Religion vs. Thought

Just 'doctorinal errors!'

Originally posted by Godless
like talking to a brain washed cult leader!.

Everything is evil, except his worthless book, I mean the liers bible, I mean, well the ancient scriptures that are incoherent, full of nonsence, and plenty of contradictions.

BTW, if you would like to understand these types of personality look at my posts on Xenophobia. :D
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Godless is still Godless, untill he looks in the mirror!:D

The 'contradictions' me and Tony1 had above was of his error in doctorine of the immortality of Man, Saint and Sinners HAS AN IMMORTAL SOUL AND SPIRIT everybody has! And will go imeadiately to Heaven (God's preasents) when the Saint dies! And will return to Earth with Him at the 'Rapure of the Church' and Jesus's 2cd. comming to set up His kingdom on the Earth! And the sinners will go to Hell to await the judgment in the last days at the Great White Throne of God after the 'Tousand year rule of JESUS on Earth!' But Jesus can still save in this life, and He is waiting and willing to make life a new for all that trust Him! He is very real person! The Supreme Being! But can have a friend ship with Him, fellowship, and freedoms you did not know about in the world! He is defintely not a 'kill-joy'! But a greater joy He can bring!:)
 
The Holy Bible is 100% Absolute Truth from GOD!

Originally posted by Xelios
I know not "Swordfish" nor "Project Wyze," But I did not say all other music is all 'bad' I do ocassionally listen to modern music as long as it is in 'good taste' and not offensive!

Swordfish is a movie. The soundtrack to it includes mostly techno music, all "instruments" and no words. Project Wyze is a modern rock band. I have no idea what type of lyrics you find are demonic, so I can't really tell you whether they would fit into your devil music folder or not.

But mostly music that be to the Glory of GOD!

Some people find that music offensive, it all depends on your point of view. And remember, no one's opinion is any more important than anyone elses.

You see, it's not that I don't respect your opinion and views. I just can't say I share them. My view is there is no such thing as God, that religion was created to help less advanced people before us explain our existance, and everyday phenomena. The Bible was written to back up this explanation, not as the "absolute truth". It's nothing more than a book depicting a child's view on life, sadly, it's gotten a little out of hand.
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The Bible, GOD's Holy Word is from Himslef to us! He is not of this world; but is our Creator, and is not a childs view of life!
Athieisum is a more 'childish' and self-centerd of all idiums! The ignorance of not believeing in God is that to disregard something that you really don't understand! Unscientific! Where is your curiositiy?:) Well the Bible says ye are dead to the things of your Creator! But you will find out He is very real, and I hope that it would be in this life! Not the next! My Jesus and I would not want you and others to go to that ETERNAL TORMENT! That is, totle separation from GOD forever, but in His wrath! Live and learn that the Lord is good ! Jesus saves!
 
The Bible, GOD's Holy Word is from Himslef to us! He is not of this world; but is our Creator, and is not a childs view of life!

I know that's your opinion, and I respect that. I just don't have to agree with it.

Athieisum is a more 'childish' and self-centerd of all idiums!

Childish? Self-centered? You are easily explaining religion there. Science is the quest for knowlege of how the universe came to be and how it works, hardly childish. Science states we are nothing special when it comes to the universe, hardly self-centered.

The ignorance of not believeing in God is that to disregard something that you really don't understand!

I have no desire to really understand it, because I have no wish to be caught up in the same cult based on a best selling novel someone wrote 2000 years ago.

Unscientific! Where is your curiositiy?

You're right, religion is very unscientific. You cannot use scientific terms to explain any aspect of religion because the two are exact opposites. As for my curiosity, it's alive and well, which is why I'm itent on finding out how and why the universe works, and how it came to be in the first place. I'm not going to church every Sunday and simply accepting we're here because God put us here. Where is the curiosity in that?

My Jesus and I would not want you and others to go to that ETERNAL TORMENT!

My pet lizard would not want you to believe in such nonsense, but that doesn't seem to be happening :(
 
Athieisum=pure ignorance!

Hi!:)

Athieisum is a childish, selfcentered, 'me' complex of the human heart!

Christ and His teachings are positive and for the good of all! Love and brotherhood, and not like unto any other 'religion' on Earth! Because our GOD is GOD and is the Creator and sustainer of life on Earth and all the stars and galaxies beyond what telescopes can see, and that to which is far beyond our consepts! Ours is a Faith in the 'Living GOD'! We all were made in His image, and all of us have an immortal soul and spirit that WILL spend eternity somewhere, ether Heaven in peace, or in Hell in torment & the 2cd. DEATH! That is why we must warn you of the '2cd. DEATH'! It's very real, and GOD would rather have you saved, then to go to that 'finel destination'!
 
Re: Re: Re: The 'soul' that sinneth, shall die!

*Originally posted by Sir. Loone
The "Bosom of Abraham" was where the dead that believed on God went, 'before' the death and resurection of JESUS!*

Nope.
They went to the grave.

Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
(Acts 2:29, KJV).

*And "Absent from the body is to be preasent with the Lord!"*

That isn't what it says.

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
(2 Corinthians 5:8, KJV).

Notice how it says we are "willing" to be like that.
It doesn't say we are like that.

Here is what actually happens...

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
(Ecclesiastes 9:5, KJV).

*Originally posted by Teg
That is called a god-complex. *

There's just one teeny problem with saying that.
If everyone who is the purveyor of truth has a god-complex, then you have a god-complex, too, or you are not telling the truth.
Take your pick.

*you are too good for a superiority complex.*

Hey! Right on.

*Do you see dead people often?*

He WAS dead.
He isn't dead any more.

*Originally posted by Sir. Loone
And Tony1 was wrong on that all unbelievers don't have immortal souls*

Nope.

The soul that sinneth, it shall die....
(Ezekiel 18:20, KJV).

"Immortal" means "can't die."
That verse says "shall die."
Those two things are opposites.

That immortal soul thing comes from Plato, not the Bible, and here's the quote...

---Plato - Soul
The soul is in the very likeness of the divine, and immortal, and intellectual, and uniform, and indissoluble, and unchangeable; and the body is in the very likeness of the human, and mortal, and unintellectual, and multiform, and dissoluble, and changeable.
-- Phaedo 80b (Jowett)---

Youi shouldn't really be preaching ancient Greek philosophy and calling it Christian.

*Originally posted by Xelios
Science is the quest for knowlege of how the universe came to be and how it works*

Great for questing, but a little short on answers.
 
The 'soul' that sinneth, shall die!

Originally posted by tony1
*Originally posted by Sir. Loone
The "Bosom of Abraham" was where the dead that believed on God went, 'before' the death and resurection of JESUS!*

Nope.
They went to the grave.
The thief on the cross(Luke 23:42-43) "And he said unto Je'sus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. 43) And Je'sus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise." The thief did go to Heaven in spirit and soul! Only the body remains in the Earth.

Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
(Acts 2:29, KJV).
David's body is here to this day, but not his soul! His soul and spirit is with the Lord.

*And "Absent from the body is to be preasent with the Lord!"*

That isn't what it says.

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
(2 Corinthians 5:8, KJV).

Notice how it says we are "willing" to be like that.
It doesn't say we are like that."Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it." (ECCLESIASTIES 12:7)KJV. the soul and spirit does not cease to exist but will go unto God who gave it.

Here is what actually happens...

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
(Ecclesiastes 9:5, KJV). The body only is what refurred to! But the soul & spirit is in Abrahams Bossum at that time.

*Originally posted by Teg
That is called a god-complex. *

There's just one teeny problem with saying that.
If everyone who is the purveyor of truth has a god-complex, then you have a god-complex, too, or you are not telling the truth.
Take your pick.

*you are too good for a superiority complex.*

Hey! Right on.

*Do you see dead people often?*

He WAS dead.
He isn't dead any more.

*Originally posted by Sir. Loone
And Tony1 was wrong on that all unbelievers don't have immortal souls*

Nope.

The soul that sinneth, it shall die....
(Ezekiel 18:20, KJV).

"Immortal" means "can't die."
That verse says "shall die."
Those two things are opposites.

That immortal soul thing comes from Plato, not the Bible, and here's the quote...

---Plato - Soul
The soul is in the very likeness of the divine, and immortal, and intellectual, and uniform, and indissoluble, and unchangeable; and the body is in the very likeness of the human, and mortal, and unintellectual, and multiform, and dissoluble, and changeable.
-- Phaedo 80b (Jowett)---

Youi shouldn't really be preaching ancient Greek philosophy and calling it Christian.

*Originally posted by Xelios
Science is the quest for knowlege of how the universe came to be and how it works*

Great for questing, but a little short on answers.
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There's just one teeny problem with saying that.
If everyone who is the purveyor of truth has a god-complex, then you have a god-complex, too, or you are not telling the truth.
Take your pick.
Click to expand...
Lying is not something that well suits you. I may have said that I know to a degree of certainty or that I am searching for the truth toa shadow of doubt. I never claimed absolute truth. It would seem that your little statement at the end holds no weight.
He WAS dead.
He isn't dead any more.
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Really? Then where is he? Why have I nor, 5 billion other people (not including a segment of the Catholic population) seen him. Is he wearing some sort of cloaking device?
 
Sir Loone,

I will ask you the same question I ask every Christian:

The Bible has been mistranslated and misinterpreted for centuries, yet Christians base their entire Life on it. The Bible has been tampered with by many Early Church Leaders, Books have been taken out of the Bible and there has been obvious inserts. As many quotes where Jesus states he is "God" I can find double that prove just the opposite. Thus, there are contradictions in the Bible. Why would you put your complete Faith in such a Book????? How could one allow themselves to follow the Bible knowing all this???? It just Boggles my mind!!!!!! I will never understand Christians or any other religion for that matter.

"God" is not a "He". "God" is Everything

THE UNIVERSE

Peace
 
Re: The 'soul' that sinneth, shall die!

*Originally posted by Sir. Loone
The thief on the cross(Luke 23:42-43) "And he said unto Je'sus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. 43) And Je'sus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise." The thief did go to Heaven in spirit and soul! Only the body remains in the Earth.*

You're basing an awful lot on a single comma which wasn't there in the original.
We know it wasn't there because Jesus didn't go to heaven that day.

After Jesus was resurrected he said he hadn't gone to the Father yet.
Why? Because he actually DIED and went to the GRAVE.

Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
(John 20:17, KJV).

*David's body is here to this day, but not his soul! His soul and spirit is with the Lord.*

His spirit is with God, indeed, but his soul is dead.
Either, that or he is sleeping.

So David slept with his fathers, and was buried in the city of David.
(1 Kings 2:10, KJV).

But, weren't you saying there is no such thing as "soul-sleep?"
Therefore he is dead.

*"Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it." (ECCLESIASTIES 12:7)KJV. the soul and spirit does not cease to exist but will go unto God who gave it. *

The verse you quoted says nothing about the soul.

The soul that sinneth, it shall die. ...
(Ezekiel 18:20, KJV).

Ezekiel is clear that the soul DIES.
Furthermore, the spirit does not feel anything or know anything or do anything.

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
(Ecclesiastes 9:5, KJV).

Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is NO work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.
(Ecclesiastes 9:10, KJV).

*The body only is what refurred to! But the soul & spirit is in Abrahams Bossum at that time. *

It doesn't say "body only," it says "the dead."
Since when does the body have knowledge or wisdom, anyway?
Your mind would have that.

*Originally posted by Teg
Lying is not something that well suits you.*

You've established a pattern.
Every time I point out a flaw in your reasoning, you accuse me of lying.
It's getting to be a pretty reliable signal.

*Really? Then where is he?*

But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;
(Hebrews 10:12, KJV).
 
JESUS is real as you are and He is GOD?

" JESUS is real as you are and He is GOD! "

Can you be so kind as to tell me where in the bible it says this? I need to know exactly where in the book it say this. Please quote chapter and verse. I don't wanna know what someone who lived 400 years after Jesus {PBUH} states. Where in the book does Jesus {PBUH} state that "I AM GOD?"

_____

While I am not Christian, I am a believer in He that created us. I give Him the praise for He alone is worthy of praise. I do not worship His creations for then I would be guilty of the worse sin of all. Do not put Gods with GOD. He {GOD} has no equals. The creation is His alone. He needs no helpers. When He intends a thing, He says be, and it is.

____________________

I wonder. Does one praise the FEDEX guy for delivering the message or does one praise the sender of the message?
 
Re: Re: The 'soul' that sinneth, shall die!

Originally posted by tony1
*Originally posted by Sir. Loone
The thief on the cross(Luke 23:42-43) "And he said unto Je'sus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. 43) And Je'sus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise." The thief did go to Heaven in spirit and soul! Only the body remains in the Earth.*Was not in the original? Jesus said it, it is in the Holy Scriptures, and when Jesus rose from the dead He lead captivity captive, and the soul and spirit of the thief and all that died before that were the Saints of the God of Abraham, go directly into heaven with Jesus! They and all that dies in Christ Jesus shall not die, but go unto the Father in Heaven. Because, of Jesus's work on the cross, our sins are paid in full! So we do not cease to exist, but shall be with Him in Paradise, and will return with Him to Earth at the resurrection of the dead,(the dead in the grave) reunited to a 'gloryfied body' like unto His own!:) Much better picture of what Jesus has done for us! I have much more scriptures and commentaries from well known Pasters and teachers, but my time lately was retrained.:bugeye: I will come back with their quotes of there is no 'soul sleep', backed up with much scripture and commentairies from many I have read, and some I have gotten mail from! JESUS has made a way into Heaven for us! The earthly body is the only thing that dies, and is in the grave! I in no ways would make this up!:) I resurch before I post, and will be back with much more Scriptures to this matter of 'soul sleep'.

