Very New and need to know.

[shaman_]

me::::nly wish your beloved materialistic PRODUCTS would degrade....sheeeesh. ....but actually this discussion is magnificent. when reading Gustav's handling of the 'real sceptic' Skin...i culd cut it out and frame it...THAT good! makes you glaaaaad to be Ah-LIVE!!!!

We are well aware of your admiration for gustav duendy, although that seems a little over the top.

Skinwalker left because he got sick of the rubbish that gustav was posting. Clearly you take that as some sort of victory. Sounds a bit desperate to me..

me:::no love. yer missin the point. we are not saying mistakes cant be made. w are exposin the slavering fundamentalism of te materialistic tremple which is PSYCOP. shit...dont the very choice of name give you crusty untuition juices some give?

No you are missing the point. Did you ignore the analogy I was trying to explain or did you not understand it? You have not 'exposed' anything.

The acronym is csicop not psycop. Do you understand that it is an acronym and has nothing to do with cops?

me::but i actually do see you that way. maybe you dnt see yu like i see you. this is a prob or many people who have images of themselves

Yes yes my fragile little brain couldn't handle living in a world where psychic powers exist...

I have not ruled out psychic ability I have just yet to see any compelling evidence for its existence. What I am seeing is a religious like belief that it exists even though no one is able to prove it with any reliability.

me:::::you DO seem to use them as a reference Bible. who else do you use, as a matter of interest?

I posted one link to a csicop article because it was very relevant to the discussion. This was regarding the ufo sightings in mexico last year.

Does that make it my reference bible? Don't talk nonsense.

no, fanatical materialists. more to say bout tis beeeeelow

As I am typing this I see you are using Victor Zammit as a reference now. oh please. Thats it im off to bed.

 

[duendy]

We are well aware of your admiration for gustav duendy, although that seems a little over the top.

me:::he gves good. your missin out. but then agin, yer on the wrong side aren't yo? whose fault is that...? hmmmmmm?

Skinwalker left because he got sick of the rubbish that gustav was posting. Clearly you take that as some sort of victory. Sounds a bit desperate to me..

me::::no, it is a thang that Victor Zammit (the author of the article i forewarded seemed to miss in his analysis of hows you materialists beHAVE...so let me fill the missing points. also yous tend to sulk when you meet your match. Gstav is very meticulous and minimaist (tho i dont wanna dictate his style) and cutting and like a rapier cuts througth BS masquearading as SCIENTIFIC endeavour...I a really dry funny way. love him/her...dont cur.......you have no sense of art video games dude


No you are missing the point. Did you ignore the analogy I was trying to explain or did you not understand it? You have not 'exposed' anything.

me::::you stand exposed. i can see your willy!

The acronym is csicop not psycop. Do you understand that it is an acronym and has nothing to do with cops?

me:::do you understand cryptic exposure....?????thought not!


Yes yes my fragile little brain couldn't handle living in a world where psychic powers exist...

me:::i know

I have not ruled out psychic ability I have just yet to see any compelling evidence for its existence. What I am seeing is a religious like belief that it exists even though no one is able to prove it with any reliability.

me:::no. yo are in denial. and what TIME do you HAVE to prperly look into the vast paranorml, abduction etc ewtc files etc. yer too bizy wid em video games....! i've seen them on them. they take u over.houres go...days go byyyyy


I posted one link to a csicop article because it was very relevant to the discussion. This was regarding the ufo sightings in mexico last year.

Does that make it my reference bible? You are talking nonsense.

me::::::see? you accuse ME of aviding questions . here you dodge me askin you: what other references besides PSY_COP do you use to debunk AL known pRANORMAL phenomena. simple question


As I am typing this I see you are using Victor Zammit as a reference now. oh please. Thats it im off to bed.

always runnin off to bed

 

[SkinWalker]

Don't worry, Shaman. I didnt' leave, I simply put Gustav on my ignore list. Looking at his posts in this and other threads, his goal isn't serious discussion, but rather juvenile banter and one-liners. That sort of endeavor is fine, I just prefer not to see it muck up a thread. The ignore list cleans that sort of thing up rather nicely. It is unfortunate, however, because Gustav started and participated in several threads that I had an interest in. I avoided them because of the interactions he had with other members and the trolling nature of his posts.

I didn't put him on ignore because I disagree... hardly. If that were so, I'd have placed duendy on ignore ages ago But I like duendy. Indeed, he offers his own, thought out opinions on many matters (even if I think he's wrong) and doesn't simply quote rhetoric or link posts.

