That is the typical response by theists demonstrating their insufferable ignorance to the world around them. Each day we are presented with new discoveries that bring us closer to understanding the universe, which has to this point been found to be completely void of anything theists proclaim to exist. Unfortunately, the childhood fairy tales drilled into their heads leaves them open to such mystery-mongering folly creating in them a mental state of retardation, made only too evident in the above quote.
So where female Muslims go in the afterlife?
- Thread starter Syzygys
- Start date
That is the typical response by theists demonstrating their insufferable ignorance to the world around them. Each day we are presented with new discoveries that bring us closer to understanding the universe, which has to this point been found to be completely void of anything theists proclaim to exist. Unfortunately, the childhood fairy tales drilled into their heads leaves them open to such mystery-mongering folly creating in them a mental state of retardation, made only too evident in the above quote.
Let me put it this way. What you are is the sum of your genes and environment. Given a certain genetic makeup and put in a certain environment, one can predict your behaviour within a certain range. In fact, if I were to reach a point of knowledge where I knew all about your genes and all about your environment and the interaction between the two, I could probably tell you how you are going to behave in a certain situation. So, does this mean you are or you are not thinking for yourself?
You are barking up the wrong tree. What does it say in the Koran about genetics? Leaving that aside, we inherit our genes as part of a NATURAL not supernatural process. So there is no need to invoke a creator who decided what genes we would inherit and in what environment. If you truly believe in such a being why do you not detest him ?
You'd better sin all you can because you may still go to Paradise. What nonsense !
I gave you an analogy to the condition I propose. Address that analogy and let me know if you are thinking for yourself.
As for the rest, I think its important to understand that actions have consequences, sometimes unintended.
Our choices are limited but that makes them no less significant. We can provide the environment that define them for ourselves, as well as for those who follow the same path.
Since theists are left in a mental state of retardation, they are unable to distinguish between what constitutes doing intentional harm to others and what does not. Clearly, stealing from others would be doing harm to them.
Of course, the penalties for stealing in a theists world far outweigh any harm the thief could possibly have caused. By removing their hands, they become a far bigger detriment to society than criminal rehabilitation.
Of course, Allah created thieves for the sole purpose of stealing so that he may have his jollies watching them burn in hell. They cannot help themselves but steal, that is what Allah created them for. If you chop off their hands, you are preventing them from following Allah's will.
You are contradicting yourself. What you spoke of earlier was determinism. Th difference beytween us is that I can understand such a process without invoking a creator. If you believe in a god, as opposed to an impersonal process which make things the way they are, then your god can only be seen as a sadistic monster. Look at what is going on around you in the world and ask yourself whether your creator has made a good job of things
Yes, its really bad. Are you planning to leave anytime soon?
It's in the hands of Allah and, unlike you, I am not privy to his plans. I'll send you an email from Paradise, if the Huri leave me in peace.
I am stealing WITH handchopping. Most people only regret getting caught, not the crime itself...
Exactly. Which is why that is what is addressed in society, rather than the crime itself.
Religion on the other hand addresses the crime.
What is more important to KNOW what those consequences are. True story, Darwin award winner:
Dude's woodchopping machine gets stuck. He STEPPED inside the machine to unstuck it. I hope there is a good surgery/taxidermy department in heaven, because he arrived there in pieces.
So if you don't know what the consequences of your life are, it is pretty much the same than to think that there are NO consequences...
Anyway, my take is that you as a Muslim woman don't take literally the mysogynist teaching of the Muslim afterlife. Good for you...
So let's try to summarize, you believe there are 3 parts of afterlife:
-heaven for the worthy with positive rewards which can be reached faster for martyrs
-hell with punishments for the sinners
-in between place in the wall for neutral people who don't deserve either
Is it a correct summary of your beliefs? Mind you I like the wall idea, because lots of people are neutral, when it goes to reward/punishment, worthiness issues. They are not bad but not good enough either...
-heaven for the worthy with positive rewards which can be reached faster for martyrs
-hell with punishments for the sinners
-in between place in the wall for neutral people who don't deserve either
Is it a correct summary of your beliefs? Mind you I like the wall idea, because lots of people are neutral, when it goes to reward/punishment, worthiness issues. They are not bad but not good enough either...
None of the above.
Not even the middle one?
None of the above.
Rolleyes?? I have the right to roll my eyes because you can't describe in simple terms your beliefs...
Feel free to educate us. What I summarized is or should be the average Muslim's beliefs by the way...Now it is possible that your personal beliefs are completely different, but hey, than you are just a free thinking Muslim, but of course that is an oxymoron....
Depends on who you ask.
There are opinions in Islam, for example, which consider death to be a stage of evolution and resurrection (day of decision or resurrection) a movement to the next stage. In which case, hell or heaven are states or conditions which are perceived as such by those who exist in them and not by others.
Resurrection itself is divided into kubra or the greater, the rise of the people for reckoning, the wusta or middle, the passing away of a nation and the sughra or the passing away of the individual. As such what the individual does whether it be an atom of good or an atom of evil all contribute to the mizan or the balance in terms of wazn or weight.
I am trying hard to ask you, but having trouble getting a straight answer.
OK, this part doesn't contradict the heaven/hell issue.
This part doesn't explan the consequences issue. You know, the reward/punishment issues. We agreed that it is important.
So let's try again, do YOU personally think there is a physical existence in the afterlife and that the body is pleasured or punished depending on the person's actions in his/her life? Try to describe it for me like I was an 8 years old...
I already described my beliefs. Perhaps you should read them again.
Okay
"we" did not agree to anything. I said I believed that actions have consequences but what and how are unknown.
I already did. The answer is that you're superimposing my beliefs on your ideas of what they should be. e.g. do you believe there is a physical existence? As I already stated, it is not known. And if as some scholars maintain, it pertains to evolutionary circumstance, then it applies to the state of humanity as it exists and not corporeal existence, so your question is irrelevant.