Reasons not to believe in God
- Thread starter Magical Realist
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Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
I tried to show 7 blind men an elephant once. Looks like I'm getting the same result here.
You tried to show 7 blind men men an elephant?
Why would you do that?
Didn't you get that they were blind, meaning they couldn't see (in case you didn't know)?
Oh wait! You're insinuating that I'm blind.
Okay, I'll leave this ignorant-ass thread and let you jack-off in peace.
bye
jan.
Tease.
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
If you need directions to the EXIT let me know..;-)
I'll just keep going till the stench of ignorance completely fades out, but thanks all the same.
By the way, this is classic..
''Let's not be facetious here. I think you well know how deformed babies is a reason why God doesn't exist''
:roflmao:
jan.
The reason to not believe in god, at least for the most dominant, religions being, Islam , Christian and Judaism
Is that there is a redeemer complex, as John lash calls is it
Meaning that the aggressor is free from any responsibility for their actions
Gnostics were appalled by this aspect of this new religion by the way
So once burden is lifted from the aggressor then any attack can be justified and the viciousness of the attack as well
To look a little deeper into the roots of all these religions look up Zaddikim and Zadok of which Jesus was a rebel leader believe it or not
This info was gathered from the Dead Sea Scrolls
Is that there is a redeemer complex, as John lash calls is it
Meaning that the aggressor is free from any responsibility for their actions
Gnostics were appalled by this aspect of this new religion by the way
So once burden is lifted from the aggressor then any attack can be justified and the viciousness of the attack as well
To look a little deeper into the roots of all these religions look up Zaddikim and Zadok of which Jesus was a rebel leader believe it or not
This info was gathered from the Dead Sea Scrolls
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
Still here I see. Guess you haven't found it yet..moron...
romnickhudges
Registered Senior Member
I don't think there is a reason not to believe in God. I don't know how others handle their faith with their God but if you really a good follower of your God whatever religion you are in then there's no room for you to doubt it.
Presumably the Dead Sea Scrolls were associated with the residents of Qumran, since they were found near the site. It's always possible that someone else stashed them there. But I think modern wisdom links the documents with these people, the Essenes, who were apparently dissatisfied with the direction the Sadducees and Pharisees were taking Judaism, and migrated to the desert and built Qumran as their holy city. The incident in the temple, and others, where Jesus rebukes the Sadducees and Pharisees, almost seems like a dramatization of the Essene disgust with them for their pollution of the sacred religion.
While digging for water the Essenes discovered there was useful rock to be quarried, which they traded for supplies from other people in the region. The quarries turned into bath houses, and this may explain the reference to John baptizing in the wilderness. For all we know John is a metaphor for the Essenes. The Zealots arose in Jerusalem, defending the Temple from Roman desecration. One likely place for a Zealot to hide would be in Qumran, where, if Romans did bother to search the town, provided those secret caves nearby for hideouts. The Essenes probably gave the Zealots sanctuary. For all we know, the Essenes were the most outraged by the desecration of the temple, and most likely to fight to defend it. So Qumran could have been the birthplace of Zealotry.
If John represents the Essenes, then Jesus probably represents the Zealots, who were crucified for their resistance to Roman authority. Hanging mutilated bodies up in public display was an effective way to terrorize the populace into submission, even to motivate informants. Peter's denial of Jesus and his betrayal by Judas seem to symbolize this period when Zealots stopped standing up for each other and their acquaintances would have been motivated to turn them in, to end the rebellion and get the Roman legion out of Jerusalem.
The connection between Jesus and the Zaddikim fits within this scenario. The pronunciation is similar to Sadducee. In any case, it puts Jesus in a class of people who the Essenes may have considered humble and pious, the traits given to Jesus in the story. We only know him as Iesu, the Greek name, so there are many possibilities for how the Essenes may have arrived at this name, if, in fact, he is some sort of dramatic character they invented. I'm assuming the Jesus story is nothing more than one of their sagas about the war with Rome. Unfortunately, it became misunderstood as a literal account of history. Clearly it's not.
Then who is responsible for birth defects? That was the question in play.
In the passage "visiting the sins of the fathers upon the sons" God is putting a curse on the children of the evil-doers. It's consistent with the many themes that humans must suffer because of the sin of Adam and Eve. It's a pretty basic concept that pervades Christianity since the founding fathers first started the ball rolling. You'll find it throughout Christian literature.
I did it for money. I was between semesters, scraping to get by. Anyone would have responded the same as me.
