Whose God Is Responsible????

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Big Chiller said:
Why not? I said I could explain God not describe Him by making references.
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ah, i can describe god, we have 99 description words for god in islam, but, not physical descriptions, for example "the mecyfull, the great, ...."
but yeah i know what you mean.
 
Could a person not create the universe, would it matter if we could all "create our own universe" would we then still not come to a better understanding of my argument? You could get "god" to come to you(= Crazy Idea lets make a universe. Alright what materials do we have to prove this god?
 
but, wy do you think god is responsible for the wars WE make, for the pople WE kill.?? god gave us the freewill, so, god don't controll us, we design our world
 
Shadow1 said:
but, wy do you think god is responsible for the wars WE make, for the pople WE kill.?? god gave us the freewill, so, god don't controll us, we design our world
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How can humans behave other than how they was designed to behave.???
 
Shadow1 said:
but, wy do you think god is responsible for the wars WE make, for the pople WE kill.?? god gave us the freewill, so, god don't controll us, we design our world
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God and freewill are incompatible concepts!

God is omnipotent/omniscience so he/she/it knows (actually plans) our decisions prior to our creation. Otherwise he is not God (not omnipotent/omniscience). So the idea of freewill and gods existence are logically inconsistent.

KRR
 
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cluelusshusbund said:
How can humans behave other than how they was designed to behave.???
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we are designed to choose, to do good, or bad, to beleive in god, or not, and do anything, and then, and then, there's the judgement.
how do you think we are designed to behave? and for what?
 
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krreagan said:
God and freewill are incompatible concepts!

God is omnipotent/omniscience so he/she/it knows (actually plans) our decisions prior to our creation. Otherwise he is not God (not omnipotent/omniscience). So the idea of freewill and gods existence are logically inconsistent.

KRR
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well, no, not really, in my relegion, god, created for us, the freewill, that's why we can be better than angels, if we choose to do the good, we are free to do good or bad, i mean, people are doing bad things, yet, i mean, they are doing bad things, and others doing good things, they are free, you do good or bad, you beleive in god or not, and then, after you maked everything you want, and at the judgement day, god judge us all, by individuals, according to he's or her's decisions, acts, and etc... and why logically incosistent?
anyway, the freewill, you do have it, but, it's not exaclty free, you're attached to your society, and etc... you can live without wearing clothes, etc... but, yet you still free, you can go to street and run naked, you can do anything you want.
so, explain your point pleas?
 
Shadow1 said:
well, no, not really, in my relegion, god, created for us, the freewill, that's why we can be better than angels, if we choose to do the good, we are free to do good or bad, i mean, people are doing bad things, yet, i mean, they are doing bad things, and others doing good things, they are free, you do good or bad, you beleive in god or not, and then, after you maked everything you want, and at the judgement day, god judge us all, by individuals, according to he's or her's decisions, acts, and etc... and why logically incosistent?
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Because your god as you envision it (If you are Christian) is all powerful and all knowing. Therefore he/she/it cannot create a universe that he/she/it does not know everything about to an infinite detail including all of our decisions. This of course makes god more complicated then the universe itself, but that is another discussion.

Shadow1 said:
anyway, the freewill, you do have it, but, it's not exaclty free, you're attached to your society, and etc... you can live without wearing clothes, etc... but, yet you still free, you can go to street and run naked, you can do anything you want.
so, explain your point pleas?
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We are all simply the products of our environment. First evolution created our biology. Then we are influenced by our environment. There is no god or spirits or anything supernatural about us or our universe or anything else.

Freewill is simply a response to the idea that god is responsible for creating us and therefore how can he/she/it punish us, by sending us to hell, for what we do when he/she/it created us this way in the first place.

So the idea of god and freewill are logically incompatible.

You may believe what you want, but it is just that, a belief, a hope, there is nothing to support the existance of anything supernatural.

KRR
 
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krreagan said:
Because your god as you envision it (If you are Christian) is all powerful and all knowing. Therefore he/she/it cannot create a universe that he/she/it does not know everything about to an infinite detail including all of our decisions. This of course makes god more complicated then the universe itself, but that is another discussion.



