Hey all,
I've spent the last few days reading most of this thread, I stumbled across it trying to find more people's opinions on wether what is stated in TP is true or false, and just to find some nice intellectual arguments in general. I'm glad to say I found what I was looking for in this thread, but find myself more confused rather than satisfied after reading it.
It would appear that on one side of the argument you have the pro TP people, saying they believe what's said in the book, that it's a really cool book and basically saying, "YOU CAN'T DISPROVE ANYTHING IN THIS BOOK NANANANANA"
Then on the other side of the argument you have the anti TP people, who say that it's complete and utter tripe, rubbish, bullshit, nothing can be backed up with evidence, loosely countering some arguments put forward by the pro TP people (e.g SkinWalker's Bermuda Triangle post) and basically saying, "YOU CAN'T PROVE ANYTHING IN THIS BOOK NANANANANA"
In fact the whole argument over this book is really quite frustrating, because if you truly step back for a moment from whatever side of the argument you're on and look at it from a neutral point of view, there are some really solid points on both sides.
For example, starting with pro TP:
From what I can see, I can't see any way in which Michel Desmarquet profits in a large way from the writing of this book. Let's consider for a moment the emourmous imagination base, rather large scientific knowledge base and clear cut philosophical mind it would have taken to write this book (assuming it is fiction). Look at some of the youtube videos of his lectures and you can see for yourself that he seems like a really nice, solid, down to earth guy. So lets combine those observations and conlude that in order to write this book (assuming it's fiction), he would've had to be a, what I like to call a, "holy cow darn cool, intelligent guy"
So lets assume that it is a work of fiction for a moment, and he's that guy. Firstly, you'd think that "that guy" would use his time more constructively than writing a book about being abducted by 10 foot hermaphrodites...?
Right...
Secondly imagine the amount of time, work and research that would have to be put into writing something that extensive. I'm going to take a guess off the bat and say it would have to be upwards of two years.
So "that guy" (I hope you follow what I mean when I say "that guy", being the super intelligent, cool, philosophical guy) does ALL THIS WORK writing a book about being abducted by 10 foot hermaphrodites just to sell it for minimal publishing price, and give an option to get a free E-book if you cant afford it?
To me, this doesn't add up.
SkinWalker suggests somewhere previously that perhaps he imagined the whole thing and believes it is true. I'd have to disagree with that. It would lead me to question if you actually read the book? I find it impossible to believe that someone could have experienced something that complex and not so bizzarre from their bedroom. (When I say "not so bizzarre" I don't mean to say: "I BELIEVE!!!!" I'm simply saying that the content of the book isn't completely messed up and unbelievable like a dream and
could be believed in with some faith).
Some people suggest that his lectures are so expensive that he "must" be a fraud. This I don't believe is the case either. Let's assume for the moment that it's not fiction and the guy genuinly got abducted and wants to spread the word. His book isn't making him wealthy, it isn't on the bestseller shelves (how the heck would a book about being abducted by 10 foot hermaphrodites ever be? anyone could guess this) and quite simply the guy has to get money to live. What I'm saying is that
assuming he's telling the truth and is genuine, it's acceptable to believe that the price he charged for lectures was enough for him to live off, which was (as i recall, can't remember from where) 20$.
SkinWalker also posted a link to a site which definately looked like a business made off the back of things like this, which said something like $95 per lecture, taught by
the two authorized lecturers on earth to lecture about thiaoobua with a nice little picture of Desmarquet with 2 people.
I'm sure if SkinWalker was on the other side of the argument, exactly what he would say would be along the lines of "That picture could have been taken by anyone with Desmarquet and in no way alludes to the fact that Desmarquet has any affiliation with the people running this scam business".
Those are pretty much the points that I can see concerning the pro TP side of the argument. There's no real point in me trying to argue anything in any way scientific or spiritual about the book because in the end of the day I'll just go around in circles (which is what this whole forum seems to have done) because no one can seem to
fully and wholely prove, or disprove anyone.
Now the anti TP points:
(Please excuse the long-winded explaination)
When I think about spirituallity and faith nowadays I find it hard to see how anyone with a clear and open mind can develope a belief on the subject. If you walk into a bookstore you can walk around and open a dozen books of faith each with contradicting opinions of what is "real" and each book absolutely certain that their belief system is correct. Since there is (from what I can see) zero proof whatsoever on the subject how can I logically come to a conclusion about what is actually
true?
I can't. (How frustrating).
So if Desmarquet is telling the truth, how the heck could the thiaoobuans think that this guy was going to be believed by intelligent non-gullible people? And if the only people who truly believe this guy are going to be the class of gullible people who think that their neighbours cat is an alien, how the heck can this book make
any difference?
Logically it can't.
In Summary
I do realise that my pro points are significantly longer than my anti points. Please don't accuse me of being bias I'm really trying my hardest to review the argument with an open mind without referring to the neverending circle of argument that seems to be the "Scientifice Proof/Disproof", and yes this is my first post on this forum, I only signed up to post to this thread, not because I'm affiliated with Desmarquet but because I want to share my opinion *sigh*.
I would however, like to state the possibility of a counter argument to my anti TP point, which is, If you think about the number of government conspiracies and "control" conspiracies in general (if you choose to believe them or not). Even if you believe in just a handful of them, or even one, you could say that if Desmarquet came back from Thiaoobua with some kind of actual proof that we could be persuaded with, he would have been silenced so fast we would not know who Michel Desmarquet is today? Perhaps the book needed to have the posibility of counter argument open to it inorder for him not to be silenced by the "Powers that be"?
Just an opinion to dwell on.
Perhaps I am appearing a little pro TP, and for that I apoligise, it was not my intention because my belief regarding the book is still "I Honestly Don't Have A Clue".
Finally, an interesting thing I have noticed is that the people arguing anti TP seem to be a little bit more aggressive and blatently dissmissive in their arguing, and the pro TP people seemed to be a bit hippyish, naive and also blatently dissmissive. For example Ophiolite seemed to be a cool guy at first but then it became apparent from his constant indication of poor grammar and spelling (on an internet forum) blatant arrogance and rudeness towards people expressing their opinions, it became clear that he was not here for an intelligent discussion, but merely to flex his tunnel visioned muscles of "superior intellect". And then you have the pro TP people such as Robanan who also seemed cool, but ended up resorting to naive childish retorts to some questions put to them which ended up with (me at least) losing respect for them and consequently their theories and opinions put forward.
None of us here on this forum can say "I AM RIGHT YOU ARE WRONG" just like that. Anyone who says something such as that will find that their words no longer carry the weight they used to, because honestly, if any of you really are as clever as you all seem to think you are,
you can see that in this discussion, there is room for the possibility, (however small it may be in your mind) that the other person on the other side of the argument is right.
For reasons that are the subject of another debate, at the moment on earth the answer to the ultimate question of spirituality can only remain as:
I DON'T KNOW
It's quite sad really...
:shrug: