Stun guns and cops.

[leopold]

http://www.hrw.org/about/initiatives/police.htm
http://www.hrw.org/reports98/police/
http://www.hrw.org/doc/?t=usa_police

have any links to the actual cases?

 

[leopold]

etc

http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/engAMR510511998

ever hear of a dash camera sam?
why don't you give links to the officers that are killid for the simple act of pulling someone over, hmmm?

typical scenario:
perp: i'm gonna break the law
cop: surrender
perp: fuck you asshole
cop: surrender
perp: make me
cop: okay
perp sues cause he's a fucking prick and knows a crooked lawyer.

 

[Baron Max]

2. In American hospitals, are mentally ill people tasered by doctors to keep them under control?

No, they don't use tazers, but they physically wrestle them down, then inject them with powerful, quick sedatives. Ain't much difference that I can see ....both calm them down pretty damned quickly.

Baron Max

 

[leopold]

No, they don't use tazers, but they physically wrestle them down, then inject them with powerful, quick sedatives. Ain't much difference that I can see ....both calm them down pretty damned quickly.

Baron Max

sometimes they are tied down, it depends how out of it they are.
you're correct that they are injected with sedatives.

edit
how much experiance have you got with cops sam?

 

[S.A.M.]

so you would rather put police officers at increased danger would you sam

Aren't they trained to deal with this sort of a thing?

Does knowing that a cop will use a taser make a criminal/mentally ill person more or less belligerent?

Are there any guidelines about the circumstances under which tasers should be used?

Should anyone of any age or medical condition be tasered if considered belligerent? How do cops distinguish between someone who is mentally ill, belligerent or just angry at being unfairly treated? Are tasers the first line of defence or a last resort?

What happens when a person dies after being tasered? What are the consequences to the cop?

How many times can a cop taser a person he considers belligerent? Once twice or more times?

 

[S.A.M.]

No, they don't use tazers, but they physically wrestle them down, then inject them with powerful, quick sedatives. Ain't much difference that I can see ....both calm them down pretty damned quickly.

Baron Max

Anyone ever died after being wrestled to the ground and sedated?

I'd say thats a major difference.

 

[S.A.M.]

edit
how much experiance have you got with cops sam?

How much do you?

 

[S.A.M.]

ever hear of a dash camera sam?
why don't you give links to the officers that are killid for the simple act of pulling someone over, hmmm?

typical scenario:
perp: i'm gonna break the law
cop: surrender
perp: fuck you asshole
cop: surrender
perp: make me
cop: okay
perp sues cause he's a fucking prick and knows a crooked lawyer.

Are you a cop?

 

[spidergoat]

Actually, this happened to a friend of mine with schizophrenia. He was shouting crap in the streets and the neighbors called the cops. They came, and he freaked out. The police ended up pepper spraying him and tasering him, and wrestled him to the ground. It didn't end up too badly, but a similar thing happened in Portland recently and the guy died (probably due to a large cop falling on him).

My view is that the cops can't be psychologists, they do their best to look out for the public, and tasers are an effective tool. Without them, they would end up using deadly force more often.

 

[Baron Max]

Anyone ever died after being wrestled to the ground and sedated?

Yes, Sam, there have been some that have died in that way - and some right there in the ER! Are you going to now rail against doctors and injections of sedatives??? ...LOL!

Baron Max

 

[S.A.M.]

Yes, Sam, there have been some that have died in that way - and some right there in the ER! Are you going to now rail against doctors and injections of sedatives??? ...LOL!

Baron Max

Links? Evidence?

 

[S.A.M.]

Actually, this happened to a friend of mine with schizophrenia. He was shouting crap in the streets and the neighbors called the cops. They came, and he freaked out. The police ended up pepper spraying him and tasering him, and wrestled him to the ground. It didn't end up too badly, but a similar thing happened in Portland recently and the guy died (probably due to a large cop falling on him).

My view is that the cops can't be psychologists, they do their best to look out for the public, and tasers are an effective tool. Without them, they would end up using deadly force more often.

So the excellent crime rates of the United States are a reflection of the effective methods used by the cops to combat crime?

And that is why the average American has such a lot of confidence in the cops?

 

[Baron Max]

Links? Evidence?

I don't need it, I already know it. If you want it and don't trust me, then go find it yourself!

Besides, even if I posted a link or evidence, you'd just claim that it was fake or false or erroneous or wrong or incorrect or..... So what the hell ...check it out yourself.

Baron Max

 

[leopold]

Aren't they trained to deal with this sort of a thing?

yes cops are highly trained.

Does knowing that a cop will use a taser make a criminal/mentally ill person more or less belligerent?

yes, knowing a cop will taser your ass will make most people think twice.

Are there any guidelines about the circumstances under which tasers should be used?

yes.

Should anyone of any age or medical condition be tasered if considered belligerent?

really sam a cop will not ask you if you have any medical conditions that will prohibit the use of tasers.
you'd love it if that was the case though wouldn't you.

How do cops distinguish between someone who is mentally ill, belligerent or just angry at being unfairly treated?

anybody that is ranting and raving IS mentally ill.

Are tasers the first line of defence or a last resort?

tasers are neither the first or last line of defense.
verbal commands are the first.
being shot to death is the last.

