What has to Happen to end Religion?

When religion is blamed as the cause of violences, is only partly true; ending religion will not cause the end of violence. Take for example the case of US christian right. THEY USE RELIGION for fullfilling desire of power. I think the problem is not fully lied in religion, but most likely in "THEY". As long as there is "THEY" who have desire of controlling power, THEY would use anything. This time they use religion, next time they will use "any reliable tools". Orderly society; always has 2 sides; ordering power is required to avoid anarchy, on the other side, there will always be game of gaining power to excercise the so called "orderly society".

What you have to end is not religion, it is the 'evils' in human: greed, misuse of power, corruption, unjust behaviour, etc. Ending religion, doesn't end those 'evils'.

Religions, in fact, on the other side of what you keep pointing, teach people to counter against those 'evils'. People who excercise 'evil behaviours', most likely don't follow their religion teachings.
 
Cris,

of the Greek and Roman gods. Why is your fantasy claim any different?
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No one claimed Greek and Roman gods were walking with men during the office of Pontius Pilate.

According to Q research the very early texts about Jesus didn’t have any miracle stories so they were deliberately invented and written into the mythology around 50CE as the concept of this hero being a god was being developed. In those ancient times the primary distinction between a mere man and a god was that one of them could perform miracles. This was clearly a need that that those mythmakers would understand.
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TRASH SCHOLARSHIP. The cart is placed before the horse. There is no way to prove that that was how it was done. Jesus is often called the son of man, but he still then preforms miracles. The theology trumps the intrusion of mythographers: Jesus' main point was that he is both man and God. Empty-minded scholars need to justify their university chairs somehow.
 
Cris said:
Lawdog,

Why would a perfect omniscient god create a scenario where his creations needed to be saved. Sounds like he made a mistake and hence he can't be perfect, and hence he can't exist, right?
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God gave man the ability to choose his own destiny. Man chose Sin...but you know all that already I think.
 
Atheism and the end of religion

hello.. new member here.

The discussion of ending religion seems to be approaching derision and defensiveness of one another's opinion.
Neither side will accomplish much progress as long as each derides the other;
or defends their own.
Atheism needs no defense. It is not even an argument 'against' religion. It is an observation about religion's existence and role in the world today. So spare each other the grief of argument whether God exits or not. Several generations of men and women have been arguing this point since before written history. The argument comes out of our species process of becoming aware of ourselves and our universe. There have been many many religions; before Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddahism, etc. Those early religions were precursors to the ones I mentioned above. They were on a track to organize their thoughts about themselves and make a life effort to understand why life and death even exist. We are contantly searching for that understanding, while we fight with each other and kill each other about what we think and learn.
Take the 21st century as an example; climate change, famine, war and pestilence have taken center stage... All of us, regardless of religious or non-religious perspectives are asking ourselves "What will be the outcome?"
We can't get over ourselves long enough to think and act together... even if it means that we won't live to see the results of our efforts.
What if scientists have discovered that when we die, our energy (soul) travels to another dimension or another universe and starts life again? Possible? Maybe. Our understanding of our universe is growing... but at a rate we can't seem to accept.
I've read books by the real Erich Fromm, that discussed such things; "Psychoanalysis and Religion", "To Have or To Be?", "The Revolution of Hope", etc. These thoughts, along with the writings of D.M. Murdock (Acharya S.)
have inspired me to think of things that I will never live to realize. But I think of them anyway..because that's what hope really is to me. Theism or Atheism
discussions will continue past my lifetime. I hope that we can advance in our awareness of our existence enough to end those discussions because they become moot.
John Lennon said: "You may say that I'm a dreamer, well I'm not the only one"
George Harrison's 'Brainwashed':
The Soul does not exist... it is Existence itself
It does not love... it is Love itself
It does not know... it is Knowledge itself. How to know God, page 130"

Eric
 
I think that atheism spun off from the need to be different, and rebellious to common ways. Once doubting people hear about many science definitions, they blindly believe in those, instead. Why do those make any more sense then my (theists in general)'s beliefs? I see atheists telling theists a lot that they are foolish and are complete idiots in believing in something that's OBVIOUSLY not there. If there is no proof to back up god, but no proof to disprove his existance then why does that make him not real? If there's no solid evidence either way, that means you can choose for yourself.
 
PsychoticEpisode said:
Even a religious person has to admit that religions do end. History has proven that. Why don't you think religion will someday be gone forever?.
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Because religion is not just a temporary thing to help us adapt to our environment. Rather it is a permanent and central aspect of the human condition. This is a bitter pill for secular nonreligious people to swallow. Everyone wants to think that they are in the mainstream, that they are not extremists. But robust religious beliefs dominate the world. There is no reason to expect that to change. Secularism is growing, but so is Christianity. For example, Africa has gone from 9% to 55% Christian in the last 100 years. Korea has gone from 1% to 40% in the last 100 years. With both Christianity and Secularism on the rise, we're living in a much more polarized society.

