Having fired salvo after salvo of triggered responses, the cultist will firmly place hands over eyes and ears when the triggered responses have failed to serve their intended purpose.
Why isn't faith embarrasing?
- Thread starter superluminal
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Having fired salvo after salvo of triggered responses, the cultist will firmly place hands over eyes and ears when the triggered responses have failed to serve their intended purpose.
So completely attached to the tenets of their cult and not able to accept any other worldview not governed by these tenets, the indoctrinated cultist cannot possibly accept a society completely void of such tenets would not exist, let alone accepting the fact it already does.
Further, the cultist would never accept such a society devoid of cult thinking, once established, would eventually become the norm once it was clearly understood the vicious and abusive cycle of indoctrination is acknowledged for what it is.
I rejected Christianity at the age of 17 because I came to regard it as nonsense.
It's a common myth that without religion there is no morality. My children were brought up without any form odf indoctriation without turning into monsters.
Here in the UK only about 2% of the population take any interest in religion. Do you honestly think that the other 98 % do not know right from wrong ? Morality is simply a mechanism for maintaining cohesion among a population or group. If you are nice to me , I'll be nice to you. Belief in a god is unnecessary to bring this about.
Indeed, even chimps or ants don't go around beating each other to death for the mere sake of it. It's not likely that chimps gain their "morality" from belief in large hairy gods. So why do we have morality?
The answer comes in the form of selfishness. You are inherently selfish, and must be for the sake of survival.
Let's look at an example:
Caveman Bob is sitting in a cave with several other cavemen. The caveman to his left, Rob, is the best person Bob has ever seen at starting fires. Without Rob it is likely that Bob will die of cold. The person to Bob's right is the best hunter Bob has ever seen. It is likely that if Bob kills him for no good reason that Bob will starve to death. Across from Bob is a cavewoman. She can provide for Bob in many many ways. Pleasure, offspring etc etc. If Bob killed her for no good reason he wouldn't have much enjoyment and no offspring.
Hence Bob does not kill these people for no reason.
Behind the cavewoman is Cob. Cob is looking at the cavewoman in a manner that angers Bob. Bob kills the threat.
That is how it is. Everything you do is done for selfish reasons. Now, I know there will be someone here that will ask:
"What about that guy on TV that jumped in the lake to save the drowning woman? Surely that is not selfish, he is indeed risking his own life for a woman he doesn't even know?"
The answer comes in the form of feeling. When this person is interviewed they generally say something along the lines of: "I couldn't live with myself if I let her drown". The selfishness remains. I for instance could not let a child drown. I simply could not live with myself - the risk is worth it for my own sanity and wellbeing.
It is why I generally chuckle when I hear the words "stop being selfish", when the only reason the person is saying that is because you're pissing them off - selfishness at its finest.
Without inherent selfishness we wouldn't be here. Whether that ultimately evolution or gods doing is another argument altogether. But from a religious perspective, I doubt a god wants us to obey, serve and worship it for our own enjoyment. Seems selfishness runs in the family.
So when chimps kill infants for sexual acess to their mother, they are exhibiting morality?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?db=pubmed&uid=12426461&cmd=showdetailview&indexed=google
Female chimp infanticide
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18661491/
When they form gangs to hunt other chimps this is an indication of altruism?
As for ants:
http://www.goshen.edu/bio/Biol410/bsspapers05/Kat.html
No more or less so than the man that kills his infants because he doesn't want to pay child benefit:
http://trishwilson.typepad.com/blog/2005/02/father_kills_3_.html
None of this is of course really relevant to what was said.
No, as it isn't when the kkk form gangs to hunt black folk.
Competition. Your survival is put at risk by those around you. It is really quite difficult when there are others competing for the same thing, (take oil for example).
Given that article it should be stressed that humans are also quite renowned for their conquest and genocide of neighbouring human colonies. Of course humans do have nuclear weapons, but to use them doesn't do yourself any favours.
Correct, without the restraining force of religion, human beings would never have overcome their innate tendencies to tribalism and violence.
Removing the restraint of religion has shown how easily men return to violence, tribalism and genocide.
Just read the comments that educated rational atheists on this forum make while generalising about all theists. No differences between nuts at either extreme.
(Q) would probably run re-education camps like Stalin or Mao given the chance. And consider it nothing but a logical choice, as they probably did.
From a dictionary. The bible is not a dictionary.
Atheists are opressive? We are oppressing people in the name of atheism? Please expound on this.Of course it is, since you are content to ignore the oppression that drives it.
They haven't even with it - in fact I think its quite prevalent to state that religion has made it all the more tribalistic and violent. Tribal, (he doesn't believe exactly what I believe, he's not part of my tribe, death to the infidel). Violent: Well, need we really go into it?
What religion does is merely provide an excuse to continue to be human. It's not good enough to just be human lest feelings get in the way. Religion simply does away with feeling. It allows guilt free slaughter.
Actually no, it is quite the opposite. People will still be people regardless to gods or religions or tribes. What religion does is instantly make everyone outside of it a viable target with no guilt attached. It is not on your head to kill these folk, an invisible powerful entity commanded that you do so... who are you to disobey? Kill them all!
