OMG!
Stigmata: pierced hands & feet, crown of thorns and the spear wound!
It must be true.
Proof God Exists
- Thread starter Dewy
- Start date
Stigmata: pierced hands & feet, crown of thorns and the spear wound!
It must be true.
Thoreau
Valued Senior Member
Proof confirmed by God . . . easier done than said!
As this is a science forum, is it not more appropriate to ask, why it is not possible for a proof of God to exist that meets all the Enlightenment criteria of direct cause and effect, evidence based experience? Why do the religious talk of omnipotence and omniscience if their God is not prepared to offer a demonstration of those powers? It may simply be that the reason religious tradition has been unable to offer such a demonstration is that they have nothing to do with the reality they claim?
Because that 'demonstration' may now exist? But not coming from within any existing religious tradition, it could mean big problems or them. In fact this new, fully demonstrable proof may now exist for the very purpose of exposing the vacuous intellectual nature of theological discourse, upon which all Christian tradition is built.
This," the first wholly new interpretation for two thousand years of the moral teachings of Christ is radically different from anything else we know of from history, this new 'claim' is predicated upon a precise and predefined experience, a direct individual intervention into the natural world by omnipotent power to confirm divine will, command and covenant, "correcting human nature by a change in natural law, altering biology, consciousness and human ethical perception beyond all natural evolutionary boundaries."
"If confirmed and there appears a growing concerted effort to test and authenticate this material, this will represent a paradigm change in the nature of faith and in the moral and intellectual potential of human nature itself;* untangling the greatest* questions of human existence: sustainability, consciousness, meaning, suffering, free will, conflict and evil, while at the same time addressing the most profound problems of our age."
For those who want a proof, it doesn't get much more profound than this. I'm testing it now myself. Heady stuff for those who can get their head around it? I haven't posted enough to provide a link, but anyone interested can Google: The Final Freedoms to find more info.
As this is a science forum, is it not more appropriate to ask, why it is not possible for a proof of God to exist that meets all the Enlightenment criteria of direct cause and effect, evidence based experience? Why do the religious talk of omnipotence and omniscience if their God is not prepared to offer a demonstration of those powers? It may simply be that the reason religious tradition has been unable to offer such a demonstration is that they have nothing to do with the reality they claim?
Because that 'demonstration' may now exist? But not coming from within any existing religious tradition, it could mean big problems or them. In fact this new, fully demonstrable proof may now exist for the very purpose of exposing the vacuous intellectual nature of theological discourse, upon which all Christian tradition is built.
This," the first wholly new interpretation for two thousand years of the moral teachings of Christ is radically different from anything else we know of from history, this new 'claim' is predicated upon a precise and predefined experience, a direct individual intervention into the natural world by omnipotent power to confirm divine will, command and covenant, "correcting human nature by a change in natural law, altering biology, consciousness and human ethical perception beyond all natural evolutionary boundaries."
"If confirmed and there appears a growing concerted effort to test and authenticate this material, this will represent a paradigm change in the nature of faith and in the moral and intellectual potential of human nature itself;* untangling the greatest* questions of human existence: sustainability, consciousness, meaning, suffering, free will, conflict and evil, while at the same time addressing the most profound problems of our age."
For those who want a proof, it doesn't get much more profound than this. I'm testing it now myself. Heady stuff for those who can get their head around it? I haven't posted enough to provide a link, but anyone interested can Google: The Final Freedoms to find more info.
I wasn't going to come back to this thread, but I feel a need to clarify some of my remarks, so I must swallow my pride and post again.
It is not the body signals which "prove" God's existence to anyone; the Holy Spirit within us, which comes through the prayer of faith, is what does that. I'm sorry for suggesting otherwise--I was mistaken, and I was so caught up in the idea of converting people through outward signs like the body signals that I misspoke. Only the Spirit can truly convert us to the truth.
It is not the body signals which "prove" God's existence to anyone; the Holy Spirit within us, which comes through the prayer of faith, is what does that. I'm sorry for suggesting otherwise--I was mistaken, and I was so caught up in the idea of converting people through outward signs like the body signals that I misspoke. Only the Spirit can truly convert us to the truth.
Well, that one just busted my bullshit detector. You were doing a reasonable job up to this point. Let this be a lesson for next time
Blah blah blah. I perused a significant portion of that document and I really don't see anything truly unique in it. At most it is a recipe for confirmation bias.
now that is correct..
welcome back..
this is just my opinion..(and partly why i am here)
but it is through Scrutiny that we can strengthen our faith,
those that cannot handle a little scrutiny, has weak faith.
Test all things and hold on to what is good.
Amen.
I read that already . What you got to hide ? It is not like I am asking you to pray in public . You changed your stance and stated that you did yet you don't want to take ownership of you new stance ? O.K. what ever Good for you ! Keep it to your self then
Mind Over Matter
Registered Senior Member
If there is no God and no continuity of the soul, what point is there to life at all?
What's the point of a star if it's eventually going to explode? We all play our roles as an expression of nature, and in an infinite and possibly eternal (or cyclical) universe, which may very well be one of an infinite number of other universes, there's no particular reason that an entity that you will identify as yourself won't emerge again. In fact according to some interpretations of the available data, it's inevitable.
In the end however, I am content with existing in a state of reverence regarding the mystery of it all. I feel that I am doing justice to the expression that is me simply by embracing exactly what it is that I am, and seeking to enhance my knowledge and appreciation of the wonder from which I emerged. It's an enriching endeavour, complete with religious-like experiences (in the sense that someone like Einstein would characterize them as such), and this is true in spite of the fact that I am more aware of the fundamental philosophical questions of existence than most.
And that is the difference between you and me. I'm an atheist who is not a nihilist, but you are a nihilist who invoked a god so the world could be flat again.
You are the only one here posing this question.
The fact is that many people, even though they do not specifically believe in God, the soul and the continuity of the soul, still find much meaning to life.
Often, they find meaning in having a good job, raising a family, art, etc.
For some of those people who even though they do not specifically believe in God, the soul and the continuity of the soul, but still find much meaning to life, persistently questioning about God, the soul and the continuity of the soul (and many other things) is what they consider their meaning of life.
I myself could easily say that I was born to think about God and related topics - that this is the purpose of my life.
thats funny, because the bible does not say to pray in public..
Mind Over Matter
Registered Senior Member
Signal,
Your statement, in order to function correctly as an objective truth, would require life to have an objective value. Otherwise it is a subjective and meaningless statement; a point to "living" is as meaningless as it is objectively insignificant in the absence of purpose. Life just is and has no value. You are merely a reorganization of energy. Your thoughts are merely the product of atomic processes. Those processes merely expressed a subjective desire, and not an objective truth.
Your statement, in order to function correctly as an objective truth, would require life to have an objective value. Otherwise it is a subjective and meaningless statement; a point to "living" is as meaningless as it is objectively insignificant in the absence of purpose. Life just is and has no value. You are merely a reorganization of energy. Your thoughts are merely the product of atomic processes. Those processes merely expressed a subjective desire, and not an objective truth.
Yeah, so... what's your point?
You are trying to put thoughts into my head and words into my mouth.
Please refrain from that.
Big Chiller
Registered Senior Member
Let me bring up a tangential point, you don't have a consistent answer for why you care for someone or why you see a relationship or life as meaningful if you do.
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kx000
Valued Senior Member
That there is no point to life with no God, and we should all be running around naked having orgies all over the place. If God isn't real someone like me would easily conquer the world.