You're basing an awful lot on a single comma which wasn't there in the original.
We know it wasn't there because Jesus didn't go to heaven that day.

After Jesus was resurrected he said he hadn't gone to the Father yet.
Why? Because he actually DIED and went to the GRAVE.

Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
(John 20:17, KJV).

*David's body is here to this day, but not his soul! His soul and spirit is with the Lord.*

His spirit is with God, indeed, but his soul is dead.
Either, that or he is sleeping.:)His soul and spirit is with the Lord! Soul, in the Bible was interpited as the body or the soul inmatterial, and was refurring mostly to the 'body' when it says that one was dead. Not the inmatterial soul, the soul is you, your thoughts, and caractor, feelings, memmory, you! So is your spirit. His soul lives in Heave now! But only his body is in the earth! Remmeber Jesus has lead captivity captive! And now all that die in the Lord, go unto the Lord and will return with Him at the reasurrection day!

So David slept with his fathers, and was buried in the city of David.
(1 Kings 2:10, KJV).Now he is in the preasence of GOD!

But, weren't you saying there is no such thing as "soul-sleep?"
Therefore he is dead.But he lives with Jesus!

*"Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it." (ECCLESIASTIES 12:7)KJV. the soul and spirit does not cease to exist but will go unto God who gave it. *

The verse you quoted says nothing about the soul.

The soul that sinneth, it shall die. ...
(Ezekiel 18:20, KJV).

Ezekiel is clear that the soul DIES.
Furthermore, the spirit does not feel anything or know anything or do anything.

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
(Ecclesiastes 9:5, KJV).That is speaking of the body! The soul and spirit of a man created in the image of God is immortal!

Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is NO work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.
(Ecclesiastes 9:10, KJV).

*The body only is what refurred to! But the soul & spirit is in Abrahams Bossum at that time. *

It doesn't say "body only," it says "the dead."
Since when does the body have knowledge or wisdom, anyway?
Your mind would have that.[color=dark-blue]Revelation 6:9-11 KJV:[/color]9)"And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10) And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

11) And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet a little season, until their fellowservents also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled."

They are aware of things in Heaven and Earth! They live apart from their bodies, (living souls) and can even speak! There is no soul sleep! Not a contridiction of Ecc. 9:10! Which refures to the body in the grave!:)

*Originally posted by Teg
Lying is not something that well suits you.*

You've established a pattern.
Every time I point out a flaw in your reasoning, you accuse me of lying.
It's getting to be a pretty reliable signal.

*Really? Then where is he?*

But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;
(Hebrews 10:12, KJV).
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Tony1: You've established a pattern.
Every time I point out a flaw in your reasoning, you accuse me of lying.
It's getting to be a pretty reliable signal.
Click to expand...
I agree, when you invent a flaw where none exists, I accuse you of lying. I also accuse you of lying on all the other occassions in which you engage this tactic. You used false evidence. I have never claimed absolute truth. All one needs do is look through my posts. You on the other hand claim it with impudence. Your argument is thus rendered illogical.

I have been contemplating the Jerusalim problem. My solution involved complete irradiation of the territory. The disputed land would be rendered undesirable. Both sides Israel and Palestine are children. Their toy needs be removed from the equation. They won't share it and neither will relent. In that situation you must deny both.
 
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Think!

"THE FOOL HAS SAID IN HIS HEART, 'THERE IS NO GOD!" Teg we know better! Beware the Anti-Christ!:eek:
 
Loone,

"THE FOOL HAS SAID IN HIS HEART, ‘THERE IS NO GOD!" Teg we know better! Beware the Anti-Christ!
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Propaganda is always used by the weak and failing. Christian propaganda is inevitable because they have no arguments of any substance and have no choice but to revert to the bitterness and desperation of childish name-calling.

Loone, if you think there is a god, prove it, otherwise keep your insults to yourself.

Cris
 
Maybe it's me. It would seem that for one to be Christian, one must follow the Christ. I read these posts and it seems that for the most part, those who claim to be Christian are nothing but followers of that mad man. He, in an attempt to make that which Jesus {PBUH} was sent with palatable to the non-Jews of his day, decide that the Law was no longer of any use so let's just do away with it shall we. Is not Jesus {PBUH} the one to be followed? I believed the Jesus {PBUH} followed the Law of Moses {PBUH}. Why would Jesus {PBUH} live a life time and never once command that the law should be done away when but some mad man, who never saw Jesus {PBUH}, never spoke to Jesus {PBUH} questioned the law. Those who claimed to follow Jesus {PBUH} pretty much went along with it {with the exception of a few that were put to death because they objected when this mad man corrupted true Christianity}.

The point. Who do Christians follow, Jesus {PBUH} or the mad man? If you say Jesus {PBUH}, then why do you not follow that which he taught?
 
Yes GOD is

GOD is. Proof. Look within yourselves. Look outside of yourself. GOD is if only you truly wanted to see. GOD IS. That's the proof I offer. It's all you really need. The blind man will not see. The deaf will not hear. If you want to see you will. The proof is not for me to show you for it's as plan as the nose on your face. You have just chosen not to see.
 
dkb,

Hi and welcome to sciforums.

GOD is. Proof. Look within yourselves. Look outside of yourself. GOD is if only you truly wanted to see. GOD IS. That's the proof I offer. It's all you really need. The blind man will not see. The deaf will not hear.
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I’ve looked inside and out and I see no gods. And I’m not blind or deaf. But gods cannot be seen, they are immaterial, and invisible, and never speak. So there is no wonder they cannot be seen or heard.

If you want to see you will.
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Ah ha now we approach the real issue. It is not objective proof you are offering but imaginative fantasies. What you’re saying is that if you can imagine a god then those things will be real for you. Such people are usually best suited to hospitals for the mentally challenged.

The proof is not for me to show you for it's as plan as the nose on your face. You have just chosen not to see.
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Have you ever tried looking at your nose without a mirror? Of course yours might be large I guess. But you’re right I have chosen not to see immaterial invisible things mainly because my mind is grounded in reality not fantasy. And I quite well understand why you are refusing to show people these gods, because you can’t see them either, right?

So it doesn’t look like you’ve offered any proof, but rather have tried to convince people to create delusions for themselves. And of course give themselves headaches by trying to look at their noses.

Try again.

Cris
 
The Truth!

Originally posted by Cris
Loone,

Propaganda is always used by the weak and failing. Christian propaganda is inevitable because they have no arguments of any substance and have no choice but to revert to the bitterness and desperation of childish name-calling.

Loone, if you think there is a god, prove it, otherwise keep your insults to yourself.

Cris
Click to expand...
The proof is all around you! And He is omnipresent! He is GOD Supreme! You are proof! Your mate is proof! And the Heavens declares the Glory of GOD! And you are in denial of truth, because you for get, you are 'spiritauly dead', and know nothing of GOD and His love towards you! Try this! Have a long talk with JESUS Himself! Try it! He is very real and a ever present help when all else fails! Just try it some times, but be warned, He is King of the Universe, and you must humble yourself before your Creator and sustainer of life! Try it!:)
 
God the Father: The Bible never says otherwise!

Originally posted by LIGHTBEING
Sir Loone,

I will ask you the same question I ask every Christian:

The Bible has been mistranslated and misinterpreted for centuries, yet Christians base their entire Life on it. The Bible has been tampered with by many Early Church Leaders, Books have been taken out of the Bible and there has been obvious inserts. As many quotes where Jesus states he is "God" I can find double that prove just the opposite. Thus, there are contradictions in the Bible. Why would you put your complete Faith in such a Book????? How could one allow themselves to follow the Bible knowing all this???? It just Boggles my mind!!!!!! I will never understand Christians or any other religion for that matter.

The Bible is the inerrent Word of GOD! We were just having differances in doctrinal interpitation, but ether way the fate of the 'unGodly' will be eternal, and will have pain and suffering in Hell and the Lake of Fire but can not stop the pain and the quelching of pain that one can do in life, you could not do in Hell! The consiquencess are far too awful to discribe, the eternal damnation of lost souls! And Heaven is quite the opposite! When one dies, they do not cease to exist, but go to their doom or Heavenly bliss with friends and family and the Saviour Jesus! When He comes, He will bring order to this world! We work out doctrinal diferances, still the lost should be warned of their HORRIBLE FATE!If they reject JESUS and His Holy Word! Jesus saves!


"God" is not a "He". "God" is EverythingGod is not eveything! He is above time & space and the matteral world! He is refurred to only as God the Father, Son,(JESUS) and Holy Spirit, and 'He' is mentioned, only in the Holy Bible! "Jesus is the very image of the invisible GOD!" Know Him! And love Him! He loves you!:)

FAR ABOVE THE UNIVERSE, AND IS OMNIPRESENT! :D

Peace
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