samcdkey on Islam

Ahmed Osman said:
I like it when you are quoting a Hadith in stead of the Holy Quran - especially
when you discredited Hadiths in one of your former posts for beeing inaccurate - LOL ...

You are really becoming desperate now - aren´t you ;)

You believe in the Hadiths, right?
I quoted them for you. :)

I've studied the Quran, the history of the revelations and of Islam.

I've also studied how the Hadiths were collected and the Shariah was formed.

Just sharing my knowledge. ;)
 
Sam,

Moderator comment -

Please lay off the ad-hominen, it doesn't do your usual past demonstrable intellectual ability any justice.
 
Ahmed Osman said:
Very sensitive I guess ...........
I see that you are starting to change/delete your posts - samcdkey.
Do you have something to hide ?
You just deleted the post , where you wanted to place a boot in my ass !!

Should I report you for that one too ??
to ahmed.
this of conversations would get you no where.if samcdkey cant have a civilized conversation and has to lie to accomplish hes agenda thats hes problem.dont get draged.by now its ver obvious samcdkey is a novice that is here to missleed poeple.
 
Good I am glad that Ahmed and predator are reaching an understanding, even if it is against me. :)
 
Cris said:
Sam,

Moderator comment -

Please lay off the ad-hominen, it doesn't do your usual past demonstrable intellectual ability any justice.

Okay Cris, but it's a hard world when one cannot even remonstrate another on the lack of comprehension.

I'll just put him on Ignore.
 
samcdkey said:
Okay Cris, but it's a hard world when one cannot even remonstrate another on the lack of comprehension.

I'll just put him on Ignore.

Thank you kafir - I will take that as an admission of your total defeat :p
 
John99 said:
Come on Muslims no fighting.

That's not fighting. That's talking. But some people will cry "Mama" as soon as they start losing. ;)
 
Last edited:
samcdkey said:
Good I am glad that Ahmed and predator are reaching an understanding, even if it is against me. :)
and im surprised im not on your ignore list.what happend? :bugeye:
 
Oh I only keep people on my Ignore list for a short time. Everyone has something interesting to say once in while, don't you think? ;)
 
samcdkey said:
Oh I only keep people on my Ignore list for a short time. Everyone has something interesting to say once in while, don't you think? ;)
i have a lot to say but then i was occused of being a propoganda machine and you and billy t agreed and instigated against me.
 
You can still say it. There are a lot of other members on this forum. If anyone is interested in pursuing the topic, they will respond. Just pick a thread you are interested in and post.
 
samcdkey said:
You can still say it. There are a lot of other members on this forum. If anyone is interested in pursuing the topic, they will respond. Just pick a thread you are interested in and post.
off course i can say it-i dont need youre approval.
just makes me wonder,what possible interest you can have on calling me a propoganda machine? :eek:
 
Ahmed Osman, I’m Muslim and I have to say I’m ashamed of your behaviour. As the Prophet said, if you call another Muslim a disbeliever wrongly then that accusation will fall back on you. It is an act of disbelief to call another Muslim a disbeliever wrongly.

Hold your tongue.

.......................

Are you a takfiri?… :eek:
 
Ghost_007 said:
Ahmed Osman, I’m Muslim and I have to say I’m ashamed of your behaviour. As the Prophet said, if you call another Muslim a disbeliever wrongly then that accusation will fall back on you. It is an act of disbelief to call another Muslim a disbeliever wrongly.

Hold your tongue.

.......................

Are you a takfiri?… :eek:

Thank you for your wise post , Ghost, you are ofcourse right :)

No I am not a Takfiri , only an Imam - but calling Samcdkey a kafir, because she has broken the command of Allah from the Holy Quran 5:51 , is just !!!!

She is to be considered as a christian or jew now !!!!!

I do admire the knowledge of Samcdkey of the Quran and Hadiths - it is also admirable that she has done the Hajj - however , she has learned the Holy Scriptures like a computer or tape recorder - she can reproduce the Holy Text, but she does not understand the Spirit of the Holy Writing and do not let it enter into her heart ..........