The criticisms about CSICOP are fair. I read Skeptical Inquirer on a monthly basis (as well as Skeptic and a dozen or so science journals & magazines) and think they do a very good job. Indeed, there are those within CSICOP that occasionally disagree with each other. They've evolved into a very well-run organization and publication. I'd recommend looking at a few recent issues and their treatments of not only the supernatural and paranormal, but politics and the like as well. Their goal is to inspire critical thinking and questioning.

And, for the record, I don't disregard the possibility of psi, etc. I simply maintain that it hasn't been demonstrated. I also maintain that those that claim they have the ability but fail to show the evidence are liars.

 

[Gustav]

It seems csicop did not handle the evaluation of the Mars Effect research very well. This was nearly 30 years ago and csicop had only just been founded then.

lots of the ufo cases, investigations into them, the players, are similarly old.
whats the point? should we refrain from saying anything simply because of antiquity?

 

[Gustav]

Don't worry, Shaman. I didnt' leave, I simply put Gustav on my ignore list. Looking at his posts in this and other threads, his goal isn't serious discussion, but rather juvenile banter and one-liners.

i think you just wanna get away with your own useless rhetoric unchallenged and unquestioned

exactly what is useful about asserting csicops as the true faith?
it is nothing but a red herring intent on provocation
as usual. when you get the desired result, you go all limp
too bad but entirely expected
au revoir
enjoy your little dogmatic and safe little world

 

[Gustav]

Skinwalker left because he got sick of the rubbish that gustav was posting.

witness the vile ad homs as employed by skinwalker
you seem to have no problem with that

well i do
i retaliate
the shit is not one sided.

skinwalker iniated this debacle

Yet another woo-woo posts a link without discussion.

go on. look at the sequence and dates of posts

i retaliate
he strikes again..

What those who crave all-things-mysterious and find significance-in-any-spurious-correlation really hate about skeptics is that they ask questions that cause them to fall flat on their faces in the excrement of their own beliefs.

Without evidence to back their wild, speculative claims, they amount to nothing but liars. Harsh, but true. Instead of addressing the issue of evidence, they look for excuses to engage in ad hominem wars and toss insults back and forth. They also make unfounded attempts to level many of the same criticisms against skeptics that skeptics have long since leveled in their direction, such as the question of cult-like behavior and misguided beliefs.

now shaman

do you want to comment some more?
while i have absolutely no pretensions as to my shit
skinwalker obviously does
which is why it is absolutely retarted of him to go around this board slandering others

Woo-woo is also a pejorative, but one based in phonetics of the term. "Woo-woo" is the sound a train makes to get attention. So the term, "woo-woo" is an analogy to the attention-seeking mystery-mongers and significance-junkies.

i challenge anyone here to substantiate this bogus definition
poor gutless skinwalker
he knows he means crackpot
i do too

Skinwalker left because he got sick of the rubbish that gustav was posting.

can you not stand on your own two feet ?
challenge the rubbish
it is that simple

 

[Gustav]

Don't worry, Shaman. I didnt' leave, I simply put Gustav on my ignore list. Looking at his posts in this and other threads, his goal isn't serious discussion, but rather juvenile banter and one-liners. That sort of endeavor is fine, I just prefer not to see it muck up a thread.

well somebody better explain what all this is about
looks like vile personal attacks, ja?
serious discussion indeed
hypocrisy anyone?

*But if you are simply a cowardly, woo-woo or lying claimant of "special abilities," you can resort to just leaving undiscussed links and making pejorative comments

*Instead, the woo-woo crowd bitches and cries that his challenge is unfair.

*That's how science is done you silly git

*Where's the evidence? If you can't produce it, you are a liar if you make the claim

*Yet another woo-woo posts a link without discussion.

*Are you capable of actually extracting one or two of the key points at that woo-woo site which are worth discussing.

*include EVERY SINGLE WOO-WOO and then some.

*Instead, I'll refer to mystery-mongers and significance-junkies as mystery-mongers and significance-junkies, even though it is a lot more to type.

*So... does Gustav and the other woo-woos

*What those who crave all-things-mysterious and find significance-in-any-spurious-correlation really hate about skeptics is that they ask questions that cause them to fall flat on their faces in the excrement of their own beliefs.

*Without evidence to back their wild, speculative claims, they amount to nothing but liars

*Instead of addressing the issue of evidence, they look for excuses to engage in ad hominem wars and toss insults back and forth.

*Looking at his posts in this and other threads, his goal isn't serious discussion, but rather juvenile banter and one-liners

 

[shaman_]

me::::..so let me fill the missing points. also yous tend to sulk when you meet your match. Gstav is very meticulous and minimaist (tho i dont wanna dictate his style) and cutting and like a rapier cuts througth BS masquearading as SCIENTIFIC endeavour...I a really dry funny way. love him/her...dont cur.......you have no sense of art video games dude

Because I don't enjoy childish arguments about who insulted who first therefore I have no appreciaton of art? Yes that makes perfect sense.

Again duendy, I am well aware of your admiration for gustav. You have repeated yourself several times now. Congratulations you are the first member of the gustav fan club!

me::::you stand exposed. i can see your willy!

So you didn't understand the situation I was illustrating... Forget it.

me:::do you understand cryptic exposure....?????thought not!

Explain to me what cryptic exposure has to to with csicop. This should be interesting...

me:::no. yo are in denial. and what TIME do you HAVE to prperly look into the vast paranorml, abduction etc ewtc files etc. yer too bizy wid em video games....! i've seen them on them. they take u over.houres go...days go byyyyy

Oh no, now that you know my dark secret I can never win an argument against you

me::::::see? you accuse ME of aviding questions . here you dodge me askin you: what other references besides PSY_COP do you use to debunk AL known pRANORMAL phenomena. simple question

No I have never accused you of avoiding questions. I have prompted you to answer a question if you did not the first time. There is a difference.

Surely you are not are trying to paint me as a hypocrite... I assure you that not answering was an accident.

Which reminds me, you have not answered my question "Are you saying that Randi has rigged the tests?"

Now your question, "what other references besides PSY_COP do you use to debunk AL known pRANORMAL phenomena." Well this is a straw man as I do not debunk all known paranormal phenomena. I have only ever discussed psychics and ufos with you.

I assume what you are after are some links to evil materialist psuedosceptic sites.

http://skepdic.com/ is good.

 

[shaman_]

can you not stand on your own two feet ?
challenge the rubbish
it is that simple

Actually I can stand just fine.

The 'rubbish' that I was referring to were your posts regarding ad hominem and hypocrisy. I have no intention of challenging them as I find them to be immature and extremely boring. That is not why I visit sciforums. I assume skinwalker felt the same.

It looks to me like every person in this thread is name-calling...

I am not referring to your initial posts although they were somewhat arrogant, oh wait so are most of mine.

I am getting used to being called a materialist psuedosceptic. If being called a woo woo really bothers you I suggest you stop posting in this forum.

 

[duendy]

let me ask you a pertinent question shaman.....do you have a blind spot?

do you ONLY notice Gustav's contributions at these forums, and mine? yet not your comrades in arms? are you now aware of THEIR/and your snide remarks etc.....in fACT IT IS always COMING FROM THEIR/YOUR SIDE....all th innuendos, insulting remaks, put-downs, condescendingness, patronization.....remember when ya called my crazy etc?

so, my shaman sir. do you have a blindspot. is this question goona also invlve your blindspot?

i suggest you observe,and listen right

 

[shaman_]

let me ask you a pertinent question shaman.....do you have a blind spot?

do you ONLY notice Gustav's contributions at these forums, and mine? yet not your comrades in arms? are you now aware of THEIR/and your snide remarks etc.....in fACT IT IS always COMING FROM THEIR/YOUR SIDE....all th innuendos, insulting remaks, put-downs, condescendingness, patronization.....remember when ya called my crazy etc?

so, my shaman sir. do you have a blindspot. is this question goona also invlve your blindspot?

i suggest you observe,and listen right

No I did not call you crazy. That was your interpretation.

Page 9 of "where is the evidence for alien visitation?"

shaman - Shoddiness? haha You aren't even able to use the quotes properly. Your posts are often a mad ramble!

duendy - oh::beautiful......now i am crazy....perfect?"


Page 10
shaman - No. I was not saying anyone was crazy.

duendy - :good




As I said in the previous post - It looks to me like every person in this thread is name-calling...

 

[duendy]

'everyone'....well...good-ish. i ta you say everyone...but, as Gustav rightly reveals, the name callin is neary ALWAYS intitiated by the materialists.

and notonly aimed at your opposite camp--us--but also at people 'you' hav never met who you call eiter LIARS or MENTALLY ILL, or FAME-HEADS etc

tat aint science and also aint cool...orrrrrrrmatuuuuure

 

[Mr Anonymous]

let me ask you a pertinent question shaman.....do you have a blind spot?

do you ONLY notice Gustav's contributions at these forums, and mine?