But this ties in with the gruesome images of deformity that were given above. The assumption that God intervenes in the fate of humans is inconsistent with your belief that each is responsible for his own actions. The implication is that God punishes innocent children for crimes they did not commit, by giving them debilitating and fatal congenital anomalies. Therein lies the rub.
lmao
False religions have false ideas, I don't buy into them. Every real scientist knows that birth defects are defects in nature due to cause and effect. I don't think anyone here would suggest that they are a part of the necessary evolutionary, experimental progress towards the ultimate organism.
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Magical, what are you saying, I thought you were much stronger than that?
You have experienced, or are experiencing a hell of a life, subconciously or otherwise. You have a lot of unidentified pain, misapprehension and loss. No, it will not go away over night. Try this, get down on your knees in a private place, and invite God to relate to you. Say, "Lord God, if you don't show me who you are I will never know if you exist or not, forgive me if I have ruined my ability to know any better and don't let me down, give me whatever it takes, give me a reason to feel validated in my existence." It's an experiment.
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Hey, I've conducted that experiment before! Wanna know my results?
You know... Pain is a part of life. So is loss and tragedy. It doesn't matter how strong a believer you are, you'll be affected by living. The guilt trip of acting like we fail our destiny by not embracing primitive superstitions doesn't hold much merit when you actually measure the world.
Stronger than that? If he's strong, he doesn't need to augment his strength with imaginary beings, does he? Needing a divine loving imaginary friend isn't a sign of strength.
Of course life is much the same for all of us, I wasn't brave enough to go it alone, and in my circumstances not too many would have been able to survive and still have half normality of mind. Imaginary friends would not have sufficed, it had to be physically real - on thousands of occasions.
It's impossible to do this experiment with honesty and not get results.
But what if you are used to pretending in life? Pretending to be someone you're not? You have to be as sincere as if your life is at stake - because it is!
We normally don't feel any need to call on God, it's part of the inherited state of mind.
And we don't have to relate, but then, we miss out on whatever might transpire between us and God. It's different and personal and individual for everyone, as if there were no other person on earth.
True or False: God curses children with birth defects to teach them a lesson?
Not sure what you mean by real. You either studied biology or you didn't. You either studied probability theory or you didn't. Any scientist necessarily studied both courses. Any scientist therefore knows that congenital anomalies (excluding those caused by accident, injury, illness or substance abuse) have no cause. They are purely random.
The choice of genes during meiosis is purely random. So is fertilization. Excluding the cases where illness or substance abuse damaged the embryo, congenital anomalies are purely random.
The question was whether this is God's visitation of the sins of the parents upon their children, whether God put a curse innocent descendants of evil-doers, as the literally interpreted Bible would have us believe, regardless of whether a religion is true or not.
It's one of the many fallacies of reading the Bible literally. It produces one of the many paradoxes that Jews and Christians have grappled with since antiquity.
It's one of the main reasons Fundamentalism is widely regarded by Orthodox believers to be a false religion.
In order to be true, whether you are talking about a belief system or not, there has to be a consistency of the logic that does not allow paradoxes like this to just slip by. There are no excuses in a system of truth. It's either true or false, not in between. Obviously, it's easy to formulate a question that evades truth or which contains a false hypothesis, or which combines logical clauses in a false manner, making the correct answer neither true nor false.
But here, the syllogism was quite simply put:
(a) Believers say God is good, just, loving and perfect in all respects;
(b) The Bible says God said he would curse the unborn children of evil-doers;
(c) Children are every day born with grotesque birth defects;
(d) Believers must therefore conclude (as you did) that these done to "teach them a lesson"
(e) Therefore God is evil, unjust and more seriously flawed than most evil-doers, contradicting (a)
Therefore religion is a false belief.
More simply:
(a) Believers believe that God is perfect
(b) God said he is jealous
(c) Therefore God is not perfect
(d) Therefore belief in God is a false belief
Truth in religion is a slippery slope. It's problematic. You have to draw back to the most precise syllogism to establish what you mean. Otherwise, at some point, it becomes (as Al Frankin might say) "a big fat lie".
AiD,
Are we to understand that you see children with birth defects as cursed?
jan.
Are we to understand that you see children with birth defects as cursed?
jan.
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
Sorry but I'm not in the habit of bowing to anyone, least of an invisible magical daddy who lives in the sky. Not to worry though. I WILL pray to my trash can tonight and expect the same results. lol!