What happens when a person dies after being tasered?

the cop has to spend an ungodly amount of time in lawsuits justifying his use of the taser when his time could be better spent taking the trash of the streets.

What are the consequences to the cop?

in most cases none, he might be reassigned to another department.

How many times can a cop taser a person he considers belligerent?
Once twice or more times?

as many times as needed.

How much do you?

quite a bit sam, now aswer my question.

 

[S.A.M.]

I don't need it, I already know it. If you want it and don't trust me, then go find it yourself!

Besides, even if I posted a link or evidence, you'd just claim that it was fake or false or erroneous or wrong or incorrect or..... So what the hell ...check it out yourself.

Baron Max

Well well well what do you know?

The Baron is actually right for once!

Hospitals Move to Curb Anesthesia Risk

Wall Street Journal

8/09/06



With mounting concern about risks from short-acting sedatives used in outpatient surgical procedures, hospitals are adopting strict new policies for the safe administration of the drugs, including new training to help doctors and nurses better respond when things go wrong.



Thanks in part to advances over the past few years in so-called conscious sedation, nearly 70% of surgical procedures are now performed in hospital outpatient departments, surgical centers and doctor's offices. With the latest sedating drugs, including fentanyl and Versed, doctors can now perform operations ranging from tummy tucks to cardiac catheterizations without the need for general anesthesia or an overnight hospital stay.



All this has helped boost demand for anesthesiologists and nurse anesthetists to administer the drugs -- demand they cannot always meet at busy hospitals and surgical centers. So more surgeons, gastroenterologists and other providers are pushing hospitals for the right to administer their own sedation. At the same time, some insurers are declining claims for anesthesiologist services during outpatient procedures such as colonoscopies.



The downside, safety experts warn, is that powerful sedatives are more often being administered by medical professionals who aren't adequately trained in anesthesia and safety practices, increasing the risks of respiratory complications, cardiac arrest, brain damage and even death. The University HealthSystem Consortium, which includes 95 of the nation's largest academic medical centers, says data presented at a recent meeting suggest there may be potentially 1,690 incidents a year nationwide related to sedation -- ranging from an overdose of drugs to a procedure that is started before a patient is adequately sedated.



Training and licensing standards vary from state to state. So to minimize risk, hospitals are adopting strict new credentialing programs for anyone who administers anesthesia, with recertification every two years. Hospitals are also conducting mock drills to test response in a sedation emergency and instituting stricter policies for monitoring patients.



"Advances in pharmacology have given us medicines that now permit much better patient comfort than ever before, but they also carry risks," says James Allen, professor of clinical internal medicine at the Ohio State University Medical Center and a member of a task force developing sedation guidelines for the UHC. "Because these drugs can cause more sedation than anticipated, the challenge is making sure the doctor not only has the skills to administer them but recognizes when there's a problem and knows how to deal with it."

Interesting society we have, isn't it?
http://internalmedicine.osu.edu/pulmonary/6442.cfm

 

[leopold]

sam
provide links to ANY case of death caused soley by a taser.

 

[S.A.M.]

yes cops are highly trained.

yes, knowing a cop will taser your ass will make most people think twice.

yes.

really sam a cop will not ask you if you have any medical conditions that will prohibit the use of tasers.
you'd love it if that was the case though wouldn't you.

anybody that is ranting and raving IS mentally ill.

tasers are neither the first or last line of defense.
verbal commands are the first.
being shot to death is the last.

the cop has to spend an ungodly amount of time in lawsuits justifying his use of the taser when his time could be better spent taking the trash of the streets.

in most cases none, he might be reassigned to another department.

as many times as needed.

quite a bit sam, now aswer my question.

So in effect there are no consequences to cops who may use tasers indiscriminately?

What are the guidelines for using a taser?

And I have known cops though not in the US.

 

[spidergoat]

So the excellent crime rates of the United States are a reflection of the effective methods used by the cops to combat crime?

And that is why the average American has such a lot of confidence in the cops?

Crime rates are not solely a reflection on the effectiveness of cops. There are systemic reasons for crime as well.

 

[leopold]

So in effect there are no consequences to cops who may use tasers indiscriminately?

this statement alone proves you have no idea what you are talking about sam.
where's the links to the cases i asked for?
provide links to the cases where cops used tasers "indiscriminately".

 

[S.A.M.]

sam
provide links to ANY case of death caused soley by a taser.

How would you define solely?

http://www.talkleft.com/story/2006/04/26/341/32835

Woman in Wheelchair Dies After Jolted By Taser
By TChris, Section Crime Policy
Posted on Wed Apr 26, 2006 at 07:22:58 AM EST

by TChris

Emily Marie Delafield was swinging a couple of knives and a hammer, but the threat posed by the 56 year old woman was lessened by her confinement to a wheelchair. The police in Green Cove Springs nonetheless shot her with a Taser. She lost consciousness and later died at a hospital.

This commentator argues convincingly that Taser use -- particularly in Florida -- is out of control.

And even though Scottsdale, Arizona-based Taser, Inc--the company that created it--said it should never be used on children or the elderly, Florida leads the nation in deaths by Taser. The oldest victim to date? Ninety-five. The youngest? A 6-year old boy.