We are all simply the products of our environment. First evolution created our biology. Then we are influenced by our environment. There is no god or spirits or anything supernatural about us or our universe or anything else.

Freewill is simply a response to the idea that god is responsible for creating us and therefore how can he/she/it punish us, by sending us to hell, for what we do when he/she/it created us this way in the first place.

So the idea of god and freewill are logically incompatible.

You may believe what you want, but it is just that, a belief, a hope, there is nothing to support the existance of anything supernatural.

KRR
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so, you can just say it, you're atheist :p hehehe, why would i bother? :D
still you're arguments are pretty much weak, some atheists have good arguments, wich are many times, opposite to each other each time according to the situation, but, you're arguments aren't good, :p
 
also, i don't beleive in god, as physical, or, as human, or have a son. i did explain before, go back to myprevious posts :)
 
Shadow1 said:
so, you can just say it, you're atheist :p hehehe, why would i bother? :D
still you're arguments are pretty much weak, some atheists have good arguments, wich are many times, opposite to each other each time according to the situation, but, you're arguments aren't good, :p
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If you don't believe, that is good! and as you might have inferred... I don't either.

My argument is the best that you can have! As has been said, you cannot prove a negative so a logical argument is the best it can get. It's logically complete and shows the invalidity of god as envisioned. I cannot think of a stronger argument against the existance of a god.

If you feel it is not a strong argument...

1) show me a stronger argument.
2) pick mine apart piece by piece... please.

KRR
 
Originally Posted by cluelusshusbund
How can humans behave other than how they was designed to behave.???

Shadow1 said:
how do you think we are designed to behave? and for what?
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Assumin we was designed by a God... i thank this God designed humans to behave esactly the way humans do behave... an acordin to the mor popular God beleifs... mos people behave in such a way that ther eternity will be spent in hell.!!!

Jus so i will have an idea of you'r perspective... what is you'r religion.???
 
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cluelusshusbund said:
Originally Posted by cluelusshusbund
How can humans behave other than how they was designed to behave.???



Assumin we was designed by a God... i thank this God designed humans to behave esactly the way humans do behave... an acordin to the mor popular God beleifs... mos people behave in such a way that ther eternity will be spent in hell.!!!

Jus so i will have an idea of you'r perspective... what is you'r religion.???
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we humans, still have the animal part, the non smart part, the part that can't controll it's, desires, but god also gave us a mind, (not saying a brain), a mind, high intelligence, with a high concious, as i said, we are free to behave as we want, now if you're talking about human behaviours, well, that's very complicated than you think, first, we have to go back the biologic side, and the lizard brain that we have, and the animal instincts that we have, then, the envirements and groups of humans over the human existence, the society, and everything, it needs a new thread, we are not designed to behave in a specific way, but we GET designed by each other, to behave in a such way, and we are free to behave as we want, you want to go run naked in the street? you can, but, can you? you can do it, but, socially, and in your society, will you do it?
 
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krreagan said:
If you don't believe, that is good! and as you might have inferred... I don't either.

My argument is the best that you can have! As has been said, you cannot prove a negative so a logical argument is the best it can get. It's logically complete and shows the invalidity of god as envisioned. I cannot think of a stronger argument against the existance of a god.

If you feel it is not a strong argument...

1) show me a stronger argument.
2) pick mine apart piece by piece... please.

KRR
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no i'm a beleiver, but i said i saw stronger arguments, ye your arguments are very weak :p :) that's all
 
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cluelusshusbund said:
Do you thank God gave everbody an euqal amount of free will.???
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yes, but again, the society, always make boundaries for the human behvaiours, also the environement(for example it's very cold, you don't want to wear clothes, but you'll have to).
anyway, what's your definition of the freewill, because you asked the same question more than once.?
 
Originally Posted by cluelusshusbund
Do you thank God gave everbody an euqal amount of free will.???

Shadow1 said:
yes, but again, the society, always maked some boundaries, also the envirement.
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So does everbody have an equal opportunity to make it to heaven.???

what's your definition of the freewill...
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Uninfluenced choises.!!!
 
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