What facts?No, because the facts do not support that possibility.
Please explain in full detail.
Thanks!
Michael
The Muslim Black Box: Kaaba
- Thread starter Vega
- Start date
Please explain in full detail.
Thanks!
Michael
The fact that he did pass on the message of Islam, of course. That makes him a Prophet.
Oh that's rich!
Mohammad is a Prophet because the Qur'an is Prophetic.
The Qur'an is Prophetic because it was written by a Prophet.
:roflmao:
Is this the type of logical thinking you were referring to?
:bugeye:
Seriously, I would have thought you'd have really provided something here but I guess not.
Michael
Mohammed is a Prophet because he passed on the message of Islam, he did not claim to be the first or to give an original message, nor did he claim there was anything different about his message from that given before him. In fact most verses about him in the Quran reiterate that he is only a man and his job is merely to pass the message, not to ensure that the message is followed. His sole purpose therefore is as a messenger. That he complied with. That makes him a Prophet.
Again, your reasoning is circular:Mohammed is a Prophet because he passed on the message of Islam, ..... That he complied with. That makes him a Prophet.
Mohammad is a Prophet because the Qur'an is Prophetic.
The Qur'an is Prophetic because it was written by a Prophet.
Using your own logic you must conclude Bahá'u'lláh was a Prophet.
Bahá'u'lláhis a Prophet because he passed on the message of Baha'i', ..... That he complied with. That makes him a Prophet.
Using your own logic you must conclude John Frum was a Prophet.
John Frum was a Prophet because he passed on the message of John Frumism, ..... That he complied with. That makes him a Prophet.
Using your own logic you must conclude L. Ron Hubbard was a Prophet.
L. Ron Hubbard was a Prophet because he passed on the message of Scientology, ..... That he complied with. That makes him a Prophet.
Reasoning that Mohammad is a Prophet because he passed on the message of Mohammadism, ..... That he complied with. That makes him a Prophet. Is circular.
Now that you can clearly see that your reasoning is circular and can look at the question again with this fresh perspective I'll ask again:
Does the possibility exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet?
Thanks,
Michael
Sure that way it works, but only if you believe in the message. One can choose which message to believe in.
True, but you are the one that said something about having an open mind. About having preconceived ideas?Sure that way it works, but only if you believe in the message. One can choose which message to believe in.
It seems that it is you that have the preconceived idea and more so. On top of having the preconceived idea that Mohammad was a Prophet you refuse to even entertain that the notion or concept can exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet.
Why?
Why is it that you can not even entertain the logical possibility?
I asked: Does the possibility exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet? And you say no, for no reason, just no. No, it is not even a possibility.
Also, by making this statement you of course imply that at some level: Buddhists beliefs are inherently flawed, Hindu beliefs are inherently flawed, Christian beliefs are inherently flawed, Jewish beliefs are inherently flawed, Shinto beliefs are inherently flawed, John Frumian beliefs are inherently flawed, Baha’i’ beliefs are inherently flawed, Mormon beliefs are inherently flawed…
I wonder what that sort of thinking does to society?
Something to think about . . . . . .
That is a testable hypothesis. Yes it is possiblilty. For many centuries many monotheists believed this. It is also possible that the Earth is 1 second old.
Based on the Scientific Method, and applying it equally to all hypothesis, we can scientifically suggest that the earth is billions of years old and that because many different unbiased experiments have come to the same conclusion and been repeated many times by many different people that Hypothesis that Earth is billions of years old best represents reality.
Michael
Thats what I mean about facts governing opinion.
If you believe in the validity of the scientific method, you could not accept the possibility of the earth being 5000 years old. You'd also be hard put trying to convince someone of this fact if he/she does not believe in the scientific method.
Now if the facts were somehow to be changed...
e.g. is it possible that both theists and atheists are correct in their beliefs?
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Why? This 5000 year of Earth hypothesis has a possibility of being true. It has been tested and most-likely is not true. If one were to have any doubts, as many monotheists do, they can test this hypothesis today for themselves. They do actually.Thats what I mean about facts governing opinion.
If you believe in the validity of the scientific method, you could not accept the possibility of the earth being 5000 years old. You'd also be hard put trying to convince someone of this fact if he/she does not believe in the scientific method.
This is different than your assertion that the possibility can not exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet.
I asked:
Does the possibility exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet?
You stated:
No, for no reason, the possibility can not exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet.
Ergo, all other religous beliefs that are contrary to this statement must be inherently wrong.
One of the reasons people justify killing one another is that they find it impossible to entertain the notion that the possibility exists that someone else's beleif may be correct and their beleif is wrong. Whether they be Atheist or Theists, Muslim or Jew, etc..
So:
Does the possibility exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet?