Em... duendy? In casting ones eyeballs upwards you'll note the multiple block of Gustav posts literally constipating the original discussion to a halt - how exactly is one not supposed to notice the man?

He's just managed to get you're own discussion thread locked down using the same process.

Y'can't actually have discussion anymore once his nibs decides to grace us with his presence.

 

[SkinWalker]

and notonly aimed at your opposite camp--us--but also at people 'you' hav never met who you call eiter LIARS or MENTALLY ILL, or FAME-HEADS etc

tat aint science and also aint cool...orrrrrrrmatuuuuure

I'm sorry you don't like it, duendy, but I think being blount is what is needed in topics like this. This is a 'science' board. Not a paranormal board, or a religious board, or a UFO board, or a psychic board, etc.

I call people who make claims to special powers but refuse to provide evidence liars. People who have claim to some special insight to knowlege that they refuse to quantify/qualify with data, liars. A lie is a statement that deviates from or perverts the truth. If they or their defenders perceive it to be ad hominem, then they need only demonstrate the truth of their statements and I will gladly revise my characterization and issue apology. And eagerly so, since I would welcome the evidence that humans have some special power.

With regard to my use of myster-monger and significance-junkie, I don't think they are pejorative nor ad hominem. How are we to refer to those that appear to find significance in spurious correlations and random facts? What term do we apply to those that seem to defend the "mystery" without regard for evidence?

Threads like this can be discussed with far more critical tone without resorting to the juvenile banter and one-liner/zinger posts of attention-seekers like Gustav. While I've rarely agreed with you, duendy, I've always admired the fact that you stick it out and post your own thoughts on topics rather than simply seek out a flame-fest, which is what Gustav appears to do. I'm actually quite disappointed in your apparent admiration of him/her. I thought you much better than that.

Characters like Gustav don't seek discussion, they seek attention. On some level we all do, but to stoop to the level Gustav does for it is appalling. I don't mind pejorative characterizations (if I did, I'd have let you know ages ago). I also don't mind criticism of my posts, indeed, I welcome them. But Gustav's interests aren't in discussion as evidenced by each and every thread he's been a part of and the result of them all. He wants to feed his ego with the attention it craves.

This is the only post I'll make on this and I made it here because very clearly the topic is destroyed already and you're reading it. If you wish further reply, PM me. Indeed, I'll not speak of Gustav beyond this post either. He/she no longer exists to me...

 

[duendy]

Em... duendy? In casting ones eyeballs upwards you'll note the multiple block of Gustav posts literally constipating the original discussion to a halt - how exactly is one not supposed to notice the man?

He's just managed to get you're own discussion thread locked down using the same process.

Y'can't actually have discussion anymore once his nibs decides to grace us with his presence.

Be honest....your gripe wit Gustav is tat he contradicts you. ad does it in a very swift and minimalist and wtty and intelligent way. i trust my review-manship

also...he doesn't post in block type. the kinfds of posts i hate are ones hijackin my 'whatis consciousness?' tread....Gustav's are prooundly more...ZEN!

 

[duendy]

I'm sorry you don't like it, duendy, but I think being blount is what is needed in topics like this. This is a 'science' board. Not a paranormal board, or a religious board, or a UFO board, or a psychic board, etc.

me))))))))never claimed i didn't like it as such...it was shaman_'s stance of ONLY noticing Gustav's--well only emphasizing Gustav's 'attitude'. but i am not seeing it thatway as i said. to rpepeat, Gustav reveaaaaalls whats going on. thatits you lot who instigate flaming-ness-ness

I call people who make claims to special powers but refuse to provide evidence liars.

me))))))))wich is: anatgonistic, abusive, uncalled for, and UNscientific.

