True Lies

[S.A.M.]

What does this have to do with atheism ?
I am pointing out a problem in your quoted statement.

For Muslims, it is related to what Islam would consider righteousness, other religions have their own ideas. As atheists have no good or bad in their vocabulary [only truth and lies] , I am not qualified to offer an opinion.

 

[CheskiChips]

meaningless word salad
utter garbage

purging axioms eh?

/beats cheski senseless

Okay Gustav, I will explain every word for you.

Purge:
"In history and political science, to purge is to remove people considered by the group in power to be "undesirable" from a government, political party, a profession, or from community or society as a whole, often by violent means. Restoration of people from a purge is known as rehabilitation."

Axioms:
In traditional logic, an axiom or postulate is a proposition that is not proved or demonstrated but considered to be self-evident. ...
Philosphical:
In this case the origin of the axioms, through philisophical thought

~~Yes, you can purge axioms.


Paradox:
"(logic) a statement that contradicts itself;


"Paradoxically; when a philosophy says "It's worth fighting for" and the other says "It isn't worth fighting for" this disagreement causes war. This is the disagreement of Pluralism and Monotheism. "



Would you now like to retract your statement...or is this still word-salad to you? Are you having comprehension issues, or do you disagree? I doubt it's the latter...

 

[Enmos]

For Muslims, it is related to what Islam would consider righteousness, other religions have their own ideas. As atheists have no good or bad in their vocabulary [only truth and lies] , I am not qualified to offer an opinion.

 

[(Q)]

Gee Sam, looks like your "righteousness" thread is failing, miserably. At least now we know how you feel when you post here... uh, lie here.

 

[S.A.M.]

Yeah, apparently superstring is the only normal human being here who is also an atheist.

 

[Enmos]

Yeah, apparently superstring is the only normal human being here who is also an atheist.

And why is that ?

 

[(Q)]

Not getting the favorable responses you thought, Sam? hehe

 

[S.A.M.]

And why is that ?

Because I agree with him of course!

 

[Oli]

:worship:
:bravo:

Boom! Coffee all over the keyboard...

 

[S.A.M.]

Heh. I just saw your vote, Oli.

 

[(Q)]

Yeah, apparently superstring is the only normal human being here who is also an atheist.

Because I agree with him of course!

All this caterwauling while SAM trudges to and fro upon the backs of how many untouchables? How many people starve while selfish SAM sits here whining about -- what? a few hundred AT BEST -- "torture" victims? How many millions live in de facto slavery cleaning feces with their bare hands all around her while she sits around pattering away, numbly, at her computer, desperately trying to distract attention away from the fact that nothing is more evil than the selfishness she displays.

The ultimate hypocrisy.

But sure, we'll all drop what we're doing and giddy-ap to SAM's selfish little tune.

Bullshit. I wasn't talking about the poverty. I was talking about the abject disregard for human rights, de facto slavery and SAM utterly ignoring an issue which causes -- both by act of volition and absence of action -- exponentially more pain, anguish and deaths each year than anything the USA has done in Gitmo.

Moreover, since it is SAM who has perfected the annoying usage of non sequiturs, I feel that turn about is very much fair play. She endeavors to bring light to the evils of the west. I endeavor to bring light to her utter hypocrisy.

~String

SAM's a liberal, so her trolling doesn't matter (especially when it attacks the USA or the west). Anybody who calls her out on it and/or plays her game is the issue. Never her.

~String

I agree with String, too.

 

[Simon Anders]

Of course it is OK to lie in certain situations and anyone who says differently thinks this situation is one of those situations.

 

[S.A.M.]

Of course it is OK to lie in certain situations and anyone who says differently thinks this situations is one of those situations.

Very nice, I like it. :bravo:

 

[Simon Anders]

The serial killer has just diced up your spouse and asks you, with an insane leer on his face, where your child is hiding.

Anyone here going to tell the truth?

And if you think silence is the 'MORAL' option, it is easy to change the scenario. He asks if you child is home. When you remain silent, he begins to search. What parent would not call out 'She's at her friend's house.' or some other lie in the hope the SK will buy it.

You could say that this facet of Islam is similar to utilitarian moral ideas. What does the greatest good? Often religions, and any moral system based on rules, take away the followers' responsibility for such decisions, by having a rule that one must follow, regardless. My impression from Muslims I have met is that stealing falls into the category in Islam. One cannot use context to justify stealing. I don't know how correct their assertion of this was.

But at least in this respect Islam is quite similar to secular humanism, actually. I believe most secular humanists would lie in certain situations and defend the act as moral.

 

[(Q)]

Of course it is OK to lie in certain situations and anyone who says differently thinks this situation is one of those situations.

Do you think a religion should promote lying to settle differences? Do you think lying is righteous, as Sam has decreed? Do you think such an allowance from a religion will be abused?

 

[S.A.M.]

The serial killer has just diced up your spouse and asks you, with an insane leer on his face, where your child is hiding.

Anyone here going to tell the truth?

And if you think silence is the 'MORAL' option, it is easy to change the scenario. He asks if you child is home. When you remain silent, he begins to search. What parent would not call out 'She's at her friend's house.' or some other lie in the hope the SK will buy it.

You could say that this facet of Islam is similar to utilitarian moral ideas. What does the greatest good? Often religions, and any moral system based on rules, take away the followers' responsibility for such decisions, by having a rule that one must follow, regardless. My impression from Muslims I have met is that stealing falls into the category in Islam. One cannot use context to justify stealing. I don't know how correct their assertion of this was.

But at least in this respect Islam is quite similar to secular humanism, actually. I believe most secular humanists would lie in certain situations and defend the act as moral.

(Q) never lies. He would give up his kid.

 

[(Q)]

(Q) never lies. He would give up his kid.

Sam wouldn't know how to tell the truth if it shoved it's fist up her ass.

 

[one_raven]

So if you were a Jew in Nazi Germany, would you be honest and tell them you were a Jew if they came knocking at your door?

Interestingly, there were quite a lot of Jehovah's Witnesses who, knowing it mean their death, refused to denounce their faith in the face of the SS.
I respect that more than words can truly relate.
Not only did they hold their dignity and integrity, but it showed that they truly did believe their religious beliefs and their faith did not waver in the face of death.
Those who claim to believe that their God will reward them with everlasting paradise for being true to their faith, but will deny it to save his or her own life is a liar.

 

[Simon Anders]

Do you think a religion should promote lying to settle differences? Do you think lying is righteous, as Sam has decreed? Do you think such an allowance from a religion will be abused?

As far as I can see SAM did not say lying was righteous, but rather implied that righteousness has a higher value than 'conveying accurate information at all costs.'

You and I, Q, have quite a number of differences. I assume however that, like like me, you would lie in certain situations and consider it moral.

 

[S.A.M.]

Interestingly, there were quite a lot of Jehovah's Witnesses who, knowing it mean their death, refused to denounce their faith in the face of the SS.
I respect that more than words can truly relate.
Not only did they hold their dignity and integrity, but it showed that they truly did believe their religious beliefs and their faith did not waver in the face of death.
Those who claim to believe that their God will reward them with everlasting paradise for being true to their faith, but will deny it to save his or her own life is a liar.

Fortunately, Muslims do not have to worry about stuff like that. As (Q) says, we're allowed to conceal our faith in the face of oppression. Its not considered immoral or wrong to do so. Just pragmatic.