Because of the vitality of religious faith in the world, efforts to suppress or control it often serve only to make is stronger. When the Chinese Communists expelled Western missionaries after World War II, they thought they were killing of Christianity in China. Instead, this move only served to make the leadership of the Chinese church more indigenous and therefore to strengthen it.

PsychoticEpisode said:
How long can an progressively intelligent population believe in something so ancient? Gods of thunder, gods of fertility, gods of the sea, gods for just about anything ..... science has pretty much caused their demise. All that's left is your god, reduced from a regular frequenter of the Earth to a mysterious being existing on a plane of existence that we can't comprehend except those who hope He's there. God is on the way out, his stature diminishing daily. Stick a fork in Him, He's done.
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Take the Anglo-Saxons. We think of them as primitive, but someday others will think of us and our culture's dominant views as primitive. How can we use our time's standard of "progressive? as the plumbline by which we decide which parts of religion are valid and which are not? Many of the beliefs of our grandparents and great-grandparents now seem silly and even embarrassing to us. That process is not going to stop now. Our grandchildren will find many of our views outmoded as well. Wouldn't it be tragic if we threw the Bible away over a belief that will soon look pretty weak or wrong? To stray away from Christianity because part of the Bible's teaching is offensive to you assumes that if there is a God he wouldn't have any views that upset you. Does that belief make sense?
 
ggazoo said:
For example, Africa has gone from 9% to 55% Christian in the last 100 years. Korea has gone from 1% to 40% in the last 100 years.
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They weren't all atheists. Some religions ended or became one step closer to extinction. The frailty of a religion is evident, if your not doing well and a person of another faith is, then it is only natural to ......
 
Eric Fromm said:
...Neither side will accomplish much progress as long as each derides the other;
or defends their own...
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I agree. As long as the standard response to "I believe X" is "Well, you only believe X because you're an idiot." these discussions on matters of faith aren't really going to accomplish all that much.
 
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OP you're incorrect. Religion is just another aspect of Human nature, it won't ever end. It is also a very valuable tool to both the individual and to society as a whole.

The biggest shame is: if you end religion, you're ending so much of culture and tradition. So much history. You're ending an entire aspect of Humanity.

Besides, I have no doubt abrahamic religions will die eventually. But more will sprout. And why not let them? Sometimes, having faith is good. Better than living a life of nihilism, despair, and pessimism.
 
Norsefire said:
OP you're incorrect. Religion is just another aspect of Human nature, it won't ever end. It is also a very valuable tool to both the individual and to society as a whole.
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Give the human race some credit. Get tired of hearing from those who think we're inherently evil and can't exist without God. It happens every day, people who don't need religion do just fine without it. You may be right, it might not ever end but it can weaken.
 
Well, I'm atheistic but I don't want religions to end. I think they serve a good social function depending on the occasion. Think of weddings or funerals. Think of holidays. Think of the wonderful temples. Think of the traditions.

There is a problem with religions who have an underlying supposition that if everyone believed their beleif then the world would be a happier place - which is simply wrong. Those religions that teach if you don't believe in their beleif then you will burn in hell are IMO detrimental in a global non-uniform world. Those religions that teach their religions is the end all and be all of beleif are also detrimental in a global multi-beleif world. Those religions that teach each to their own and there are multiple paths to a similar end are probably pretty good in this world.

I personally think fundamental monotheism can fall into the detrimental camp but the liberal brand seems to do OK.
 
Mass lobotomy should do it. Or communism. Thats a tried and tested method and lasts at least for 50 years.
 
Michael more or less stated my argument.

Religion plays a valuable social role.

Psychotic, what you want to end is fundamentalism. Not religion.
 
KennyJC said:
You mean decline?

I've still to get around to posting that survey on levels of atheism and corelation with better social health.
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It depends on how you measure health. The establishments of religion are one of the prime reasons why I view it as valuable. It establishes morality, tradition, and conformity.
 
Norsefire said:
It depends on how you measure health.
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Crime rates, poverty, education, war. etc.

In reality, the most secular countries-those with the highest proportion of atheists and agnostics-are among the most stable, peaceful, free, wealthy, and healthy societies. And the most religious nations-wherein worship of God is in abundance-are among the most unstable, violent, oppressive, poor, and destitute.

http://www.secularhumanism.org/index.php?section=library&page=pzuckerman_26_5

The establishments of religion are one of the prime reasons why I view it as valuable. It establishes morality, tradition, and conformity.
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Clearly, you over-rate the importance of religion.
 
It takes a miracle to get people to believe in god and it will take one to stop them doing so.
 
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