Shall we have a statistics battle? £1000 says I win.
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Actually it is generally quite calm. That's not to say that an individual, (any of us), can't get heated or angry or say thing that perhaps aren't what we really should have or meant to say. Humans are humans, theists don't seem to grasp that fact.
But lets be frank.. those theists that go to lengths to try and indocrtinate others, to push that 'faith' on others are typically thick as shit. Look at Sandy. Look at Woody. Look at Adstar.. (etc). What you have is a man that adopts certain principles in life, principles that are shown to have value and merit. Then along comes someone else with their own principles that are ultimately not worth their weight in kilobytes. It will not always be plain sailing. "but god is my daddy, he loves me very much and I love him. We sing together at night and he tucks me in and kisses me sweetly before telling me that he will ensure atheists burn for eternity".
Would you honestly sit by and put up with such shit?
Q, who seems like a nice chap, might very well be a communist. Back in the day, dependant upon location, he'd be in big shit if he was. However Sam, you need to understand and recognise that communism is not atheism. Atheism does not lead to communism. That you might have an atheist that is a communist is like saying you'll have an atheist that is a tennis player and then accusing all atheists of being tennis players.
Excuse me for the language but it's fucking stupid.
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Sure! But the ones I read (horrible scientific ones) clearly traced the excellent contributions to science and reason across the globe. Arabic, chinese, european, etc...What, no history? no books?
/no movies? no television?
You really did miss out on a balanced education. Kind of explains some things, huh?
*************
M*W: Sadly, I was much older when I found the Truth... I was in my forties. It took me that long to learn that xianity was a farce. A big joke. Unfortunately, my two eldest children still believe in that fake god I taught them about, but my two younger daughters don't... thank god (if there was one). And, yes, we have a great relationship. The understand me, and they follow my direction!
My two youngest daughters don't force religion on their combined three children. So, I am hopeful that my younger grandchildren will be exposed to the truth. I don't expect it to be immediate. It wasn't immediate for me. I'm already exposing them to www.sciforums.com. This will educate them, hopefully. It surely educated me.
If anyone who posts here can claim that xianity exists in whatever form... go for it, please. If you are xian, you are a liar, and you are delusional. Speak your peace. There is no escape from stupidity.
Happy New Year to all you Atheists! I Know We Will Have a Great Year to Come!
And a big blankfor whatever you xians may believe. Not gonna happen, I'm afraid.
There is no god. There is no savior. There is no virgin birth, and there is no alternative to this. If you believe in the above, think again, my friend. There is no hope in the future for xians... Those of you who believe there is, should rethink your position. To all of you who believe... Happy New Year to You Who Has Absolutely No god Whatsoever to Rely On... And to you, who believe the truth, Happy New Year to those who believe the Truth... and That Truth Is There is No god.
Sincerely looking for the Truth,
M*W
Let me guess, your subsection of society does not contribute in any way to the global arms trade or structural adjustment policies or miltaristic hegemony your lifestyle requires. No atheists fighting in Iraq, I presume. Or bombing Red Cross hospitals in Sudan. Or working for CIA; or taking videos in Abu Ghraib.
Ah so you learned about Mohammed ibn-Musa al-Khowarizmi and Hsuan Tsang?
What do you think of Ibn-Batuta? Al-Maoudi?
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I disagree. I think the reason that we do not have a Maoist or Stalinist society all over the world, redesigning perfect humans in a perfect society using cold logic is because of religion.
I disagree. Most religious people I know (and I'm not talking about the ones who abuse religion for power) are charitable folks who prefer to run educational and aid organisations.
Actually that is what western secularism does; it mocks differences and insists on conformity. Everything must be standardised to a monoculture.
You can try. I'll just put in the known atheists in power.
Does that extend to discrimination against those who do not follow our ideologies?
Is that what your parent did?
Are there religious communists?
I've heard a lot worse. If you cannot control yourself, that is your problem, not mine.
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The tenets of the cult must remain consistent in order for the cult to be successful and for the cycle of indoctrination to continue . Any moves towards new ideas that might spawn civilization would result in inconsistencies, hence tribalism must be maintained at all times and at all costs.
Incoming salvos. Red Herring rain.
Huh? I seriously have no fucking idea how the normal behavior of humans regardless of their belief status has anything to do with this. In all of my jobs (even the DOD ones) I've only known two or three atheists. The rest were xians, muslims, and jews. Actually, there was one guy who said he wa a buddhist. He didn't act like one though.
Anyway. WTF?
Hey! It just dawned on me why I feel so comfortable with sam's type of argumentation!
It's my kids! My daughters! Every time we have to say something to one of them (about the phone bill or whatever) it always turns into how bad the other sisters are at this or that. Deflector shields on FULL!
Wouldn't want to directly address a question or statement, would we?
It's my kids! My daughters! Every time we have to say something to one of them (about the phone bill or whatever) it always turns into how bad the other sisters are at this or that. Deflector shields on FULL!
Wouldn't want to directly address a question or statement, would we?