Why must people hate Islam?

[S.A.M.]

It's working as you speak. We now have an "Black" man as POTUS. Just a couple years ago this would have been almost unthinkable, a couple decades ago impossible and a couple generations ago he'd have been a Slave.

It is now unseemly to say the word "Nigger". Or to call a black man "Boy". We do not need to outlaw the words - people of their own accord cringe, frown and look disgusted when they hear someone speak like this. EVEN if it were their Preacher. Their revulsion itself is enough to temper and modify their behavior of the Bigot. Of course with media and education we can almost completely nullify racial bigotry. Not completely and that may mean it's a predisposition arsing from our tribal past (or not) - but, things are getting better that's for sure.

No one speaks as if they "Own" their wife. If they did they'd be seen as a neanderthal thug. etc...


Was Zoroastrianism actually made illegal in Persia? I don't think it was??? BUT, the social pressure to convert to Islam produced an Islamic Iran today.

Is being a bigot turd illegal? I don't think it is? BUT, social pressure not to be one is producing a more racially tolerant society today and more so in the future.

I see you're still confusing religious belief with other ideologies. But just for the sake of argument, I am going to treat atheists like turds and see how that pans out.

Meanwhile now niggers call each other niggers. And Zorastrianism which did not die out with Islam [it just moved house] is now dying out not because people don't believe in god, but its embarassing when you can't attend your own kid's thread ceremony because you're not a full blood Zorastrian and hence banned from the temple [which perversely, your kid can go to].

Consanguineous religions fall out of favor because people take the more liberal approach when choices are available, perhaps in Persia, they could see the benefits of a religious belief where your blood line did not determine your place in society and who you were allowed to marry. The inbreeders ran around for 2000 years saving what they could of their pure bloodline, but, not surprisingly, as you said, racism has a short lifetime and they are finally breaking up their elite corps.

The Jews have been trying to save what they can of their ethnocentric religion, but if you send an American Jew to Jerusalem, he would be repulsed by the notion that women cannot walk on the same side of the street [even though the top Jewish leaders in the US are all Zionists, Jews themselves have abandoned the notion that you have to be born of a Jewish mother to qualify for their cadre]. So thats another narrow minded religion that is losing its relevance as its followers fall out one by one. So its no surprise that in places where these religions reigned, people overwhelmingly voted for Islam.

So, as you see I agree with the movement of society away from racism. However, if you are saying that theism is racism then you are surely deluded. The position of Islam per se on treatment of unbelievers is one of tolerance [see Surah al Kafiroon]. So yes, unbelievers should be free to lack belief. Thats not bigotry, thats pragmatism.

 

[Zephyr]

i didn't say, i posted a link to a news article sharing that the judiastic synagogues declared war on Germany years before ww2 started any type of isolating of people.

Wrong, the article was about a handful of Jews in Britain calling for a boycott of the Nazis the day after Hitler was made dictator of Germany. One British tabloid called it a "declaration of war" because tabloids know that sensational titles sell better.

Why shouldn't someone be allowed to call for a boycott against a racist dictator? Hitler had openly announced his hatred of Jews for years prior to 1933, and repeatedly called for a "Jew free" Germany in his speeches. Your claim that his hatred was 'caused' by a 1933 call for a boycott, after years of racist speeches and his seizing dictatorial power, reveals your complete ignorance of history.

no, but at least WE ALL CAN SEE, it was not random hate like many have been lead to believe.

Bigots will always find (poor) excuses for bigotry.

 

[earth]

I am going to treat atheists like turds and see how that pans out.

It pans out as a turd buster,

 

[S.A.M.]

Piece be with you?

 

[earth]

Piece be with you?

I'll pass it along to Turd Ferguson,

 

[iceaura]

The position of Islam per se on treatment of unbelievers is one of tolerance [see Surah al Kafiroon]. So yes, unbelievers should be free to lack belief. Thats not bigotry, thats pragmatism.

That is not the position of the Islam we have to deal with. Ideal Islam is no doubt a fascinating topic, but actual Islam is more directly relevant here.

 

[S.A.M.]

That is not the position of the Islam we have to deal with. Ideal Islam is no doubt a fascinating topic, but actual Islam is more directly relevant here.

Thats not a problem with Islam, thats a problem with human nature [see actual democracy, actual socialism, actual secular humanism, etc]

 

[iceaura]

Thats not a problem with Islam, thats a problem with human nature [see actual democracy, actual socialism, actual secular humanism, etc]

?

Those are all problems with socialism, democracy, etc.

And likewise, problems with Islam.

Human nature is a given.

 

[S.A.M.]

I disagree. For example, you have people moving from Brooklyn, New York to this:

Jerusalem - A group of ultra-Orthodox men took to the streets of the haredi neighborhoods in Jerusalem and called on the public to adhere to a complete separation between men and women in certain areas of the city.

El Al to launch kosher flights for haredim

Ultra-Orthodox reps ask airline to operate special flights that would include separation between men and women, male flight attendants and no movies

Intel will not employ Jewish workers on Saturday shifts in its Jerusalem plant, the chip-maker has suggested in a new compromise proposal. The move comes after large crowds of ultra-Orthodox protesters attacked the plant on Saturday, in protest of it continuing operations on Shabbat. The plant, in the Har Hotzvim industrial area in Jerusalem, employs some 150 workers.

Thats human nature. This is what is sneered at in NY. So they simply go underground then resurface. Where its alright to express their views.

And the "assimilated" Jews that Michael referred to are right there behind them:

An influential Jewish community leader and Democratic State Assemblyman from New York is currently heading a mission of about 50 Americans through the West Bank and East Jerusalem to promote home purchases in the area and to protest U.S. President Barack Obama's Middle East policy.

"Our goal is to send a clear message to Washington and President Obama that Jews will continue to live in Judea and Samaria and the ultimate commitment American Jews can make is to actually come and buy property in these areas as this will ensure these communities" security and growth," said Dov Hikind, 59, who has been representing Brooklyn's 48th district since 1983

So yeah, its human nature

 

[Michael]

I see you're still confusing religious belief with other ideologies.

No, I'm comparing one intolerant irrational ideology with another intolerant irrational ideology.

What's not to get?

Originally Posted by SAM
The position of Islam per se on treatment of unbelievers is one of tolerance [see Surah al Kafiroon].

Unless they happen to fellow Arab and want to be polytheists. Then it's Kill kilL kiLL kILL KILL KILL KILL KILL! Remember SAM?
*But thems were polytheists*... Ooo how the song changes again and again post hoc rational to attempt to apologize this intolerant ideology into some palatable.

Well, someone has to so it may as well be you!

 

[GeoffP]

it is what the thread is about. (sorry troll, i thought you knew that)

Then you should have no problem with its expression, Bishie.

what? that is exactly what you are doing, combining a belief with politics (geeze; you need more help than i thought)

I didn't expect you'd actually understand the point, but que sera sera.

it meant, i don't believe you asked her, that you were answering for her; or that you are her (not sure which hand; but i bet its a 50/50 chance)

Your three chances add up to 150%. Where have you attained such math expertise?

 

[Bishadi]

Wrong, the article was about a handful of Jews in Britain calling for a boycott of the Nazis the day after Hitler was made dictator of Germany. One British tabloid called it a "declaration of war" because tabloids know that sensational titles sell better.

good to see you read

point made: both sides share discontent prior to war (equality is set)

Why shouldn't someone be allowed to call for a boycott against a racist dictator?

Sounds like the new slogan i keep reading "boycott israel"

Hitler had openly announced his hatred of Jews for years prior to 1933, and repeatedly called for a "Jew free" Germany in his speeches.

same with Netanyahu claiming (no loyalty, no citizenship) during his campaign

Your claim that his hatred was 'caused' by a 1933 call for a boycott, after years of racist speeches and his seizing dictatorial power, reveals your complete ignorance of history.

i am living in history, while you are reading opinions

i can see what is happening right now

Bigots will always find (poor) excuses for bigotry.

like suggesting what happened years ago substantiates what is happening right now on this earth

 

[iceaura]

Thats human nature. This is what is sneered at in NY. So they simply go underground then resurface. Where its alright to express their views

It is not "human nature" to refuse to fly in an airplane with women, or flip a light switch on Saturday. That is Orthodox Jewish custom, and most humans are not Orthodox Jews.

And them being "underground" ( a strange way to describe being tolerant or courteous enough to be overlooked in small numbers, and in turn being tolerated and treated with courtesy), rather than overtly dominating and enforcing the cultural milieu in which others must make their way, would be better for the rest of us, yes?

 

[S.A.M.]

It is not "human nature" to refuse to fly in an airplane with women, or flip a light switch on Saturday. That is Orthodox Jewish custom, and most humans are not Orthodox Jews.

And them being "underground" ( a strange way to describe being tolerant or courteous enough to be overlooked in small numbers, and in turn being tolerated and treated with courtesy), rather than overtly dominating and enforcing the cultural milieu in which others must make their way, would be better for the rest of us, yes?

In other words, it is better for them to follow what we consider right, since we don't want to follow what they consider right.

 

[GeoffP]

I thought you just said that one ought to viciously suppress nasty custom.

 

[S.A.M.]

I thought you just said that one ought to viciously suppress nasty custom.

I also said that there are some which die natural deaths [and thats alright too]. Although I guess we have to make an exception for Jews. The orthodox never had gender segregated streets in Mumbai.

 

[GeoffP]

So when the custom is virulent and oppressive - as in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Egypt - what then?

 

[Bishadi]

So when the custom is virulent and oppressive - as in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Egypt - what then?

if you want to feel oppressed, walk thru Compton at night

in any country, you can experience oppression

but when contries themselves oppress people with arms in a war like nature, then a holocaust can exist, right before your eyes

and some don't even know it

 

[GeoffP]

I'm talking about the propagation of society-wide legal oppression.

 

[Bishadi]

I'm talking about the propagation of society-wide legal oppression.

like the thread title ensues?

kind of sick isn't it?

here we are over here on this side of the lake, and propaganda is what 'we the people' are reading, rather than comprehending the issues involved; like OPPRESSION of a body of people based on ignorance.

funny how bad the ignorance is, eh?