Michael
That would be true if Mohammed preached an exclusive philosophy; but he didn't, he preached an inclusive one. Which is why Muslims have no regulations about how to follow their religion. This is also the same reason why Muslims will not denounce any other Prophet, because they do not know who is included in the verse that says we will not differentiate between messengers.
This does not address this question at all:
Does the possibility exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet?
Inclusive... really?
Is it possible that Bahá'u'lláh was the Last Prophet?
Michael
This does not address this question at all:
Does the possibility exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet?
Inclusive... really?
Is it possible that Bahá'u'lláh was the Last Prophet?
Michael
I've actually answered that before I think, the difference between a nabi and a rasul. Of course, if you want to prove a point that your question makes rather than address the facts as they are known, you might find it more fun to argue with IAC.
Gnite
rather than address the facts as they are known:bugeye:I've actually answered that before I think, the difference between a nabi and a rasul. Of course, if you want to prove a point that your question makes rather than address the facts as they are known, you might find it more fun to argue with IAC.
Gnite
The facts?
Address the facts?
:bugeye:
What facts?
I searched the thread and no you have not answered this question. Why are you so hesitant to now? You have ignored this question many times. Why is it so difficult a question to answer. You just said Islam is an inclusive religion. I am asking a simple question in regards to this statement.
I'll ask again:
Is it possible that Bahá'u'lláh was the Last Prophet?
Michael
from Wiki:
Bahá'u'lláh (ba-haa-ol-laa Arabic: بهاء الله "Glory of God") (November 12, 1817 - May 29, 1892), born Mírzá Ḥusayn-`Alí (Persian: میرزا حسینعلی), was the founder of the Bahá'í Faith. He claimed to fulfill the Bábí prophecy of "He whom God shall make manifest", but in a broader sense he also claimed to be the "supreme Manifestation of God".[1], referring to the fulfillment of the eschatological expectations of a prophetic cycle beginning with Adam, and including Abrahamic religions, as well as Zoroastrianism, the Dharmic religions, and others. Bahá'ís see Bahá'u'lláh as the initiator of a new religion, as Jesus or Muhammad — but also the initiator of a new cycle, like that attributed to Adam.
As you can see Baha'i believe Bahá'u'lláh was even more than Mohammad or Jesus, he was an Adam. I personally know Baha'i that believe Bahá'u'lláh was the Last Prophet. He will not be the Last one ever but is the Last one as in the most recent.
My Question is: Is it possible that Bahá'u'lláh was the Last Prophet?
Thanks
Michael
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Like I said, I am not responsible for what other people believe, including you. What did Bahaullah himself say? That is what I base my opinion on.
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That’s fine. It was sunny today too. Neither of which has to do with my question.
Can the possibility exist that Bahá'u'lláh was a Prophet?
While you think that over lets summarize.
I asked: Is it possible there are five Gods?
You said: No.
I asked: Is it possible Mohammad was not a Prophet?
You said: No. It is not possible.
I asked: Is there a chance that Mohammad was just a man with schizophrenia and never had any conversations with any angels and the stories were simply plagiarized and blended?
You said: No. It is not possible.
I asked: Is it possible that there is no God?
You said: Yes it is possible there is no God… …
Correct so far?
If there is no God, a possibility you admit to (post #87), then the possibility must also exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet.
A “Prophet” can only exist if a God exists.
No God, No Prophet.
Do you agree that if the possibility exist that there is no God, then the possibility must exist that there are no Prophets?
Thanks
Michael
That’s fine. It was sunny today too. Neither of which has to do with my question.
Can the possibility exist that Bahá'u'lláh was a Prophet?
While you think that over lets summarize.
I asked: Is it possible there are five Gods?
You said: No.
I asked: Is it possible Mohammad was not a Prophet?
You said: No. It is not possible.
I asked: Is there a chance that Mohammad was just a man with schizophrenia and never had any conversations with any angels and the stories were simply plagiarized and blended?
You said: No. It is not possible.
I asked: Is it possible that there is no God?
You said: Yes it is possible there is no God… …
Correct so far?
If there is no God, a possibility you admit to (post #87), then the possibility must also exist that Mohammad was not a Prophet.
A “Prophet” can only exist if a God exists.
No God, No Prophet.
Do you agree that if the possibility exist that there is no God, then the possibility must exist that there are no Prophets?
Thanks
Michael
Only if you believe it (PS which is what I said about the possibility of God too; are you filtering my answers?
)I know what I think, I'm asking you what you think.Only if you believe it (PS which is what I said about the possibility of God too; are you filtering my answers?
Does Sam think that the possibility can exist that Bahá'u'lláh was a Prophet?
I am filtering your answers?
I asked: Is it possible that there is no God?
You said: [sic] "Yes it is possible there is no God"… (post #87)
Do you agree?
Michael