That is very sad , with her knowledge she could be a star of guidance for other people, if only she would let the knowledge enter her heart ....

What is even worse - Samcdkey chooses what she want to obey from the Holy Writings and disregard the rest - very sad indeed !!!!

The Holy Quran says : Then is it only a part of the Book , that ye believe in , and do ye reject the rest ? But what is the reward for those amongst you, who behave like this but disgrace in this life ? And on the day of judgment
they shall be consigned to the most grievous penalty !!!!!!!!!!!

For those who are not aware what the words kafir and takfiri means :
kafir : infidel
takfiri : fanatic orthodox muslim , who excommunicate muslims, that are not worthy of beeing members of the family of Islam , they also are willing to kill
any nonmuslims - and muslims who convert away from islam .....

Samcdkey can still repent - convert from her fakir status into Islam again - AND THEN FOLLOW THE WORDS OF THE HOLY QURAN !!!!!!!!

In the end , ghost , this is a matter between Allah , the kafir samcdkey , and me the Imam !!! ;)
 
Last edited:
Hi Ahmad:

Sorry about losing my temper the other day.

I would advise you to learn Arabic before reaching conclusions about what the Quran said.

This is the position of a learned Islamic scholar on your question.



Wa`alaykum As-Salamu Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh.

In The Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.

Dear questioner, thank you very much for having confidence in us, and we hope our efforts, which are purely for Allah's Sake, meet your expectations.

In the first place, we would like to stress that Islam urges all Muslims to deal kindly and justly with all people. Muslims should have good relations with all people. At school, at work, in your neighborhood, etc., you should be kind and courteous to everyone. Muslims are allowed to have non-Muslims as friends as long as they keep their own faith and commitment to Islam pure and strong. Allah has clearly forbidden Muslims from fighting those who fight not their faith or drive them out from their homes. Referring to this, [Allah forbids you not with regard to those who fight you not for your faith, nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them. For Allah loves those who are just. Allah only forbids you with regard to those who fight you for your faith, and drive you out of your homes and support others in driving you out, from turning to them for protection (or taking them as wali). Those who seek their protection they are indeed wrong- doers.] (Al-Mumtahinah 60: 8-9)

In his response to the question, Dr. Muzammil Siddiqi, President of the Fiqh Council ofNorth America, states:

The Qur'an does not say that non-Muslims cannot be Muslims' friends, nor does it forbid Muslims to be friendly to non-Muslims. There are many non-Muslims who are good friends of Muslim individuals and the Muslim community. There are also many good Muslims who truly and sincerely observe their faith and are very friendly to many non-Muslims at the same time.

Islam teaches us that we should be friendly to all people. Islam teaches us that we should deal even with our enemies with justice and fairness. Allah says in the Qur'an in the beginning of the same Surat Al-Ma’dah: [O you who believe! Stand out firmly for Allah as witnesses to fair dealings and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just, that is next to piety. Fear Allah, indeed Allah is well-acquainted with all that you do.] (Al-Ma’dah 5 :8)

In another place in the Qur'an, Allah Almighty says:

[Allah forbids you not with regard to those who fight you not for your faith, nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them. For Allah loves those who are just. Allah only forbids you with regard to those who fight you for your faith, and drive you out of your homes and support others in driving you out, from turning to them for protection (or taking them as wali). Those who seek their protection they are indeed wrong- doers.] (Al-Mumtahinah 60: 8-9)

Moreover, Allah Almighty has described Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) as "a mercy" to the worlds. He was a sign of Allah's Mercy to all, Muslims as well as non-Muslims. In his kindness and fair treatment he did not make any difference between the believers and non-believers. He was kind to the pagans of Makkah and fought them only when they fought him. He made treaties with the Jews of Madinah and honored the treaties until they broke them.

He (peace and blessings be upon him) is reported to have received the Christians of Najran with kindness in his Masjid in Madinah. They argued with him about Islam, but he returned them with honor and respect. There are many examples from his life that show that he was the friendliest person to all people.

In the verse you quoted, the word "Awliya" is used. It is a plural and its singular is "wali". The correct translation of the word ""wali"" is not "friend" but it is someone who is very close and intimate. It is also used to mean "guardian, protector, patron, lord and master".

