least strong reservations regarding sexuality. Perhaps it is the greatest argument for paul having been the antichrist, that it was through his teachings that sex was brought into the Church and up to the altar and made a Sacrament. It makes us wonder that Christ had always downplayed the importance of sex, dismissing it saying that there would be no sex in Heaven and that our goal was to be Spirits like the Angels, that is, sexless.

Priest were intended to be the first of these Spirit-like Angel Beings.
 
M*W: Humans were created with human needs. For starters, we need air, water, food and sex, plus the need to build a nest, socialize, etc., etc.., so I fail to see where the bodies we were given could lead us into sin.
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If our bodies could do no sin, then why are there wars?

If god didn't intend for us to have sex, whatever kind of sex we naturally desired, we wouldn't have been born with orifices.
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No, perhaps God places desire in front of us so that we may overcome desire to do wrong. Without desire to wrong, we never have a chance to overcome it.

I've already given a medical explanation regarding the mother's fluctuating hormonal state during pregnancy which may influence the child's sexuality. Homosexuality is no different in child born with Type I diabetes or cretinism or any other glandular malfunction which can be treated with post-partum hormonal supplements.
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Because of abuse, some children later become homosexuals; so the attraction to the same-sex is not entirely genetic, though genetics may play a role in making some one susceptible.
 
okinrus: If our bodies could do no sin, then why are there wars?
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M*W: Are you saying that wars = sin?
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okinrus: No, perhaps God places desire in front of us so that we may overcome desire to do wrong. Without desire to wrong, we never have a chance to overcome it.
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M*W: Our desires are totally human. No god needed.
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okinrus: Because of abuse, some children later become homosexuals; so the attraction to the same-sex is not entirely genetic, though genetics may play a role in making some one susceptible.
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M*W: I can see that when a boy is severely abused by his father or another male, he may grow up with the desire to overcome what his father had done to him by seeking out relationships with other males to find the acceptance that he never did with his dad.
 
Just on the comment on st peter not being married
I have SCRIPTURAL proof that he was. I refer you to
Matthew 8:14
When Jesus came into Peter's house, he saw Peter's mother-in-law lying in bed with a fever
How could peter not have a mother in law if he was not married
I put this question to cathecists and others who say that peter wasn't married.
Remember to contradict what's in the bible is a sin against god and tantamount to the sin of blasphemy (Unforgivable)
 
whatsupyall said:
When you become a priest, or a bishop, or a pope, YOU ARE CALLED TO GO ON TO THE NATIONS AND EVERY CORNERS OF THE EARTH TO PROCLAIM THE GOSPEL. IF U HAVE A FAMILY, YOUR KIDS WILL END UP GROWING WITHOUT A FATHER
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actually its more likely is that your kids would end up growing up with a homosexual pedophile dad who propogates the worldwide belief in history's biggest lie.
 
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