People who have claim to some special insight to knowlege that they refuse to quantify/qualify with data, liars. A lie is a statement that deviates from or perverts the truth.

me))))))))WHO's 'truth'?? i will tell you. your materialistic bias which you BELIEVE is 'the truth and the only possible truth' is what

If they or their defenders perceive it to be ad hominem, then they need only demonstrate the truth of their statements and I will gladly revise my characterization and issue apology.

me)))))))))no mate .haha. yu make te law too huh? it IS ad hominem, and also very insulting, and can only breed resentment

And eagerly so, since I would welcome the evidence that humans have some special power.

me::::so you say. but i do not believe you for several reasons. one--you are staunch materialist, 2, tere DOES exist vast proofas any real skeptic-scientist would tell you and 3, you dont have the humility to really explore about tis. ou have too much of an axe to grind dear boy

With regard to my use of myster-monger and significance-junkie, I don't think they are pejorative nor ad hominem. How are we to refer to those that appear to find significance in spurious correlations and random facts? What term do we apply to those that seem to defend the "mystery" without regard for evidence?

me((((((((you deny your beHAVIOUR like you deny the evidence.......! your criteria for evidence is whooly limited nd old fashioned, and ALSO, like i said therer is evidence but you. like many oter materialists--fearful of losing worldview, and face---dont even go tere. your...'evidence-need' is a cop-out, a ecurity-blanket you shroud your self with ...pokin one eye out everyonce in a white, like one-eyed cat at te fish store

Threads like this can be discussed with far more critical tone without resorting to the juvenile banter and one-liner/zinger posts of attention-seekers like Gustav. While I've rarely agreed with you, duendy, I've always admired the fact that you stick it out and post your own thoughts on topics rather than simply seek out a flame-fest, which is what Gustav appears to do. I'm actually quite disappointed in your apparent admiration of him/her. I thought you much better than that.

me::::::::;no. TRUST me. i am not baackin Gustav cuase he is errr on my side. i am saying hs she is VERY intelligent and tat is whatndisturbs you and the otehers. he can see right through what you do, and does it swiftly with few words. some shit i read...exchanges between hir/him and thematerilaists here have given me thrills of delight. UNDERSTANDyour need to scapegoat hir is your fear of exposure. well he done already don it

Characters like Gustav don't seek discussion, they seek attention. On some level we all do, but to stoop to the level Gustav does for it is appalling. I don't mind pejorative characterizations (if I did, I'd have let you know ages ago). I also don't mind criticism of my posts, indeed, I welcome them. But Gustav's interests aren't in discussion as evidenced by each and every thread he's been a part of and the result of them all. He wants to feed his ego with the attention it craves.

me:::::again no no no. that is you seeing it throgh your security blanket. is it a coincidence tat all te wailing and gnashing of teeth regarding Gustav's faily minimailist but powerful posts are coming from THE MATERIALISTS......huh? what do you say. coincidence? magick?

This is the only post I'll make on this and I made it here because very clearly the topic is destroyed already and you're reading it. If you wish further reply, PM me. Indeed, I'll not speak of Gustav beyond this post either. He/she no longer exists to me...

now, do you see what i mean....that last sentence is wholly dramaTIK....ustav has rumbled someting very deep for you dude. seriusly i am asking you to be aware of this.
i am very very very aware that tese forums
are NOT mere playthings. people worldviews CAn be shaken. that is learning and needs exploring without hiding away

how do you feel i have felt when i have 'felt' i hae been attcked, yet nver have i pu anyone on my ignore list....am i jeeeeesus or WHAT?????

 

[Gustav]

shaman

The 'rubbish' that I was referring to were your posts regarding ad hominem and hypocrisy. I have no intention of challenging them as I find them to be immature and extremely boring. That is not why I visit sciforums. I assume skinwalker felt the same.

so if someone engages in fallacious argumentation you do not call them on it?
your characterizations as immature and extremely boring" are irrelevant.
what is important is...are my charges of ad hom and hypocrisy borne out by evidence?

If being called a woo woo really bothers you I suggest you stop posting in this forum.

justify the label. back the allegation up. assertions with evidence.
are these concepts foreign to you

do that and i will happily get woo woo branded on my ass

can you?

 

[Gustav]

Y'can't actually have discussion anymore once his nibs decides to grace us with his presence.

oh you can
just not the kind of disingenious crap that you seem to favor

 

[Gustav]

Indeed, I'll not speak of Gustav beyond this post either. He/she no longer exists to me...

mmm
a hysterical and traumatized skinwalker

/rotfl

 

[Mr Anonymous]

Be honest....your gripe wit Gustav is tat he contradicts you. ad does it in a very swift and minimalist and wtty and intelligent way. i trust my review-manship

also...he doesn't post in block type. the kinfds of posts i hate are ones hijackin my 'whatis consciousness?' tread....Gustav's are prooundly more...ZEN!

Mmmmm.... (looking up)

So, Gustav doesn't multiple spam then, eh? Impirical...