In the Qur'an this word is used for God, such as [Allah is the Protector (or Lord and Master) of those who believe. He takes them out from the depths of darkness to light…] (Al- Baqarah 2: 257)

There are many other references in the Qur'an that give this meaning. The same word is also sometimes used in the Qur'an for human beings, such as [And whosoever is killed unjustly, We have granted his next kin "wali" the authority (to seek judgement or punishment in this case)…] (Al-‘Isra' 17 :33)

The correct translation of the verse in Surat Al-Ma’idah is: [O you who believe! Do not take Jews and Christians as your patrons. They are patrons of their own people. He among you who will turn to them for patronage is one of them. Verily Allah guides not a people unjust.] (Al-Ma'dah 5: 51)

It is obvious that Jews patronize the Jews and Christians patronize the Christians, so why not Muslims patronize Muslims and support their own people. This verse is not telling us to be against Jews or Christians, but it is telling us that we should take care of our own people and we must support each other.

In his Tafsir, (Qur’an exegesis) Imam Ibn Kathir has mentioned that some scholars say that this verse (i.e. the one you referred to) was revealed after the Battle of Uhud when Muslims had a set back. At that time, a Muslim from Madinah said, "I am going to live with Jews so I shall be safe in case another attack comes on Madinah." And another person said, "I am going to live with Christians so I shall be safe in case another attack comes on Madinah." So Allah revealed this verse reminding the believers that they should not seek the protection from others, but should protect each other. (See Ibn Kathir, Al-Tafsir, vol. 2, p. 68)

Muslims are allowed to have non-Muslims as friends as long as they keep their own faith and commitment to Islam pure and strong. You are correct in pointing out that a Muslim man is also allowed to marry a Jewish or Christian woman. It is obvious that one marries someone for love and friendship. If friendship between Muslims and Jews or Christians was forbidden, then why would Islam allow a Muslim man to marry a Jew or Christian woman? It is the duty of Muslims to patronize Muslims. They should not patronize any one who is against their faith or who fights their faith, even if they were their fathers and brothers. Allah says: [O you who believe! Take not for protectors (awliya') your fathers and your brothers if they love unbelief above faith. If any of you do so, they are indeed wrong-doers.] (Al-Tawbah 9: 23)

In a similar way, the Qur'an also tells Muslims that they should never patronize the non-Muslims against other Muslims. However, if some Muslims do wrong to some non-Muslims, it is Muslims' duty to help the non-Muslims and save them from oppression. The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said that he himself will defend a Dhimmi living among Muslims to whom injustice is done by Muslims. But Islam also teaches that Muslims should not seek the patronage of non-Muslims against other Muslims. They should try to solve their problems among themselves. Allah Almighty says, [Let not the Believers take the unbelievers as their patrons over against the Believers…] (Aal-'Imran 3: 28)

He Almighty also says: [O you who believe! Take not for patrons unbelievers rather than Believers. Do you wish to offer Allah an open proof against yourselves?] (An-Nisaa’ 4:144)
 
Last edited:
Hey Osman

i hope all is good with you.

Whats all you beef with Sam, i have loads of non muslims friends and there aint shit wrong with that?.... ???

So what makes you a knower of all when it comes to islam....

So
 
samcdkey said:
Does not mean I am blind to their faults. If I meet a Muslim, I may feel kinship similar to one I feel with an Indian, but if either of them is an ass or behaves rudely with a non-Muslim or a non-Indian who is a dear friend, I'll give them a solid kick in the ass. Hard!!!!

That would be the distinct difference between you and I, resorting to physical violence when you feel justified in using violence. A huge flaw in your religion. Do you now understand how easy it is for extremists to make similar decisions when their religion condones violence?
 
(Q) said:
That would be the distinct difference between you and I, resorting to physical violence when you feel justified in using violence. A huge flaw in your religion. Do you now understand how easy it is for extremists to make similar decisions when their religion condones violence?

My resorting to violence is a character flaw, not a religious one.

And it's mostly venting, Gandhiji.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top